chokesrule
if your using lampys tube output stage as a filter directly wired to the dacs then those caps are doing more then what first appears,if i remember rightly they act as loading for the dacs and the circuit...or something like that,depends what dacs and design your using i guess...i dont know enough to be of any help other then point out that i remember reading that value was quite important for some dacs.
maybe better starting a new thread regarding the lampizator and its use with these amps as its more to do with that side of things and you may get more help that way...it would be a shame to damage your dacs
all the best
smithie
if your using lampys tube output stage as a filter directly wired to the dacs then those caps are doing more then what first appears,if i remember rightly they act as loading for the dacs and the circuit...or something like that,depends what dacs and design your using i guess...i dont know enough to be of any help other then point out that i remember reading that value was quite important for some dacs.
maybe better starting a new thread regarding the lampizator and its use with these amps as its more to do with that side of things and you may get more help that way...it would be a shame to damage your dacs
all the best
smithie
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Nice. Could you update the schematic then, please ? And is there any other change ? Thanks.
Well, I don't see that, only other people wondering why this choice of yours. Stereo bridged (T1) and single BTL (T2) are quite similar theorically in the feedback circuit design, I think. I just wonder why you change the value between the T1 (390pF/150pF) and T2 (470pF/390pF, same as datasheet). You say in another comment that it's because it's "better" : could you elaborate on that ? What does warrant this choice ? At this stage, output impedence shouldn't matter, and recommanded supply voltage is the same between T1 and T2.
Could you elaborate on your calculations ?
With the T1 values, the output filter cutoff is at 1/(2*pi*sqrt(11uH*220nF)) = 102kHz. With T2 values (11uH/470nF) we have 70kHz. Tripath datasheet recommands 15uH and 220nF which gives 88kHz, even if they state further in the datasheet that TK2050 "works well" with 10uH and 470nF (close to T2's values). Please correct me if I'm wrong.
I'm planning to try changing them, and I'll report here.
Also, even stanger, ST datasheet on STA5XX has a different output filter design: what do you think about it ? Why do you prefer Tripath's one ? (and ST has kept the design until today, as even the march 2010 updated STA510A datasheet keep this design; so they must think it's good, even after having seen Tripath's design at the time)
I have recently purchased T2 version of amp with Meanwell power supply. It has been playing now constantly for 10 days.
It has a very pleasant mids, warm but detailed - great, however the higher frequencies are not that good - they are very laid back and lack resolution. My LM4780 based amp delivers much more "air", details and something that gives live and space to the overall sound.
Has anyone had similar experience? Is there something I can do to improve this?
Another questions: is it possible to remove input caps? The Amp is fed from a Tube stage which has high quality output caps so I guess if this makes sense to have two caps one, after other?
It has a very pleasant mids, warm but detailed - great, however the higher frequencies are not that good - they are very laid back and lack resolution. My LM4780 based amp delivers much more "air", details and something that gives live and space to the overall sound.
Has anyone had similar experience? Is there something I can do to improve this?
Another questions: is it possible to remove input caps? The Amp is fed from a Tube stage which has high quality output caps so I guess if this makes sense to have two caps one, after other?
Yes I can confirm that. In my case in comparison to a sure board. But the rest values added it´s still a great performer for this price. I also wished it would project a bit more space into the soundstage.
Yes. Take a source with higher resolution. Not that type of CD Players which sound like vinylrecords or analogue/warm whatever ...
2050 sound
My TK2050 amp sounds much better than my 3875 amp which is better than my 3886 amp. More transparent with explosive dynamics. What you are hearing is not the sound of the chip. You can try rewinding your output coils with less turns or better yet, replace them with Wurth XXL at 4.7uH. If you jump your input caps you must also remove the input pot. The amps actually sends dc back out the input.
T3 and meanwell
I got myself a Meanwell SE-600-48 to try with a pair of T3 and T3e psu boards. That was a big dissapointment, the se-600 runs its fan constantly. It's very loud so it's unusable for living room audio.
I then tried to connect one S-350 36V meanwell onto two T3's with each their T3e. Hadn't tried this exact combination before, last time used the two channel T3e psu board.
But it was the same issue, some high frequency shhh noise, quite audible on my 99db speakers. maybe it will not be a big issue on something like 88db speakers. When I disconnect one amp so that one meanwell only powers one T3, then this noise disappears.
So it seems like 2 x s350-48 is still the way to go to be sure to avoid this noise.
I got myself a Meanwell SE-600-48 to try with a pair of T3 and T3e psu boards. That was a big dissapointment, the se-600 runs its fan constantly. It's very loud so it's unusable for living room audio.
