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Old 28th April 2011, 05:24 PM   #1571
portomomo is offline portomomo  Europe
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lisboa
Default Compliance of chips

Hi,
do anybody know if the sure, helder, hifimediy, ... amps are ROHS compliant?
I just found some infos on a french forum, but only regarding the PSUs.

I'm starting a amp project and I would like to buy non-toxic componemts.
Thank you very much
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Old 29th April 2011, 04:53 AM   #1572
Jack Caldwell is offline Jack Caldwell  United States
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fairfield, IA
Default Try 41Hz

Quote:
Originally Posted by portomomo View Post
Hi,
do anybody know if the sure, helder, hifimediy, ... amps are ROHS compliant?
I just found some infos on a french forum, but only regarding the PSUs.

I'm starting a amp project and I would like to buy non-toxic componemts.
Thank you very much
I think Helder might be, and the 41Hz amps almost surely have them as they originate in Europe. Check them at 41Hz.com

Their prices for assembled amp boards don't look too bad at all, and their layouts are supposedly very good, so there is good potential for them to sound very good with the right caps and parts and power supplies.

I previously passed on the 41Hz amps because they were smd kits only but now they have some pre-assembled boards and some through hole kits that look very interesting and well thought out.
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Old 29th April 2011, 02:28 PM   #1573
portomomo is offline portomomo  Europe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Caldwell View Post
I think Helder might be, and the 41Hz amps almost surely have them as they originate in Europe. Check them at 41Hz.com

Their prices for assembled amp boards don't look too bad at all, and their layouts are supposedly very good, so there is good potential for them to sound very good with the right caps and parts and power supplies.

I previously passed on the 41Hz amps because they were smd kits only but now they have some pre-assembled boards and some through hole kits that look very interesting and well thought out.
Thank Jack for the info, I'll have a look. Maybe I write a direct email to them with a direct question. The assembled 41Hz modules are currently unavailable and my soldering skills not too refined.
Will keep you updated.
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Old 30th April 2011, 05:16 AM   #1574
Billyo is offline Billyo  Australia
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Sydney
Hi all,

I'm just at the stage of shipping some components across the world to make my own set of speakers using Monacor drivers (actually Tony Gee's LBS speakers). I'm looking at using a Hifimediy T2 2x100W@4ohms with the Meanwell S-350-27 27V SMPS switching power supply to do the amplification.

My question is I've noted that there are 2 versions of that T2, one with a 4700 uf capacitor and a second with a 10,000 uf capacitor - in a roundabout sort of way, the Hifimediy site said that the 10,000 uf one was recommended for a transformer or the SMPS, and I assume that 4700 for a SMPS only.

Although I dont anticipate using a transformer, since the 10,000 uf one was a mere $1 more, I was thinking of buying that one anyway to give more flexibility.

But is there any performance penalty in getting that extra capacitance?

Thanks all!
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Old 30th April 2011, 05:43 PM   #1575
Jack Caldwell is offline Jack Caldwell  United States
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fairfield, IA
Default It's a plus

Quote:
Originally Posted by Billyo View Post
Hi all,

I'm just at the stage of shipping some components across the world to make my own set of speakers using Monacor drivers (actually Tony Gee's LBS speakers). I'm looking at using a Hifimediy T2 2x100W@4ohms with the Meanwell S-350-27 27V SMPS switching power supply to do the amplification.

My question is I've noted that there are 2 versions of that T2, one with a 4700 uf capacitor and a second with a 10,000 uf capacitor - in a roundabout sort of way, the Hifimediy site said that the 10,000 uf one was recommended for a transformer or the SMPS, and I assume that 4700 for a SMPS only.

Although I dont anticipate using a transformer, since the 10,000 uf one was a mere $1 more, I was thinking of buying that one anyway to give more flexibility.

But is there any performance penalty in getting that extra capacitance?

Thanks all!
4700 vs 10,000uF? No penalty, unless vastly different grades of capacitor are being used. If they're the same grade, bigger will almost always sound better.

As point of comparison, Virtue uses a 27,000uF onboard cap and premium input and filter caps, and clearly sound better than the other Tripath implementations I have heard so far.

