This is my first post so please forgive me if I have asked in the wrong forum!
I am looking for sources for making up runs of Digital COAX Cables to try between my DAC and and CDP Transport. I am using Belden which is good,but I want to see if I can come up with a better one.
My Transport is a Phillips CD-80 and a Bolder Modified ART DAC so there might be a synergy issue there to overcome.
PENN Cable or something like that was a suggestion that can be found at Allied. Are there any others?
TIA ,NS
I am looking for sources for making up runs of Digital COAX Cables to try between my DAC and and CDP Transport. I am using Belden which is good,but I want to see if I can come up with a better one.
My Transport is a Phillips CD-80 and a Bolder Modified ART DAC so there might be a synergy issue there to overcome.
PENN Cable or something like that was a suggestion that can be found at Allied. Are there any others?
TIA ,NS
I bought the Basic Bolder Digital Cable from Bolder.
I have made some DIY Silver Cables and have 47Labs OTA Cable for the rest of my system. I was wondering if there were any Digital Cables out there that you could make up that might compete with so called Ultra Expensive SOTA Digital Cables.
I have also tried Canare,but it did not work well in my system. To recessed for my taste and had a veiling over vocal info.
I see JPS has Digital Cable and I will look around to see if anyone elsr supplies Digital Cable that I can try. I am sure that Belden is not the last word in Digital Cables and was looking for alternatives.
It is not that I am disatisfied with it,but It might just be the weakest link in cabling in my system at the moment.
The Belden was also Cryo treated.
Thanks for reading my post!
I have made some DIY Silver Cables and have 47Labs OTA Cable for the rest of my system. I was wondering if there were any Digital Cables out there that you could make up that might compete with so called Ultra Expensive SOTA Digital Cables.
I have also tried Canare,but it did not work well in my system. To recessed for my taste and had a veiling over vocal info.
I see JPS has Digital Cable and I will look around to see if anyone elsr supplies Digital Cable that I can try. I am sure that Belden is not the last word in Digital Cables and was looking for alternatives.
It is not that I am disatisfied with it,but It might just be the weakest link in cabling in my system at the moment.
The Belden was also Cryo treated.
Thanks for reading my post!
Where to start..........
Thought that you were making your own cables, not buying a lousy commercial product.
Most people use RCA connectors. Wrong. Use BNC.
The impedance of the cable and the connector must match each other, and also the impedance of both the TX and RX ends. If any are wrong......and most all of the above are on most sytems, it won't sound good. Yes, it will work, but if you want it to sound really good......(and who doesn't) then it has to be done right.
So.....you need a decent cable, good connectors.......which automatically rules out Canare as they are liars and/or idiots......at all 4 points.
As for the CD-80..........yuk...........lousy mystery coax of inderterminate impedance.....going from an IDC near the front to another at the rear....and then into the worst transformer that I have ever seen. All that has to go. Real 75 ohm coax, good transformer, like a Schott, and proper drive impedance. For starters.
Jocko
Thought that you were making your own cables, not buying a lousy commercial product.
Most people use RCA connectors. Wrong. Use BNC.
The impedance of the cable and the connector must match each other, and also the impedance of both the TX and RX ends. If any are wrong......and most all of the above are on most sytems, it won't sound good. Yes, it will work, but if you want it to sound really good......(and who doesn't) then it has to be done right.
So.....you need a decent cable, good connectors.......which automatically rules out Canare as they are liars and/or idiots......at all 4 points.
As for the CD-80..........yuk...........lousy mystery coax of inderterminate impedance.....going from an IDC near the front to another at the rear....and then into the worst transformer that I have ever seen. All that has to go. Real 75 ohm coax, good transformer, like a Schott, and proper drive impedance. For starters.
Jocko
"So.....you need a decent cable, good connectors.......which automatically rules out Canare as they are liars and/or idiots......at all 4 points."
I have found that certain wires work better in one place in my system then another.
