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Building the ultimate NOS DAC using TDA1541A
Building the ultimate NOS DAC using TDA1541A
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Old 13th March 2015, 02:37 AM   #5381
gabdx is offline gabdx  Canada
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Sorry for off topic, but what interested me is that you are trying with great efforts to get rid of pcb micro-noises and such things that certainly exist in capacitors receiving AC.

Oil is very impracticalfor you pcb dac because I don't think it will help with vibrations. And it will stop the air flow and provide thermal isolation for your components which you agree should be avoided.

Hey maxlorenz, waxes could be good if they transfer heat and are rigid enough and melting point is way over the components temperature. It could be a research subject. Both waxes and most epoxy can be removed with re-heating and special solvents but it is not an interesting job.

for epoxy a simple search led me to great products:

you should read that website to learn better than my poor english allows Epoxy Resin Varnishes | Encapsulants for Transformers | Electronic Sensor Encapsulant | Epoxy Resin Potting Compound | Transformer Potting | Epic Resins - Manufacturer of Epoxy Resins and Polyurethane Compounds

epoxy able industrial applications machinery for the ambitious diy audiophile :
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other benefits of encapsulation : Meter Mix Dispense Systems for Adhesives and Sealants by Sealant Equipment & Engineering
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Old 13th March 2015, 03:14 AM   #5382
maxlorenz is offline maxlorenz  Chile
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Very interesting dear Gabdx.

There are a lot of waxes, it apears, some with very high melting point.

Microcrystalline Wax:
Mainly branched alkanes
Amorphous
Malleable
Opaque
Higher melting (54 to 95║C)
Adhesive
Soft
White to Colored
Odorless
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Old 13th March 2015, 03:26 AM   #5383
gabdx is offline gabdx  Canada
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Apply higher melting waxes with heat gun could yield audible benefits... Seekers will find !
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Last edited by gabdx; 13th March 2015 at 03:30 AM.
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Old 13th March 2015, 03:58 AM   #5384
maxlorenz is offline maxlorenz  Chile
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Merci bien.

Amicalement.
M.
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Old 13th March 2015, 02:00 PM   #5385
Eldam is offline Eldam  France
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Moi je dis qu'un canadien qui ne parle pas anglais n'est pas vraiment un canadien ! Et qu'un chilien qui parle espagnole n'est pas vraiment espagnole ! Mais un franšais comme bibi qui parle anglais comme une vache espagnole, c'est bien un franšais ! Lol !
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Old 15th March 2015, 05:27 AM   #5386
kazap is offline kazap  Australia
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If anyone is keen to experiment with micro-dampening strategies for components on PCB's may I suggest:

1. use mineral oil as its
  • cheap,
  • easily available,
  • reversible,
  • able to cool via passive convection flow like air
  • arguably five times better for convection cooling then air so may moderate local hot spots eg the actual TDA1541a chip itself
  • already used in transformer cooling and computer cooling (http://www.pugetsystems.com/submerged.php)
  • over 600 times denser then air so should dampen micro-resonance accelerations by over 600 times compared to air
  • good dielectric at 2.3

2. Place the PCB in the bottom of a moulded alloy case with connectors on the top of the rear side above the oil level to prevent direct leaks and so the connectors prevent oil wicking up the cables. The aluminium box will allow passive cooling via air convection and by radiation from the external surface
Click the image to open in full size.

3. Listen with a group and measure using air first and then poor in the oil while its still playing and listen for any changes and re-measure

Last edited by kazap; 15th March 2015 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 15th March 2015, 10:03 AM   #5387
QSerraTico_Tico is offline QSerraTico_Tico  Europe
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Yeah the Wadia 27 DAC has a dipstick.
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Old 15th March 2015, 12:29 PM   #5388
maxlorenz is offline maxlorenz  Chile
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kazap View Post
If anyone is keen to experiment with micro-dampening strategies for components on PCB's may I suggest:

1. use mineral oil as its
  • cheap,
  • easily available,
  • reversible,
  • able to cool via passive convection flow like air
  • arguably five times better for convection cooling then air so may moderate local hot spots eg the actual TDA1541a chip itself
  • already used in transformer cooling and computer cooling (Custom PC; Mineral Oil Submerged Computer)
  • over 600 times denser then air so should dampen micro-resonance accelerations by over 600 times compared to air
  • good dielectric at 2.3

2. Place the PCB in the bottom of a moulded alloy case with connectors on the top of the rear side above the oil level to prevent direct leaks and so the connectors prevent oil wicking up the cables. The aluminium box will allow passive cooling via air convection and by radiation from the external surface
Click the image to open in full size.

3. Listen with a group and measure using air first and then poor in the oil while its still playing and listen for any changes and re-measure
Cool.

Thanks.
First I have to get a definitive version of my DAC.

M.
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Old 15th March 2015, 11:23 PM   #5389
gabdx is offline gabdx  Canada
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Wheat flour is 2x mineral oil thermal conductivity, for a 'tasty' sound. In an enclosed recipient the heat transfer might even be less than letting the components in free circulating air. I remember seeing that computer in the oil with the difference that a pump was circulating the oil to a radiator.

Even better is plasticine, 4x conduction of oil, it is easy to apply by warming it up first. I would fear for oil spills or catching on fire...

electronic grade Epoxy is rated 2.16 W/mK and mineral oil is 0.16 W/mk, air 0.02, Paraffin Wax 0.25 , wheat flour 0.45!
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Last edited by gabdx; 15th March 2015 at 11:28 PM.
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Old 16th March 2015, 12:07 AM   #5390
Alexandre is offline Alexandre
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Well you can┤t submerge a pot, for instance, in flour...
Mineral oil on the other hand might work, might help protect the pot from moisture and dust and keep the contact cleaner. I┤d like to test this.

Or maybe submerge the pot in contact cleaner!
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