Go Back   Home > Forums > >
Home Forums Rules Articles diyAudio Store Blogs Gallery Wiki Register Donations FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Chip Amps Amplifiers based on integrated circuits

My_Ref Fremen Edition - Build thread and tutorial
My_Ref Fremen Edition - Build thread and tutorial
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 26th June 2013, 04:13 PM   #461
pinnocchio is offline pinnocchio  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
pinnocchio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Montreal
Hi Dario,

I powered my first module a few hours ago and it plays music really good. I'm using a 15Vac transfo which I measured to be about 16.5Vac unloaded. All measure points are fine except the -35Vdc and + 35Vdc where I get 21Vdc. I know this is due to my input voltage but I will be having a 4 Ohms load.

The relay won't click but I'm getting only 10Vdc reading on the coil, so I connected my speaker gnd to PGND in the meantime.

Let me know if you have any pointers. So far it seems to be playing really good but I need to let components settle in.

The only thing is that it seems to clip really fast. Should I be using a 22Vac secondaries for 4Ohms load instead of the 15Vac?

Thanks
Do

BTW, the RelCap I bought for C30 fits really nicely in position. You need to gently bend the leads since the spacing is not the same but it is all nice.
__________________
PREAMPs : AMB α10 + USSPA | Bal DCB1 | Bal LDR3x | AMPs: AMB β24 | USSA3 & 5 | TGM8 | VZ Audio NS OPS | NX Amp | FC-100
DACs : TPA BII + OPC's NTD1 I/V | Signalyst DSCv2 | Mirand AK4490 + Discrete Output Speakers : Troels Gravesen ATS-4 | Sagwee LT V3
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th June 2013, 08:15 PM   #462
ClaveFremen is offline ClaveFremen  Italy
Reality first!
diyAudio Member
 
ClaveFremen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Milan, Italy
My_Ref Fremen Edition - Build thread and tutorial
Wow, a lot to answer to...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcmbob View Post
No "Wire Wars" please - but Dario, since you are in the neighborhood, what's your current preference for mains wire from the inlet to the transformer/softstart - assuming there is a significant distance?
Cables cost a lot... and two years ago I've tried some of the chinese clones, some low price (!) Furutechs and Suburra's made OCC aluminum cables.

My favourites are currently Suburra's ones.

I've still to try Acrolink ones, they should be the second best.

If you can find it a real bargain is the XLO Reference 2 clone (see aliexpress or dhgate)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcmbob View Post
Have you detected any audible differences?
Disclaimer:

We're talking about the last 2% of performance, how much you value such tiny differences is highly subjective.

IMHO every cable sound different, also power AC ones but it's strongly dependant on PS topology and quality.

A well designed regulated PS reduces a lot AC cable contribution.

In fact the original My_Ref performance was much more dependant on AC cable quality than the FE but you can still hear differences.

My Sony SACD player's strongly regulated PS seems not so sensitive (if any) to AC cables.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madisonears View Post
You bought cheapo parts from China and they're not what they claim? Who could be surprised by that? I've fallen for that trick a few times myself, but NEVER again.
Chinese eBay seller have a 'creative' way to represent their products and materials they're made of...

BTW not all those parts are bad...

CMC connectors are excellent
XLO Reference 2 clones are excellent
Sonar IEC plugs are excellent (real copper)

On contrast Sonar Shuko plugs are made of brass (declared as copper), they still sound good tough.

For sure none of the Sonar plugs are cryoed...

BTW that IEC inlet was not exactly cheap... I've paid it 10 vs 17 of Furutech FI-03...

Quote:
Originally Posted by madisonears View Post
I believe AC mains wire does not affect sonics as much as AC mains connectors. Just my opinion.
I mostly agree but don't overlook cables, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madisonears View Post
I also have an opinion on the sound of Clarity MR. I recently replaced a pair of Auricap output caps in a friend's tube DAC. (...) as far as I could tell (not an exact comparison), it is not the equal of the film/copper foil TC. I'm sure the differences are subtle, but I think the TC is more vivid without being colored, fuller without being fat, a bit more spacious with slightly better layering and separation.
Interesting.

You see, I'm searching an alternative to TCs for two reasons:
  1. I want a cap that could be fitted on boards and new TCs can't
  2. new TCs are as musical and detailed as old ones but not as neutral/transparent, they add some 'amber' to the sound.
Quote:
Originally Posted by madisonears View Post
I am interested in your impressions after making a direct comparison between them.
I'm curious too...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcmbob View Post
What I have defaulted to till I get more information is to strip out the wires from a good standard PC mains cable and use those
I'm using plain stranded H07V 2 sq mm mains cable with great results.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcmbob View Post
Don't know if using something like a gold plated set would make a difference in the mains path. It seems to me that unless one insures that the metal used in a mains switch and the fuse (even if part of a quality AC inlet) are carefully selected, there is still a fly in the buttermilk.
All those parts could make a (tiny) difference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnocchio View Post
I powered my first module a few hours ago and it plays music really good.
Fine

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnocchio View Post
I'm using a 15Vac transfo which I measured to be about 16.5Vac unloaded. All measure points are fine except the -35Vdc and + 35Vdc where I get 21Vdc.
15V are WAY too low, you should use 21V secondaries

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnocchio View Post
The relay won't click but I'm getting only 10Vdc reading on the coil, so I connected my speaker gnd to PGND in the meantime.
Obviously, with such low voltage secondaries...

