Go Back   Home > Forums > >

Equipment & Tools From test equipment to hand tools

ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applications
ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applications
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 18th February 2021, 08:20 AM   #461
altor is offline altor  Israel
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Europe-Asia
Hi Doug, 2nd version was almost done as a prototype 2 years ago, but because of a other projects, we did not finished the full firmware tests. There a a lot of features and a lot of various operation modes combinations, which equired a lot of time to test.

BTW, I got many questions this year bout it.
(Why this year? Why not 0.5y/1y or 1.5y ago? I don't know! Covid influence? ).
So maybe I will force it now.
__________________
Regards, Alex
www.altor.co
  Reply With Quote
Old 18th February 2021, 12:38 PM   #462
douggoldberg is offline douggoldberg  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Alex I'd purchase one as soon as they are available. I'd love a remote (USB or ethernet) interface too...
  Reply With Quote
Old 18th February 2021, 02:31 PM   #463
altor is offline altor  Israel
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Europe-Asia
I'll drop you a message.

Ethernet is too complicated, USB exists (USB2COM, isolated).
__________________
Regards, Alex
www.altor.co
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2021, 04:00 PM   #464
syn08 is offline syn08  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
syn08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto
Can somebody tell from their own experience how much current is the ES9038PRO taking from:

+1.2V Analog (VDD_L, VDD_R)
+3.3V Analog Reference (AVCC_L, AVCC_R)
+1.2V Digital Core (DVDD)
+3.3V Digital I/O (AVDD)
+3.3V Oscillator (VCCA)

I am confused by the numbers in the data sheet (attached).

- Are these per channel (L/R) or the sum of currents on both channels?
- Why are VDD_L, VDD_R and DVDD collapsed under the same value, are they assuming one will use the 1.2V supply to feed both the Analog and Digital Core sections.

I read that the current value scale up (as expected) with the clock frequency, @100MHz and 768KHz is almost double the values @40MHz and 48KHz, anybody has any current consumption measurements @100MHz?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg currents.jpg (648.6 KB, 249 views)
  Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2021, 11:29 AM   #465
Markw4 is offline Markw4  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: California
ES9038PRO eval board appears to power DVDD, VDD_L, VDD_R all from the same regulator.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th March 2021, 03:53 PM   #466
andrea_mori is offline andrea_mori  Italy
diyAudio Member
 
andrea_mori's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Italy
ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applications
Quote:
Originally Posted by syn08 View Post
Not sure about audibility, but certainly the LF phase noise doesnít contribute much to the jitter. Thatís because the jitter is proportional to the square root of twice the phase noise integral, from zero to 2*fo. As such, usually the LF part of the phase noise area has a rather small contribution, in particular for frequencies fo in the tens of MHz, since the phase noise gets flat usually in the tens of KHz.
Maybe my instrument is broken?
Or I'm misunderstanding?
Attached Images
File Type: png Crystek_24576_vs_Pierce_24576_Jitter_comparison.png (72.2 KB, 177 views)
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th March 2021, 04:16 PM   #467
chris719 is offline chris719  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Connecticut
ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applications
If you start at 0.1 Hz and stop integrating at 100 kHz, sure. Perhaps you should work on improving your phase noise above 100 Hz rather than digging for a post you can score a point against.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th March 2021, 04:25 PM   #468
1audio is offline 1audio  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SF Bay Area
ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applications
You are both right. its all in how you measure jitter. And that can be a rabbithole since the connection between the different ways of looking at jitter : How to Measure Jitter << Microsemi. how those affect different signals in the output of a DAC (or input from an ADC) and how audible those effects are is still up for grabs. The only formal research I have seen suggests that this is all well under any audible threshold at least per AES: https://www.aes.org/tmpFiles/aessc/2...2id-2020-i.pdf

I'm always for making something better if you know how and it doesn't bring too many problems. But there are absurd limits (Sapphire whispering gallery source? High-power solid-state sapphire whispering gallery mode maser - PubMed). And be careful of looking at a single issue when there could be other related aspects that affect what you are pursuing.
__________________
Demian Martin
Product Design Services
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th March 2021, 04:41 PM   #469
andrea_mori is offline andrea_mori  Italy
diyAudio Member
 
andrea_mori's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Italy
ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applications
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris719 View Post
If you start at 0.1 Hz and stop integrating at 100 kHz, sure. Perhaps you should work on improving your phase noise above 100 Hz rather than digging for a post you can score a point against.
You are wrong, the integration bandwidth starts at 10 Hz (the dashed red line).

So according to your science what would be the correct integration bandwidth to calculate the jitter?
12kHz to 100MHz suitable for telecommunication?

However you can also shift the integration bandwidth away from the carrier, the jitter will always be dominated by the phase noise closest to the carrier and not by the "flat" noise floor.
Try using a phase noise to jitter converter.

Lastly, the Pierce oscillator is followed by a couple of frequency doublers, so the noise floor inevitably increases.
Although the jitter is almost one order of magnitude better.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th March 2021, 04:48 PM   #470
andrea_mori is offline andrea_mori  Italy
diyAudio Member
 
andrea_mori's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Italy
ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applications
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1audio View Post
You are both right. its all in how you measure jitter. And that can be a rabbithole since the connection between the different ways of looking at jitter : How to Measure Jitter << Microsemi. how those affect different signals in the output of a DAC (or input from an ADC) and how audible those effects are is still up for grabs. The only formal research I have seen suggests that this is all well under any audible threshold at least per AES: https://www.aes.org/tmpFiles/aessc/2...2id-2020-i.pdf

I'm always for making something better if you know how and it doesn't bring too many problems. But there are absurd limits (Sapphire whispering gallery source? High-power solid-state sapphire whispering gallery mode maser - PubMed). And be careful of looking at a single issue when there could be other related aspects that affect what you are pursuing.
Demian, I have not argued about the audible threshold of jitter, I got tired of this battle.

I merely wrote "my instrument is broken" if "usually the LF part of the phase noise area has a rather small contribution", because my instrument measures the opposite.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


ADCs and DACs for audio instrumentation applicationsHide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FS: Digital Audio ICs - ADCs, DACs, SRCs, other stuff.. len_scanlan Swap Meet 0 29th December 2011 08:40 AM
Fundamental Questions: ADCs, DACs, I2S rsbonini Construction Tips 10 5th August 2011 09:40 PM
M-Audio Delta-44 and instrumentation under Linux suzyj Digital Source 8 27th July 2007 03:43 PM
Audio DACs, Instrumentation DACs. Brian Guralnick Digital Source 10 3rd November 2002 04:56 PM
DSD ADCs and DACs Brett Digital Source 8 14th October 2002 08:59 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:48 AM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 15.00%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2021 diyAudio
Wiki