Go Back   Home > Forums > >
Home Forums Rules Articles diyAudio Store Blogs Gallery Wiki Register Donations FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Digital Line Level DACs, Digital Crossovers, Equalizers, etc.

Replacing caps in a mini USB DAC
Replacing caps in a mini USB DAC
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11th December 2016, 10:43 PM   #11
kevinkr is offline kevinkr  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
kevinkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Replacing caps in a mini USB DAC
Moving to the appropriate forum which is Digital Line Level.
__________________
"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." - Thomas Paine
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th December 2016, 10:00 AM   #12
DF96 is offline DF96  England
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Don't start out in audio by believing all the myths. Change components if they are faulty or unreliable. If the sound is wrong change the circuit, to a better circuit. If the sound is fine, why change anything? Would you change your car or your house just because someone you have never met (and know nothing about told) you to?
  Reply With Quote
Old 14th December 2016, 01:03 AM   #13
answerawake is offline answerawake
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Yea I have learned after reading that the 2704 is a tad outdated. Doh! Well it would be interesting as a first step to see what happens after the components are changed. It is the first step in a long road of learning.
  Reply With Quote
Old 14th December 2016, 01:05 AM   #14
answerawake is offline answerawake
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
DF96 how can I know if the sound is wrong or not? Best I can do is try it and see if anything changes. It is up to me to decide if it sounds better, worse or the same.
  Reply With Quote
Old 14th December 2016, 09:43 AM   #15
DF96 is offline DF96  England
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
You need to understand that most component 'upgrades' do nothing, some may make a minor improvement (if the original circuit used poor quality or inappropriate items), while some may cause significant degradation (if the new component, however expensive, is in fact inferior). You don't start on "a long road of learning" by swallowing myths. For many DIYers, component 'upgrades' are done simply because they don't know enough to do anything useful but at least they have learned how to solder (and de-solder); when all you have is a hammer, all problems look like a nail. Those who can't solder just swap cables - an even bigger waste of time.

Why not start your long road by doing some real learning? Not about components, but about circuits.
  Reply With Quote
Old 14th December 2016, 11:21 AM   #16
batteryman is offline batteryman  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: SCOTLAND
Replacing caps in a mini USB DAC
Quote:
Originally Posted by DF96 View Post
You need to understand that most component 'upgrades' do nothing, some may make a minor improvement (if the original circuit used poor quality or inappropriate items), while some may cause significant degradation (if the new component, however expensive, is in fact inferior). You don't start on "a long road of learning" by swallowing myths. For many DIYers, component 'upgrades' are done simply because they don't know enough to do anything useful but at least they have learned how to solder (and de-solder); when all you have is a hammer, all problems look like a nail. Those who can't solder just swap cables - an even bigger waste of time.

Why not start your long road by doing some real learning? Not about components, but about circuits.
+1
Only change something if there is reasonable evidence and feedback from others that the change is of benefit.

The HIFI press have a lot to answer for when it come to cables and sound quality. It beggars belief that paying 60 for a fancy AC mains lead (eg teflon insulated, silver plated, screened cable) produces an audible benefit.
Its the old story ' more money than sense'.
  Reply With Quote
Old 14th December 2016, 12:39 PM   #17
jean-paul is offline jean-paul  Netherlands
diyAudio Moderator Emeritus
 
jean-paul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Germany
Quote:
Originally Posted by DF96 View Post
You need to understand that most component 'upgrades' do nothing, some may make a minor improvement (if the original circuit used poor quality or inappropriate items), while some may cause significant degradation (if the new component, however expensive, is in fact inferior). You don't start on "a long road of learning" by swallowing myths. For many DIYers, component 'upgrades' are done simply because they don't know enough to do anything useful but at least they have learned how to solder (and de-solder); when all you have is a hammer, all problems look like a nail. Those who can't solder just swap cables - an even bigger waste of time.

Why not start your long road by doing some real learning? Not about components, but about circuits.
While you are being right about circuits being most important it is also now quite normal that inferior parts were used as these were cheapest. Also fake parts are used. Especially electrolytic caps are often garbage. So changing parts is not a waste of time with cheap Ebay and Aliexpress stuff. You could debate if it is not wiser and cheaper to buy a A branded device straight away

I think most of us have replaced caps for better quality (like MKS for MKP) and noticed a difference. Also changing opamps can make a difference when chosen wisely. You are not in the camp "parts and cables don't make a difference" do you ? If so I dare to say "every amplifier that measures the same sounds the same"
__________________
It's only audio. Member of the non modular PCB design committee

Last edited by jean-paul; 14th December 2016 at 12:41 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2016, 09:23 AM   #18
DF96 is offline DF96  England
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by jean-paul
I think most of us have replaced caps for better quality (like MKS for MKP) and noticed a difference. Also changing opamps can make a difference when chosen wisely. You are not in the camp "parts and cables don't make a difference" do you ? If so I dare to say "every amplifier that measures the same sounds the same"
MKS and MKP are different dielectrics, so the issue is not quality but appropriateness for the application (coupling, decoupling, filter?). I am unconvinced about opamp rolling, unless the original opamp was inappropriate or so old that modern ones have lower noise. It is easy to make a circuit sound different by swapping parts, but harder to actually improve the performance.

Parts (if appropriate) make little difference. Cables (unless faulty, such as many DIY cables and some high-end cable) make no difference to well-engineered equipment; cable fussiness is a sign of poor equipment design.

Amplifiers which measure the same (including frequency response and output impedance) appear to be indistinguishable when used unsighted below clipping. I have not done the experiments myself, but others have. I have no reason at present to doubt these results.

I guess that makes me guilty as charged.
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2016, 02:46 PM   #19
jean-paul is offline jean-paul  Netherlands
diyAudio Moderator Emeritus
 
jean-paul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Germany
Hi I think I was 12 or 13 when I discovered film caps sounded different. MKP had a better sound character than MKS and MKC. I replaced electrolytic caps for MKT and found them to sound better. I replaced noisy opamps for better ones with JFET inputs in gear. Could be noticed by anyone that was there....

Parts do make a difference and this can be checked in a few minutes. I guess you just skipped this and don't want to try it out.
__________________
It's only audio. Member of the non modular PCB design committee
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2016, 03:10 PM   #20
DF96 is offline DF96  England
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
You were obviously an early starter. At 12 or 13 I was still learning Ohm's Law and other physics relating to electronics. Some people try to skip this.

Using the wrong parts can certainly make a difference. Swapping one appropriate part for another appropriate part can usually only be heard when the listener knows that a swap has taken place.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Replacing caps in a mini USB DACHide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
PCM5102 Mini USB DAC Schematic and layout critique miniengineer Digital Line Level 2 17th February 2015 01:04 PM
NuForce Icon UDAC-2 mini USB DAC/ headphone amplifier hatrack71 Swap Meet 0 8th April 2013 12:17 AM
Muse Mini USB DAC or Converter? whaleman Digital Source 2 4th June 2011 07:45 PM
AUNE - MINI USB DAC/Headphone amp kmtang Digital Source 23 9th September 2010 06:25 PM
Wanted: USB board for Apogee mini-DAC Puggie Swap Meet 0 3rd April 2007 10:46 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:52 AM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 15.00%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2019 diyAudio
Wiki