I would get the 10,000uF version and add a high quality bypass cap to it, with the idea of maybe adding another 30,000uF. That onboard capacitance gives more peak current when it is needed, and this is one area where the theoretical or calculated max current required does not seem to match up with the subjective experience... when it comes to reserve caps it almost always seems like bigger is better... I won't say always, but in my experience so far, it hasn't yet happened that more capacitance sounded worse.
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Old 30th April 2011, 06:09 PM   #1576
sendler is offline sendler  United States
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Location: ny
Default SMPS start up

There is some conjecture about start surge issues causing SMPS to get stuck in current limit mode if the caps are too big but I haven't read anyone saying that it actually happend.
.
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Caldwell View Post
4700 vs 10,000uF? No penalty, unless vastly different grades of capacitor are being used. If they're the same grade, bigger will almost always sound better.

As point of comparison, Virtue uses a 27,000uF onboard cap and premium input and filter caps, and clearly sound better than the other Tripath implementations I have heard so far.

I would get the 10,000uF version and add a high quality bypass cap to it, with the idea of maybe adding another 30,000uF. That onboard capacitance gives more peak current when it is needed, and this is one area where the theoretical or calculated max current required does not seem to match up with the subjective experience... when it comes to reserve caps it almost always seems like bigger is better... I won't say always, but in my experience so far, it hasn't yet happened that more capacitance sounded worse.
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Old 30th April 2011, 07:35 PM   #1577
Jack Caldwell is offline Jack Caldwell  United States
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Location: Fairfield, IA
Quote:
Originally Posted by sendler View Post
There is some conjecture about start surge issues causing SMPS to get stuck in current limit mode if the caps are too big but I haven't read anyone saying that it actually happened.
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.
Hey Scott, since you've worked so much with the Meanwell supplies, have you tried adding much larger onboard caps?

I've only tried this with high current batteries and the Black Lightning LFP supplies from RedWine Audio have a built-in soft-start which prevents current inrush problems, but it would be good to get your input on this, as I suspect more people will lean toward the smps solution.

Surprisingly, even with these LFP batteries which have HUGE instant peak current capabilities which go waay beyond the smps, the larger onboard caps still make an improvement... wish we could still get those Blackgate caps at reasonable prices.

Has anyone here found any electrolytics of similar subjective quality to the now discontinued Blackgates? Elna or Nichicon perhaps?
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Old 30th April 2011, 09:08 PM   #1578
sendler is offline sendler  United States
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: ny
Default !0,000

I added 10,00uf Panasonic TSHN along with a foil bypass to the 3600 that the 2X100 comes with and my MeanWell starts up fine. I haven't done a careful A/B listening comparison since but just judging from the before and after, if there was any difference to the sound it would be very slight. SMPS don't seem to need big caps.
.
.
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Caldwell View Post
Hey Scott, since you've worked so much with the Meanwell supplies, have you tried adding much larger onboard caps?

I've only tried this with high current batteries and the Black Lightning LFP supplies from RedWine Audio have a built-in soft-start which prevents current inrush problems, but it would be good to get your input on this, as I suspect more people will lean toward the smps solution.

Surprisingly, even with these LFP batteries which have HUGE instant peak current capabilities which go waay beyond the smps, the larger onboard caps still make an improvement... wish we could still get those Blackgate caps at reasonable prices.

Has anyone here found any electrolytics of similar subjective quality to the now discontinued Blackgates? Elna or Nichicon perhaps?
__________________
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Old 30th April 2011, 10:37 PM   #1579
Billyo is offline Billyo  Australia
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Join Date: Apr 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Caldwell View Post
4700 vs 10,000uF? No penalty, unless vastly different grades of capacitor are being used. If they're the same grade, bigger will almost always sound better.

As point of comparison, Virtue uses a 27,000uF onboard cap and premium input and filter caps, and clearly sound better than the other Tripath implementations I have heard so far.
Thanks for the answer and even better...an explanation for why the cap is there in the first place!

I had a look at the Virtue (amazing how many of these TK2050 come out of the woodwork - they are well hidden from the average man in the street) but since I'm just a fledgling builder, I just can't go past the price of the Hifimediy one at this stage. I still find it hard to believe that these amps exist... I was virtually resigned to having to hand over >1K for a receiver with a million options that I didnt want or need.

Later on, if I can pull of a stereo build, I'll build some more and make a 5.1 HT system. At that point I might get the Virtue for the stereo speakers and use the Hifimediy for the surround speakers... or replace it all together... <speculates wildly>
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Old 30th April 2011, 11:35 PM   #1580
alkasar is offline alkasar  France
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: near Paris, France
"the bigger power cap the better" is true with linear supply. Not with SMPS.
Big caps are useles with SMPS. Too big caps can harm.

Vitueone comes with huge power caps and ridiculous smps (65W/24V). What is the logic here ?
An A/B comparison of vitueone and a hifimediy T1 + meanwell shows a clear winner, for a fraction of the price
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