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BluWave USB-to-SPDIF bridge, "a miniature beauty"
BluWave USB-to-SPDIF bridge, "a miniature beauty"
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Old 15th April 2018, 01:34 PM   #251
kimschips is offline kimschips  Denmark
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TirNaOg View Post
+1
If the internal regs are in the league of LT3045s say then there would be no need to bypass them but option for external power inputs are crucial for me.
With internal regs like LT3045 I would just keep them and add external psu with example a lt1085 or even lm317 versus USB as external supply��

Last edited by kimschips; 15th April 2018 at 01:36 PM. Reason: ..
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Old 15th April 2018, 03:02 PM   #252
Lorien is offline Lorien
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There is a chance to drop the USB powering option because 0.5A (theoretically) might be not enough for this new board. Let's not forget that with linear Vregs, the XMOS chip will "eat" at least 200 mA or more, depending on various factors.
And, the most part of all: if the USB power will be used then there will be direct GND connection between the SPDIF output stage and the USB input stage.
We don't want that, yes?
In addition, using a DC-DC converter just to isolate grounds isn't appealing to me as mainly this means additional noise that have to be filtered not to mention that I like having no SMPS on that board! The digital chips are making enough noise!
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Old 15th April 2018, 06:30 PM   #253
Cornan is offline Cornan  Sweden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorien View Post
There is a chance to drop the USB powering option because 0.5A (theoretically) might be not enough for this new board. Let's not forget that with linear Vregs, the XMOS chip will "eat" at least 200 mA or more, depending on various factors.
And, the most part of all: if the USB power will be used then there will be direct GND connection between the SPDIF output stage and the USB input stage.
We don't want that, yes?
In addition, using a DC-DC converter just to isolate grounds isn't appealing to me as mainly this means additional noise that have to be filtered not to mention that I like having no SMPS on that board! The digital chips are making enough noise!
I will have no use for a Spdif input. When it comes to USB power I am a bit torn. I am currently feeding the BW board with a ISO Regen plus USBPCB (GI on). The ISO Regen is powered by LT3045s in series and the Spdif output of the BW board is powered by LPS-1.2 (with Stammheims HPULNs in series at the input). This sound so great that I really have no need to power it in any other way. However, I do see why you want to drop the USB power but I am a bit afraid that in my setup it will mean yet another PSU that I really want to avoid. Just my two cents.
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Old 15th April 2018, 07:42 PM   #254
Lorien is offline Lorien
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Quote:
When it comes to USB power I am a bit torn.
Hi Micael! I don't think there are any reasons for that! If the PSU you're using to power the SPDIF side of actual BW board is able to source around 0.5A or more there there will be no trouble at all. You simply have to wire it to the external PSU socket of the new one.
The new project will have more Vregs on it thus there are more loses thus needs more current to work properly. Not to mention that I'm thinking to add some additional active stages which will ask for additional current but I'm still debating!
Anyway, I guess I'll get over with 0.5A or so but not all the USB ports are designed to work as per the USB specs so when it comes to get the max out of them then one might have some troubles.

Do not make the mistake and think that I'll put a trafo inside and build my own PSU there. No! I'll just require 5Vdc@0.7A for example (TBD). Due to the fact that Vregs I'll be using now have a wider voltage input range then batteries can be taken into account too. I guess I can go up to 12V or so but I have to check the power dissipation first! There are no promises that I'll keep any above values yet I'll do my best to make it as flexible as possible.
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Last edited by Lorien; 15th April 2018 at 07:46 PM.
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Old 15th April 2018, 10:23 PM   #255
TirNaOg is offline TirNaOg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorien View Post
.....And, the most part of all: if the USB power will be used then there will be direct GND connection between the SPDIF output stage and the USB input stage.
We don't want that, yes?

Preferably not have the grounds connected if you can manage that Lucian
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Old 15th April 2018, 11:30 PM   #256
marcus1 is offline marcus1
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Hi Lucian

I accidentally deleted the email from you where I asked what was the maximum voltage I could supply the BW board on the SPDIF side. From memory, I think you said 5.5vdc - is this correct?

Also, I'm using the BW with a ISO Regen and need to have the BW board positioned on it's side - is this a problem as the last time I checked the two small heatsinks on the board were quite warm/hot and I'm concerned the components may overheat in this position?

Thanks for your help.
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Old 16th April 2018, 06:29 AM   #257
Cornan is offline Cornan  Sweden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorien View Post
Hi Micael! I don't think there are any reasons for that! If the PSU you're using to power the SPDIF side of actual BW board is able to source around 0.5A or more there there will be no trouble at all. You simply have to wire it to the external PSU socket of the new one.
The new project will have more Vregs on it thus there are more loses thus needs more current to work properly. Not to mention that I'm thinking to add some additional active stages which will ask for additional current but I'm still debating!
Anyway, I guess I'll get over with 0.5A or so but not all the USB ports are designed to work as per the USB specs so when it comes to get the max out of them then one might have some troubles.

