Go Back   Home > Forums > >
Home Forums Rules Articles diyAudio Store Blogs Gallery Wiki Register Donations FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Digital Line Level DACs, Digital Crossovers, Equalizers, etc.

Philips Engineers
Philips Engineers
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 15th April 2018, 12:32 AM   #11
Alexandre is offline Alexandre
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Brazil
Quote:
Originally Posted by percival007 View Post
If this is the case, firstly a huge thank-you for the CD !!

Looking forward, hopefully to some excellent stories.
Yes, many thanks to the excellent engineers at Philips for their work.

They recently published a book on it (development of the CD), but it is expensive I think. There might be interesting info about the DACs as well (in said book).

Thanks,
-Alex

Last edited by Alexandre; 15th April 2018 at 12:34 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th April 2018, 12:40 AM   #12
Alexandre is offline Alexandre
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Brazil
This is the book:

Origins and Successors of the Compact Disc: Contributions of Philips to ... - J.B.H. Peek, J.W.M Bergmans, J. A. M. M. van Haaren, Frank Toolenaar, S.G. Stan

Last edited by Alexandre; 15th April 2018 at 12:42 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th April 2018, 06:45 AM   #13
diyralf is offline diyralf
diyAudio Member
 
diyralf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexandre View Post
Yes, many thanks to the excellent engineers at Philips for their work.


-Alex
Unfortunately, most will already rest in peace.
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2018, 08:02 AM   #14
percival007 is offline percival007  England
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexandre View Post
.....They recently published a book on it (development of the CD), but it is expensive I think. There might be interesting info about the DACs as well (in said book)...........
Thanks Alex for your constructive reply. 125.00 is the cheapest I found it on ebay

If they are still alive I doubt they're going to contribute here, now it's descended into a NOS Bashing thread !! That wasn't my intention and as one poster said, I wish I hadn't mentioned it now !

So Mods, feel free to close this thread.

P.
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2018, 12:28 PM   #15
kevinahcc20 is offline kevinahcc20  United States
diyAudio Member
 
kevinahcc20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Farmington Hills, MI USA
The Phillips CD development project was started in 1974 with the first demonstration in 1979 and commercial introduction in 1982. Usually an R&D project of this magnitude would be lead by senior engineers and scientists and staffed with fairly experienced people. So 44 years after project start you would expect that the surviving project leaders would be well into their 80s and the bulk of the staff would at least be early to late 70s, so it's not surprising they are scarce.
__________________
Kevin(ahcc20)...I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy!
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th April 2018, 10:06 AM   #16
Extreme_Boky is offline Extreme_Boky
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by billshurv View Post
I have to disagree with you on this. NOS is not the norm, it's a small and vocal cult who seem to think that getting back to the original waveform is not the way forwards and accept a crippled performance in return for some mystic magic.
In digital reproduction, getting back to that original waveform you brag about, so that it looks nice on an oscilloscope, completely ruins the listening pleasure... The original waveform does not exist in digital audio reproduction - it's a myth!

It disappeared forever, the moment the analog stream got sampled & encoded into digital. It cannot be reconstructed anymore. The harder one try, the worst the listening results.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th April 2018, 10:26 AM   #17
esgigt is offline esgigt  Netherlands
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Perhaps you can give some insight in the reasons why the original complex waveform can't be recreated, according to you? Or am I listening to different artists than recorded when playing back digital audio?
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th April 2018, 11:40 AM   #18
DF96 is online now DF96  England
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by percival007
But as the above poster said, have you listened to one? Measurements are not everything.
Agreed, but maths is everything. Filterless NOS (and weak filter NOS) cannot reproduce the original signal which left the anti-aliasing filter. We can argue why some people like the resultant sound (there are reasons why it might not be too bad), but it certainly does not attempt to reproduce the orginal sound.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreme_Boky
The original waveform does not exist in digital audio reproduction - it's a myth!

It disappeared forever, the moment the analog stream got sampled & encoded into digital. It cannot be reconstructed anymore. The harder one try, the worst the listening results.
Given a good enough filter you can reproduce the original waveform to an arbitrary degree of precision. That is the wonder of digital audio; it is sad that so many people lack the mathermatical understanding to appreciate this.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th April 2018, 11:44 AM   #19
diyralf is offline diyralf
diyAudio Member
 
diyralf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreme_Boky View Post
In digital reproduction, getting back to that original waveform you brag about, so that it looks nice on an oscilloscope, completely ruins the listening pleasure... The original waveform does not exist in digital audio reproduction - it's a myth!

It disappeared forever, the moment the analog stream got sampled & encoded into digital. It cannot be reconstructed anymore. The harder one try, the worst the listening results.
Non sense. The reconstructed signal corresponds exactly to the original. It has a maximum error of 1.5*10e-5. Nobody can hear a difference there. Not even a bat.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th April 2018, 12:27 PM   #20
starkeyg is offline starkeyg
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Sourhern MI
Hello,

Agree with "The reconstructed signal corresponds exactly to the original. It has a maximum error of 1.5*10e-5. Nobody can hear a difference there. Not even a bat."
Some have made a religion out of anything but digital. Doesn't matter if the latest implementations work great or not, it just can't be. You are not going to dissuade them in the least by logic or reason.
If the sound isn't like what they have decided is heaven, it is not right at all.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Philips EngineersHide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pre for Engineers Amp Junior69 Tubes / Valves 15 24th September 2017 12:44 PM
UK Engineers Amp (my first project) steve8428 Tubes / Valves 63 4th February 2017 05:21 PM
How many engineers . . . . . . . . . Hearinspace The Lounge 15 5th November 2016 10:32 PM
Mix engineers not doing their job!! Richard Ellis Multi-Way 35 28th March 2009 02:14 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 08:58 AM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 15.00%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2018 diyAudio
Wiki