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Old 18th August 2015, 08:11 AM   #101
Signalyst is offline Signalyst  Finland
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Join Date: Jul 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nic.M View Post
I am on a Mac using DoP for DSD output.
This is common effect with many DACs when using DoP. USB interface should delay data stream enough that unmute happens about 100 ms after DSD data has been detected, and mute 100 ms before DSD data ends.

Delaying unmute at start is easier, but really the only way to do proper muting at stop is to have enough buffer/delay in the USB interface so that it can see "ahead of the time".

This is just one of the many down sides of DoP.
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Old 18th August 2015, 07:59 PM   #102
Nic.M is offline Nic.M  Canada
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Any suggestions for Mac users?
I am not aware of any way to use other USB drivers to avoid DoP.
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Old 18th August 2015, 08:58 PM   #103
mcluxun is offline mcluxun  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Signalyst View Post
This is common effect with many DACs when using DoP. USB interface should delay data stream enough that unmute happens about 100 ms after DSD data has been detected, and mute 100 ms before DSD data ends.

Delaying unmute at start is easier, but really the only way to do proper muting at stop is to have enough buffer/delay in the USB interface so that it can see "ahead of the time".

This is just one of the many down sides of DoP.
Is there a way to do a gapless playback from software side to make sure the data stream wont be cut off?
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Old 19th August 2015, 10:17 PM   #104
Nic.M is offline Nic.M  Canada
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Location: North Vancouver, B.C.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Signalyst View Post
This is common effect with many DACs when using DoP. USB interface should delay data stream enough that unmute happens about 100 ms after DSD data has been detected, and mute 100 ms before DSD data ends.

Delaying unmute at start is easier, but really the only way to do proper muting at stop is to have enough buffer/delay in the USB interface so that it can see "ahead of the time".

This is just one of the many down sides of DoP.
I noticed on the Amanero site that it is possible to reflash their card to add a 500 ms delay to the the start of the i2S stream. Would this do the trick?
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Old 20th August 2015, 08:57 PM   #105
Signalyst is offline Signalyst  Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcluxun View Post
Is there a way to do a gapless playback from software side to make sure the data stream wont be cut off?
Yes, it is gapless, but when the player enters stop mode then the stream will cut...

(unless you have configuration where output sampling rate would need to change, rate cannot be changed on the fly)
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Old 20th August 2015, 08:59 PM   #106
Signalyst is offline Signalyst  Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nic.M View Post
I noticed on the Amanero site that it is possible to reflash their card to add a 500 ms delay to the the start of the i2S stream. Would this do the trick?
Not really, there should be delay before Amanero unmutes the output after the data stream has started. And vice versa it should mute the output before data stream stops. I understood that the stop case is particularly problematic?
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Old 21st August 2015, 05:40 AM   #107
Nic.M is offline Nic.M  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Signalyst View Post
Not really, there should be delay before Amanero unmutes the output after the data stream has started. And vice versa it should mute the output before data stream stops. I understood that the stop case is particularly problematic?

Yes, the stop click is louder, but only marginally. It is a shame because the combination of HQ Player Desktop and DSC1 is a real winner. The best sound I have experienced in my systems, both Stax headphone based and the large room system.

What I am now curious about is why the Resonessence Labs Herus and Concero which I also have, do not make noises doing DSD under DOP in the same systems. Neither does a friend's M2Tech Young DSD.

Is it an Amanero shortcoming with any hope of overcoming for Mac users?

N.
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Old 21st August 2015, 07:51 AM   #108
gentlevoice is offline gentlevoice  Denmark
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Signalyst DSC1
Hi Nic.M,

In my system - which is PC based - the Amanero also when shifting tracks or on stop & start of playback. I somehow (although not entirely satisfactorily) solved it by setting up the clock for asynchronous playback - this reduced the clicks substantially but also caused playback to not really work at 384 kHz. And then I haven't had the time to amend this ...

BTW - you are aware of the Amanero "support" thread:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendo...converter.html

Although very long there's a good bit of information here about various challenges with the Amanero board ...

Cheers,

Jesper
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"... It is always possible to be friendly ..." HH the Dalai Lama.
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Old 21st August 2015, 08:51 AM   #109
Signalyst is offline Signalyst  Finland
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Join Date: Jul 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nic.M View Post
What I am now curious about is why the Resonessence Labs Herus and Concero which I also have, do not make noises doing DSD under DOP in the same systems. Neither does a friend's M2Tech Young DSD.
It just depends on the USB implementation controlling output mute... For example iFi iDSD Micro also has some clicks and pops and Mytek also. While Fostex, TEAC and exaSound are quiet.

For DoP it requires a look-ahead buffer in the USB receiver, so it can control mute before changes in the output data happen.

Sabre is especially nasty chip in this respect because it cannot be programmatically switched between PCM and DSD modes but instead uses autodetect based on the input signals (so clever mute is mandatory).

Quote:
Is it an Amanero shortcoming with any hope of overcoming for Mac users?
You could ask Amanero about the mute control and what possibilities there would be for having longer unmute/mute time delta in respect to the output data.
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Old 21st August 2015, 06:47 PM   #110
Nic.M is offline Nic.M  Canada
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Join Date: Jan 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gentlevoice View Post
Hi Nic.M,

In my system - which is PC based - the Amanero also when shifting tracks or on stop & start of playback. I somehow (although not entirely satisfactorily) solved it by setting up the clock for asynchronous playback - this reduced the clicks substantially but also caused playback to not really work at 384 kHz. And then I haven't had the time to amend this ...

BTW - you are aware of the Amanero "support" thread:


Jesper
Thank you Jasper for sharing your experience and for the asynchronous clock tip. How do you set up asynchronous clocking with the DSC1 and HQ Player?
Excuse my ignorance, but I do not know how to do this. I have gone into the settings and see no dialog for doing this in HQ Player.


Yes, I have been slowly wading through the long Amanero thread, tedious reading(I am on page 93 of 150 or so.) There was only one post so far of
clicking noises but nobody seems to have paid much attention to it. I will struggle on with it in the hope of finding something helpful.

N.
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