I then tried to connect one S-350 36V meanwell onto two T3's with each their T3e. Hadn't tried this exact combination before, last time used the two channel T3e psu board.
But it was the same issue, some high frequency shhh noise, quite audible on my 99db speakers. maybe it will not be a big issue on something like 88db speakers. When I disconnect one amp so that one meanwell only powers one T3, then this noise disappears.
So it seems like 2 x s350-48 is still the way to go to be sure to avoid this noise.
O.K. I am not sure if you mentioned here the use of torroidal tansformers for T3. It would also make sense because there is existing ready developed the powersupply unit including speaker relays. My views regarding this supply possibility have changed a bit. I found a good SMPS more dry and quick while the torroidal use sounds more relaxed and fuller. This is not a correct comparison because of two different amps listened. Maybe you have made a more correct comparison:
same board - two/three supply types ...
Wishes
I can confirm this issue and the noise is there also on lower sensitive speakers. So if running the T3 with SMPS the correct is to feed them from two separate SMPS.
I'm using two 400W/48V now and there are not any noise at all.
I must say I'm quite happy with this setup, for the price it's fantastic.
hi guys
ive recieved this amp and power surply and have been busy playing around with.
its already been asked afew times without reply and i would like to ask it again....
can someone please quote the output impendence for the version v1.2 80watt+80watt 8ohm board, irun a sat/sub type speaker combination and ive been trying to use my plate sub amp via the amps speaker terminal connections,the trouble is this way is useless,it lacks life/drive and suffers a one note bass effect,not to mention the level has to be turned up all the way to get the volume from the sub plate amp...this is the only amp that has produced these results,thats why im after the value of the output impedence...somethings a miss/mis-match somewhere.
all the best
smithie
ive recieved this amp and power surply and have been busy playing around with.
its already been asked afew times without reply and i would like to ask it again....
can someone please quote the output impendence for the version v1.2 80watt+80watt 8ohm board, irun a sat/sub type speaker combination and ive been trying to use my plate sub amp via the amps speaker terminal connections,the trouble is this way is useless,it lacks life/drive and suffers a one note bass effect,not to mention the level has to be turned up all the way to get the volume from the sub plate amp...this is the only amp that has produced these results,thats why im after the value of the output impedence...somethings a miss/mis-match somewhere.
all the best
smithie
Is the output of the Tripath amp connected to the input of the plate amp? That absolutely won't work - the amp needs a certain range of load impedance, about 4-8 Ohms.
You'll want to split the signal before the Tripath, and send that to the plate amp.
Or did I misunderstand the connection description?
You'll want to split the signal before the Tripath, and send that to the plate amp.
Or did I misunderstand the connection description?
yeah, he's got one of those dumb plate amps that take "high level" inputs. I advise abandoning them and just split the "low level" input. If you want to do it properly get a pre amp:
06072009150
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06072009150
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"Is the output of the Tripath amp connected to the input of the plate amp? That absolutely won't work - the amp needs a certain range of load impedance, about 4-8 Ohms."
and can i ask why you think this wont work? or is this just you opionion?
from my understanding of the process the plate amp hardly puts any extra loading on the power amps output,works fine with every other amp ive owned(both valve and solid state) are you telling me that a class d-amp just cant handle this set-up? tried a fatman valve/chip amp the other week with out problems,infact the subs worked a treat via that method so im struggerling to see your resons for that statement.
regarding spliting signal before the tripath,thats been tried.
"yeah, he's got one of those dumb plate amps that take "high level" inputs."
its always a pleasure recieving technical quotes and answers back to your post,so if anyone has any feel free to send them,opinions like above are totally wasted on me however.
i have a valve pre-amp so ive tried most options with this amp,and using pre-outs from a valve pre-amp into my sub plate amp and using the tripath to power the main drivers just doesnt work in my system or to these ears,if your bible is what hifi then maybe its acceptable
i choose speaker output connection to my plate amp by choice,not because i have to,theres plenty of arguments as to which way to go,but to these ears and system when my plate amp is boasting the main amps signal the sub bass is more in keeping with the tone and flow of the mains(good or bad) as its amplifing the same signal that the main drivers are seeing and not some totally different signal being produced by the low level pre-amp output.
so once again the question remains, does anyone know the output impedance of this amp?
all the best
smithie
and can i ask why you think this wont work? or is this just you opionion?
from my understanding of the process the plate amp hardly puts any extra loading on the power amps output,works fine with every other amp ive owned(both valve and solid state) are you telling me that a class d-amp just cant handle this set-up? tried a fatman valve/chip amp the other week with out problems,infact the subs worked a treat via that method so im struggerling to see your resons for that statement.
regarding spliting signal before the tripath,thats been tried.
