Just listened to the ww file and find it fairly distorted. Don't know if the source was equally distorted. I think it might help differentiate opamps more easily if there were less baseline distortion. The cymbals sound somewhere between real cymbals and early drum synth cymbals, such as TS-808, etc.
Also, listened tried listening to some of the files, including ww, on some Sennheiser HD 600 headphones. Harder to hear differences than on the NS-10s. Don't know why. They were very highly rated headphones years ago and are still considered pretty good, but Sennheiser makes what are probably some better ones now. Hope this doesn't mean I need new cans too.
However, can't rule out that the speakers are doing something to accentuate small differences.
And, I would still say the differences seem small to me most of the time. Being fresh seems to help a lot. Being old enough to have some hearing loss absolutely makes it harder, IMO.
Also, listened tried listening to some of the files, including ww, on some Sennheiser HD 600 headphones. Harder to hear differences than on the NS-10s. Don't know why. They were very highly rated headphones years ago and are still considered pretty good, but Sennheiser makes what are probably some better ones now. Hope this doesn't mean I need new cans too.
However, can't rule out that the speakers are doing something to accentuate small differences.
And, I would still say the differences seem small to me most of the time. Being fresh seems to help a lot. Being old enough to have some hearing loss absolutely makes it harder, IMO.
Not sure which articles you are referring to. The one saying audible differences between DAC-1 and DAC-2 are mostly due to better handling of intersample overs is still there.
Bill, now I get why your reference to the Tiefenbrun family completely missed the target. The record is Steely Dan, Everything Must Go. The song is the Last Mall. A legend. Praised for it's sound.. you can get the Dvd version off Amazon even right now, if You wish. 150 Euro or equivalent pounds.. i suppose Pavel has it..
It still not change my opinion about the perceived sound quality from these tests..
It still not change my opinion about the perceived sound quality from these tests..
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Mark, interesting observations. The "ww" file is the original file, source file. Music was correctly identified by Joseph K.
Joseph K, yes I have the disc. I bought it in 2004.
Okay, I accept that it is the disk. Thank you. They issued a somewhat distorted sounding release then. Not unusual, especially for rock and pop. That's part of what I wanted to know.
My concern here is that we are trying to listen to pretty small levels of distortion by using equipment that probably has even more distortion. Not an easy task, but not quite impossible either, it seems. At least, maybe for some opamps.
So, if that is the source file itself, and we don't have a loopback file of your D-A-D, then should we conclude that the additional distortion in the lowest distortion files is primarily coming from your D-A-D chain, and not the best opamps?
My concern here is that we are trying to listen to pretty small levels of distortion by using equipment that probably has even more distortion. Not an easy task, but not quite impossible either, it seems. At least, maybe for some opamps.
So, if that is the source file itself, and we don't have a loopback file of your D-A-D, then should we conclude that the additional distortion in the lowest distortion files is primarily coming from your D-A-D chain, and not the best opamps?
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By way of comparison, an mp3 from a 24/96 recording made by a friend using his Lynx-2 card has much more detail and much less distortion than the DVD file used in the op amp test:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/as4g5hli7um8m58/1. Wooden Faces.mp3?dl=0
Of course, that band is not that great, but you can hear the cymbals clearly.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/as4g5hli7um8m58/1. Wooden Faces.mp3?dl=0
Of course, that band is not that great, but you can hear the cymbals clearly.
Hi Karl, do you mean to assign part types to file names in the poll image? Maybe, but I have also edited the 1st post of the thread, with the disclosure of the part types.
Regarding the newly posted "ww" file, when anyone will be trying it, I am warning against the possible bias, for the reason that it is now known it is a source file. This bias is inevitable and no one of us is completely immune against this. For the same reason I was a bit bluffing yesterday when I said that it was recorded through another IC part. If I did not do that, we would read the stories like "Oh, this one is clearly the best" etc. So from now on, not so many audiophile stories, please, but valid ABX results. We do not have a single one so far, even between 4562 x 1458, so now there is a chance to compare with the original. Once again, only supported claims, please.
It might be nice to edit the image, but there is absolutely no pressure. Thank you!
Looking forward your observations re ww
Well......
I'm trying all again but this time around as 48k WAV as you suggested earlier. The first thing is that the defining difference I said I heard between the OPA2134 and all others doesn't seem to be so definable now.
When I listened to the MP3 version I was so so sure on that difference and mentioned it to yourself that I thought ss and vv were the worst. I can't just pick up on that now. Odd.
I've even gone back to the MP3 version and again, I'm not hearing that in the same way.
As to ww. Well on both MP3 and WAV I like to think I hear a difference between it and the 1458. Specifically on the cymbol hit in the right channel on the vocal opening line 'attention all shoppers and on the word shoppers.
I'm going to do one single Foobar run of ww versus tt and see what happens.
I'm trying all again but this time around as 48k WAV as you suggested earlier. The first thing is that the defining difference I said I heard between the OPA2134 and all others doesn't seem to be so definable now.
When I listened to the MP3 version I was so so sure on that difference and mentioned it to yourself that I thought ss and vv were the worst. I can't just pick up on that now. Odd.
I've even gone back to the MP3 version and again, I'm not hearing that in the same way.
As to ww. Well on both MP3 and WAV I like to think I hear a difference between it and the 1458. Specifically on the cymbol hit in the right channel on the vocal opening line 'attention all shoppers and on the word shoppers.
I'm going to do one single Foobar run of ww versus tt and see what happens.
Karl, it may be the result of the lossy Lame mp3 encoder. The files do not have exactly same sample timing (DAC and ADC were independent this time and relative shifts between the files up to 1 sample period do exist, 1 sample is 10.4us) so the lame result is questionable.
In my experience, the worse the system (both HW and data), the bigger sound difference between various almost same files. Same with those opamps under test. Put them into the noisy unshielded environment and you may get provable differences.
What are we to do ? Take up golf perhaps
It only gets worse. MP3 version.
Better message then if you got 10/10 from mp3
Message 1: - opamps do not make a difference in case that they work within their specs limits and when they do not add excessive noise and distortion (1458 would do it for gain 100x, but not for gain 1x), and also they must be shielded from external EMI and RC filtered at the input.
Message 2: - D/A -- A/D 24/bit chain does not necessarily adds "coloration" to the original sound file. At least we have no provable result or supported claim.
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