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Old 8th March 2018, 08:19 PM   #1871
a333bt is offline a333bt  Slovenia
diyAudio Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Vodice
Originally Posted by Peter Sheehy View Post
Hi Mark
It can be a lot of fun trying new approaches with No DAC
The sound produced is very natural, but its not without its problems
You would have to go back thru this thread to see the various approaches that were tried

-the main problems are:
- Noise - both a switching noise and a noise similar to white noise
- Pops and thumps which are due to DC offsets inherent within the DSD signal

The DC offset and clicks and thumps were corrected with a circuit by Nautibuoy, and you would have to track him down for a PCB
Very much an experimental approach
Not recommended for headphone listening because of the problems mentioned
CYa Peter
I agree with above writen.
Still with this problems, i could listen music easily, because feeling is natural. For es or ak dacs i couldnt say that.
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Old 21st March 2018, 07:08 AM   #1872
Peter Sheehy is offline Peter Sheehy  Australia
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: EATON WA 6232
Default A more natural sound

Yes I Totally agree
In fact once I've had a taste for a more natural (realistic) sound I am finding I can't go back to 'ordinary' DACs
Even with the noise - which still is a problem the sound is better than that achieved by most DACs
In fact I was so impressed with the sound I thought it could have been me and it was somehow a more 'coloured' sound that I was enjoying - so I set up my system like so:
A vinyl LP playing Cassandra Wilson -Travelling Miles this is a top pressing with great fidelity (180gm on two LPs) feeding a good SQ MC Cartdridge
the same album, but on CD ripped to disk and playing via:
1 Daphile at 128 DSD playing via XMOS to NoDAC/ 74ACT74 to a pre filter feeding an EDCOR XS1100 transformer (Now this transformer is a better option to my way of thinking because it has a meatier core than a Lundhal or Jensen etc which makes it better for those trying things because the core doesn't saturate at low DC offset currents. It also has benign distortion levels and flat frequency response to 50Khz)

2. an XMOS/AK4490 DAC running balanced into my pre - amplifier (and up until this point in time I was satisfied with this DAC)
Once I have adjusted the output/ volume levels of each of the three sources and cued each to be playing the same track at the same time (more or less) i can instantly switch between any of the three sources and therefore immediately detect differences in "the sound" coming from each of the sources ( my pre amp switches via push buttons connected to relays with no perceivable delays between them)
Now for the verdict:
The NoDAC is a better sounding DAC than the AK4490 because it renders ie converts digital into analogue across the whole spectrum of musical sounds
ie human voice, bass, guitars, brass, drums and percussion (ie transients)
Common garden variety DACS (ie DAC chips and others) do a great job with simple sounds eg sine waves ,where there distn levels at 0dB are to be admired and along with there ultra low noise levels give ear bleeding dynamic ranges, but fail to achieve any where near what the specs would suggest with real music..I will explain in my next post.
Regarding the No DAC and Vinyl well I am glad to say this was a close call with this album - some tracks I preferred the phono sound - others the NoDAC - and I know that is going to be controversial - if I haven't been controversial enough
Now the caveat is that the SNR of the NoDAC is poor and so comes a distant third to the other two sources - Vinyl and CD where the signal level is low ie quiet passages in the music - which is pretty rare in contemporary music.
This puts the AK4490 (or other chip dacs) first
Vinyl second
and the NoDAC last
So the upshot of all that is I listen to the NoDAC 90% of the time, Use a DAC DAC where the signal levels are low ( esp if I am using HeadPhones) and I will spin up a Vinyl or two if I am feeling nostalgic ie go completely analogue.
CYa Peter
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Old 13th April 2018, 12:16 PM   #1873
dawa is offline dawa  Sweden
diyAudio Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Gothenburg
The Best DAC is no DAC
Default nOOb question..

Yes Mark I agree!
Do this work?

"No-Dac" and "No-USB" - DACs & Digital Source / Transport - StereoNET

Have any here tryd to use this?
Or do You have to use the powered ”no DAC”?
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Old 11th October 2018, 07:12 PM   #1874
Collux is offline Collux  Australia
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne AUS
Things have been quiet for a while here with this interesting project.
>> Any further updates, improvements and/or feedback?
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Old 11th October 2018, 11:03 PM   #1875
hazard500 is offline hazard500  Australia
diyAudio Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Melbourne
Originally Posted by Collux View Post
Things have been quiet for a while here with this interesting project.
>> Any further updates, improvements and/or feedback?
Hi Collux, most of us have been playing over in this thread

Official GB for DSD DAC Signalyst DSCv2

I bought a DSC2 v2.5.2 and for the moment it has displaced my No-DAC. The original design was by Jussi Laako (of HQPlayer fame) and Pavel Pogodin has done a tremendous job of implementing this innovative design.

Does it sound better? Unfortunately I can't do A/B comparison but based on my 'impartial' memory I think that the No-DAC has the edge in terms of sound quality - it has an amazingly rich analog sound, DSC2 gets close but not quite the same IMHO. However, I agree with Petr Sheehy - the noise from the no_DAC can be a nuisance, and the DSC 2.5 is deathly quiet. I need to get another USB card so I can compare the 2 side by side and hopefully do something about the noise, but unfortunately, no one has been able to do this since I started this thread a few years ago.

You live in Melbourne? If you are interested I can arrange for you to listen to DSC 2.5 at my place in Eltham.

Regards, Hazard
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Old 12th October 2018, 06:08 AM   #1876
Collux is offline Collux  Australia
diyAudio Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne AUS
Thanks Hazard for that kind offer.
I will PM my details to you.

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