"yeah, he's got one of those dumb plate amps that take "high level" inputs."
its always a pleasure recieving technical quotes and answers back to your post,so if anyone has any feel free to send them,opinions like above are totally wasted on me however.
i have a valve pre-amp so ive tried most options with this amp,and using pre-outs from a valve pre-amp into my sub plate amp and using the tripath to power the main drivers just doesnt work in my system or to these ears,if your bible is what hifi then maybe its acceptable
i choose speaker output connection to my plate amp by choice,not because i have to,theres plenty of arguments as to which way to go,but to these ears and system when my plate amp is boasting the main amps signal the sub bass is more in keeping with the tone and flow of the mains(good or bad) as its amplifing the same signal that the main drivers are seeing and not some totally different signal being produced by the low level pre-amp output.
so once again the question remains, does anyone know the output impedance of this amp?
all the best
smithie
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There's a filter on the output of the Tripath amp, and it needs a certain load impedance, or the filter action is changed. These amps are rather particular in that regard.
hi
im using hawthrone open baffle speakers that are re-inforced with augie(subs) bass drivers,there very high sensitivity drivers(the main drivers).
Hawthorne Audio Silver Iris (15 inch coaxial OB driver) review - [English]
im using these with audionote valve pre and power amps,the plate amp used to power the bass re-inforcement.
ive been running the tk2050 for afew days,i was hoping to set it up exactly the same as my above system but as you know i can not now do this due to the plate amp issue so at present im running the plate amp via my pre outs.
at first i found the tk2020 amp very smooth,wide soundstage but very flat depth,i also found the treble recessed and the little details in the music that make things seem more real just wasnt there.
of course this is just my opinion and to my ears and in my system,also bare in mind that its only been running for afew days just incase theres a break in effect.
all the above isnt ment to be a negative remark,its just how im hearing it,the amp is a bargan and certainly impressive in its own right and could certainly shock afair few people with its sound quality alone,throw in how much these cost including the power surply and your on to a winner
i was hoping to get alittle nearer to the sound of my power amps(then again valves just do somethings others cant),the valve preamp adds a nice effect to the tk2050 which suits me,ive also hard wired and replaced the input cable with some better quality cable which has certainly opened up the sound,ive also replaced the caps with obligetto types which has done wonders for the top end...so its all work in progress still.
would love to get rid of the on board volume pot but i take it thats not such a simple thing to do,as at present its running through two volume pots
the trouble is when the on board volume pot is turned to max i get hum/noise through the speakers,i dont know if this is due to the amp or something else related in my system,so i may not be able to ditch the volume because of this if i can not sort it.
hope this has given a little insight.from my prospective at least.
all the best
smithie
im using hawthrone open baffle speakers that are re-inforced with augie(subs) bass drivers,there very high sensitivity drivers(the main drivers).
Hawthorne Audio Silver Iris (15 inch coaxial OB driver) review - [English]
im using these with audionote valve pre and power amps,the plate amp used to power the bass re-inforcement.
ive been running the tk2050 for afew days,i was hoping to set it up exactly the same as my above system but as you know i can not now do this due to the plate amp issue so at present im running the plate amp via my pre outs.
at first i found the tk2020 amp very smooth,wide soundstage but very flat depth,i also found the treble recessed and the little details in the music that make things seem more real just wasnt there.
of course this is just my opinion and to my ears and in my system,also bare in mind that its only been running for afew days just incase theres a break in effect.
all the above isnt ment to be a negative remark,its just how im hearing it,the amp is a bargan and certainly impressive in its own right and could certainly shock afair few people with its sound quality alone,throw in how much these cost including the power surply and your on to a winner
i was hoping to get alittle nearer to the sound of my power amps(then again valves just do somethings others cant),the valve preamp adds a nice effect to the tk2050 which suits me,ive also hard wired and replaced the input cable with some better quality cable which has certainly opened up the sound,ive also replaced the caps with obligetto types which has done wonders for the top end...so its all work in progress still.
would love to get rid of the on board volume pot but i take it thats not such a simple thing to do,as at present its running through two volume pots
the trouble is when the on board volume pot is turned to max i get hum/noise through the speakers,i dont know if this is due to the amp or something else related in my system,so i may not be able to ditch the volume because of this if i can not sort it.
hope this has given a little insight.from my prospective at least.
all the best
smithie
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