Not making up Digital Cable from scratch BTW. I would buy the cable and put my own connectors on.
Canare was not great in my system. Worked between amp-Passive ,but as a Digital Cable Belden was better.
Canare will admit their RCAs are really not true 75ohm connectors BTW.
I changed the BNC connectors on my ART DIO because their are alot more cables made with RCAs than BNC.
Wil write more later as I have to go!
I have found that certain wires work better in one place in my system then another.
Not making up Digital Cable from scratch BTW. I would buy the cable and put my own connectors on.
Canare was not great in my system. Worked between amp-Passive ,but as a Digital Cable Belden was better.
Canare will admit their RCAs are really not true 75ohm connectors BTW.
I changed the BNC connectors on my ART DIO because their are alot more cables made with RCAs than BNC.
Wil write more later as I have to go!
On Canare COAX--It had severe Rolled Off Highs used between the CDP and DAC or Between the DAC to to Passive used as regular IC's.
It worked somewhat better then between the Passive to Amp ,but still had rolled-off'd Highs.
The best IC's I have used are DIY Silver IC's and 47Labs OTA Cable.
I will look to see what other Digital Cables are out there which might be better than Belden to try.
Like I stated I have nothing against Belden ,but I would like to see or hear if I can get better.
It will take a few different manfactures to try,but I will see whoo besides Belden produces Digital Cables.
Thanks for the info!
It worked somewhat better then between the Passive to Amp ,but still had rolled-off'd Highs.
The best IC's I have used are DIY Silver IC's and 47Labs OTA Cable.
I will look to see what other Digital Cables are out there which might be better than Belden to try.
Like I stated I have nothing against Belden ,but I would like to see or hear if I can get better.
It will take a few different manfactures to try,but I will see whoo besides Belden produces Digital Cables.
Thanks for the info!
It is not a "digital cable"......
It is a 75 ohm coax.
You can not accurately judge how good a cable is in just one system. As most TX/RX pairs have so much reflection problems, it is possible to find a combination that sounds good together, but rotten most everywhere else.
When the reflections are done away with, you will find that cables all sound about the same.
A certain famous "modifier" type of manufacturer found that a 93 ohm coax.......with an obtuse ham radio connector worked best on his porducts.
Because he was an idiot and had the output impedance of his transport all wrong.
Jocko
It is a 75 ohm coax.
You can not accurately judge how good a cable is in just one system. As most TX/RX pairs have so much reflection problems, it is possible to find a combination that sounds good together, but rotten most everywhere else.
When the reflections are done away with, you will find that cables all sound about the same.
A certain famous "modifier" type of manufacturer found that a 93 ohm coax.......with an obtuse ham radio connector worked best on his porducts.
Because he was an idiot and had the output impedance of his transport all wrong.
Jocko
I dunno...........
I could measure one if I had one. Never used that flavour of cable.
But......if there are reflections.....and there are most likely some.....well, see my previous post.
And if you ask Phred, he will tell you that cables are directional. There is something to give you nightmares.
Jocko
I could measure one if I had one. Never used that flavour of cable.
But......if there are reflections.....and there are most likely some.....well, see my previous post.
And if you ask Phred, he will tell you that cables are directional. There is something to give you nightmares.
Jocko
Maybe? West Penn/CDT
CDT have a lot of subsidiariess, Montrose/CDT use a foamed FEP called Cell-TEC that looks good on paper
The following was taken from Cell-Tec.pdf
"The Cell-Tec process provides enhanced crush
resistance for better downstream processability and
more uniform electrical characteristics, allowing the
makeup of multi-coaxial and multi-pair cables, not
practical with more delicate insulations. Traditional
expanded fluoropolymer insulations, unlike Cell-
Tec, have one significant drawback: large air voids
next to the conductor surface. While delivering fast
signal speeds, these air voids are unpredictable at
best, causing eccentricity, variation in dielectric
constant and a host of transmission problems.