Do not make the mistake and think that I'll put a trafo inside and build my own PSU there. No! I'll just require 5Vdc@0.7A for example (TBD). Due to the fact that Vregs I'll be using now have a wider voltage input range then batteries can be taken into account too. I guess I can go up to 12V or so but I have to check the power dissipation first! There are no promises that I'll keep any above values yet I'll do my best to make it as flexible as possible.
Thanks Lucian! So this means that there will be only one PSU needed to power the whole board (and not two PSU)? If correct then ditching the USB power is the best option for sure.
What kind of active stages are you refering to BTW? Active loads? IME LT3045 voltage regs sounds best with lower voltage drop. Heat dissipation could have negative impact on SQ.

Best regards,
Micael
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Old 16th April 2018, 12:00 PM   #258
Lorien is offline Lorien
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Quote:
Preferably not have the grounds connected if you can manage that Lucian
Yes I can so the external PSU will be!

Quote:
I accidentally deleted the email from you where I asked what was the maximum voltage I could supply the BW board on the SPDIF side. From memory, I think you said 5.5vdc - is this correct?
In fact 5Vdc is but maximum value should be 5.5V you you're partially right! Anyway, my advice is to stick with 5.0Vdc.

Quote:
Also, I'm using the BW with a ISO Regen and need to have the BW board positioned on it's side - is this a problem as the last time I checked the two small heatsinks on the board were quite warm/hot and I'm concerned the components may overheat in this position?
Overheating is a problem with actual BW boards. That's because I'm using linear Vregs all over the places. Make sure you will not cover your BW or if you do, try to leave some openings for the air to get to it. It also depends on the room or external temperature. If it's rather cold then I'm assuming you don't have to worry to much but when outside is around 35 - 40 degrees C then you have to take precautions!

As a side note and something amusing to remember is the fact that I ran a couple of tests by overheating the BW cards while running. For that I took my heat gun, set it at 320 C and heat it up. On short therm the BW stopped working when thermal protections were activated but started to sing again after cooldown. On long therm though, things might get uglier so a good ventilation for BW will always be recommended!

Quote:
Thanks Lucian! So this means that there will be only one PSU needed to power the whole board (and not two PSU)?
Yes! As I told you before, I'm assuming 0.5A will be enough but I can't be sure until I design the board and measure it.

Quote:
What kind of active stages are you refering to BTW? Active loads?
No! The board will have only the SPDIF output... What's after it it's your 'problem'.
As for the active stages, I was strictly referring to the USB side, especially to cleaning the USB data. I have in front of me three variants to do so: one passive and two active stages. I cannot implement all of them but 2/3 were already chosen and I already built the block diagram for them.
To avoid troubles I'll try these two stages on actual WaveIO in Microsoft, MAC and Linux (Ubuntu) and see if are working okay.
I'll NOT do the mistake again of building all on one board and scratch my head if somethings not working properly!

Kind regards,
L
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Old 16th April 2018, 12:54 PM   #259
Cornan is offline Cornan  Sweden
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Quote:
Yes! As I told you before, I'm assuming 0.5A will be enough but I can't be sure until I design the board and measure it.
OK thanks, it will be interesting to follow!

Quote:
As for the active stages, I was strictly referring to the USB side, especially to cleaning the USB data. I have in front of me three variants to do so: one passive and two active stages. I cannot implement all of them but 2/3 were already chosen and I already built the block diagram for them.
To avoid troubles I'll try these two stages on actual WaveIO in Microsoft, MAC and Linux (Ubuntu) and see if are working okay.
Sounds good! IŽll cross my fingers that the passive stage will work wonders!
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Old 17th April 2018, 11:45 AM   #260
Lorien is offline Lorien
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Quote:
Sounds good! IŽll cross my fingers that the passive stage will work wonders!
In fact I decided to implement all of 3 variants on one board.
This is my first step for the new BluWave board I'm planning to build. This new module will be initially tested with actual WaveIO card and is simply a USB cleaner test board. Perhaps I'll order it in lot of 10 PCBs so it will be nice if there are some of you interested in run a couple of tests in parallel with mine on different PC/MAC/Linux configurations.
Since the parts used will be expensive I cannot offer the board for free but you'll only have to pay the part's costs, Paypal and shipping charges. No VAT, no invoices, sorry!
To be clear, this board will be inserted before BluWave / WaveIO board: will have an USB-B input socket and an USB-B out socket and is meant to clean up the USB data paths, USB power will NOT be cleaned since I already took the decision to go for external supply for BW!

Going back to wiring.

Kind regards,
L
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