The dielectric constant of Cell-Tec is one of the
lowest in existence today, which affects not only the
electrical parameters of a cable but also the overall
size. "
A suitable cable using Cell-Tec is 8AWG, 75OHM, Cell-Tec Coax
might be worth trying to get a sample?
Regards
James
TVI--Thanks I will look into their COAX. Funny that there are not many DIY COAX that you can choose from out there unless you buy from a commercial Co..
I just want to try something other than Belden! Canare and Belden seemed like the only sources out there.I have been to 3 BB's with not many suggestions.
Will be searching in the meantime also.
Looking at the spec sheet I will compare it to wheat Beldens says if I can findout what was used.
This stuff is Silver Plated Copper and the I like the small conductor size.
The company is not to far from where I live also.
Thx!
I just want to try something other than Belden! Canare and Belden seemed like the only sources out there.I have been to 3 BB's with not many suggestions.
Will be searching in the meantime also.
Looking at the spec sheet I will compare it to wheat Beldens says if I can findout what was used.
This stuff is Silver Plated Copper and the I like the small conductor size.
The company is not to far from where I live also.
Thx!
NEAR_SOTA said:
I've had good luck with two different 75 ohm coax cables. Like Jocko, I make sure that the transport and dac are properly terminated and I only use 75 ohm BNC connectors. Even using these precautions, I find that different cables do better with different transports, although I can't think of a reason why this should be so.
The two cables that I like are RG-187 and Canare L-5CFB. The RG-187 is a miniature coax using teflon dielectric and silver plated copper. The Canare is heftier in size, similar to RG-59.
My favorite connectors are from Trompeter.
---Gary
I have a few runs of Canare LV77S which did not work well in my system. I have tried it for the application I need it for also.
The best place I had luck was between Passive Controller and Amp.but it still had a signature of rolled off highs compared to Pure Silver I use.
There is a new wire designation for LV77S which I forgot what it is! It might be the same as what you have metioned. I have them terminated with their True 75 ohm RCAs which did not seem to help.
I do not think I will switch back to BNC for the simple reason that their are more choices given the fact that RCAs are used the most. I think the DAC was found to work better with Eichmanns than BNC terminations which were used beforehand. I would have check on this ,but that is what I believe was said.
The best place I had luck was between Passive Controller and Amp.but it still had a signature of rolled off highs compared to Pure Silver I use.
There is a new wire designation for LV77S which I forgot what it is! It might be the same as what you have metioned. I have them terminated with their True 75 ohm RCAs which did not seem to help.
I do not think I will switch back to BNC for the simple reason that their are more choices given the fact that RCAs are used the most. I think the DAC was found to work better with Eichmanns than BNC terminations which were used beforehand. I would have check on this ,but that is what I believe was said.
Re: Re: DIY COAXIAL Cable besides Belden?
Even using these precautions, I find that different cables do better with different transports, although I can't think of a reason why this should be so.
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This is the substance of my earlier post. One can go to great lengths to optimise everything and this just exposes the different sounds of different transports. No point in spending too much to reclock, relock, and impedance match a cheap transport.
The top transports do sound best.
Even using these precautions, I find that different cables do better with different transports, although I can't think of a reason why this should be so.
-----------------------------------------------------
This is the substance of my earlier post. One can go to great lengths to optimise everything and this just exposes the different sounds of different transports. No point in spending too much to reclock, relock, and impedance match a cheap transport.
The top transports do sound best.
Well Synergy is everything! I guess seeing that I am using an ART DAC I would need to find the Magic ART DAC\CDP Transport Combo ,then make the choice of Cable according to that.
Or am I missing the point?
I will not be sacrificeing my Speakers I know that!LOL
What do you consider the Best Transport.If you have already listed it I shall look.
Thanks!
Or am I missing the point?
I will not be sacrificeing my Speakers I know that!LOL
What do you consider the Best Transport.If you have already listed it I shall look.
Thanks!
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