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnocchio View Post
Let me know if you have any pointers. So far it seems to be playing really good but I need to let components settle in.
Guess what?

A suggestion...think 21...

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnocchio View Post
The only thing is that it seems to clip really fast. Should I be using a 22Vac secondaries for 4Ohms load instead of the 15Vac?
Absolutely... 21V
__________________
Dario
ClaveFremen "Bailando Salsa en el Sietch" - For My_Ref FE 12th GB extra boards PM me.
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th June 2013, 08:41 PM   #463
pinnocchio is offline pinnocchio  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
pinnocchio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Montreal
Something in my head keeps telling me to buy a 21Vac transfo
__________________
PREAMPs : AMB α10 + USSPA | Bal DCB1 | Bal LDR3x | AMPs: AMB β24 | USSA3 & 5 | TGM8 | VZ Audio NS OPS | NX Amp | FC-100
DACs : TPA BII + OPC's NTD1 I/V | Signalyst DSCv2 | Mirand AK4490 + Discrete Output Speakers : Troels Gravesen ATS-4 | Sagwee LT V3
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th June 2013, 11:12 PM   #464
lehmanhill is offline lehmanhill  United States
diyAudio Member
 
lehmanhill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chelsea, Michigan
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnocchio View Post
Something in my head keeps telling me to buy a 21Vac transfo
I agree, 21 VAC secondaries are a good choice for 4 Ohm speakers. I am also fine using 22 VAC secondaries with 4 Ohm speakers. Mine are Antek torroids, good prices and quality from New York. I suspect you will find what you want in Canada, since there are a lot of good suppliers there, but here is the Antek link, just in case.

http://www.antekinc.com/

By the way, I noticed your list of amps in your signature. COOL! I will be interested in hearing your opinions on the FE. I'm also curious about the Telos 390 Clone. How do you like it?

Jac

Last edited by lehmanhill; 26th June 2013 at 11:16 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th June 2013, 08:26 AM   #465
voxxonline is offline voxxonline  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
voxxonline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Epsom, Surrey
My_Ref Fremen Edition - Build thread and tutorial
Naim has announced new line of hifi gear.
Interesting to see component layout in those boxes.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg naim_supernait-2_inside.jpg (278.4 KB, 267 views)
File Type: jpg naim_nait5si_inside.jpg (136.8 KB, 243 views)
__________________
How to find time to finish my projects ?
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th June 2013, 09:34 AM   #466
spinwell is offline spinwell  Italy
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Italy
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnocchio View Post
Something in my head keeps telling me to buy a 21Vac transfo
I'm using 22VAC single transformer with 4 Ohm speakers and it's ok

ps. for Dario: 9mV and 7.5mV are the DC values on outputs with open in (after less than 2 hours total working)
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th June 2013, 09:46 AM   #467
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
R.I.P.
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Scottish Borders
Spin,
check your output offset with the input shorted to signal ground, then with your Source connected. and with the volume control at various settings.

The output offset is likely to vary at least a little, but what you MUST ensure is finding any combination of possible operation modes that give an unexpected BIG change in output offset.
__________________
regards Andrew T.
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th June 2013, 10:30 AM   #468
fromthecrowd is offline fromthecrowd  Russian Federation
diyAudio Member
 
fromthecrowd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Now My_Ref FE is on the cassis and playing music with RCA cable soldered directly to the fresh stereo pot. I must say it is impressive to say the least! The sound is so natural, the instruments sound absolutely real. Ofcourse after some time the brain will burn in and I'll see possibilities for improvement (at the moment it is just industrial BOM), but now I am absolutely dazzled by the result! And it was so simple to get there. But that is because someone has produced this simplicity for us with his natural talent and hours and hours of work
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th June 2013, 01:25 PM   #469
pinnocchio is offline pinnocchio  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
pinnocchio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Montreal
Quote:
Originally Posted by lehmanhill View Post
I agree, 21 VAC secondaries are a good choice for 4 Ohm speakers. I am also fine using 22 VAC secondaries with 4 Ohm speakers. Mine are Antek torroids, good prices and quality from New York. I suspect you will find what you want in Canada, since there are a lot of good suppliers there, but here is the Antek link, just in case.

Antek - Your reliable source of transformers, power supplies, and more.

By the way, I noticed your list of amps in your signature. COOL! I will be interested in hearing your opinions on the FE. I'm also curious about the Telos 390 Clone. How do you like it?

Jac
Hi Jac,

Yeah, I bought several transfos from Antek through the years but starting to use more and more SumR since they are local and make amazing products. I can request any custom transfos. For the My_ref I just asked for a quote on 4x secondary @ 21Vac. So just using one transfo but still dual mono.

Send me a PM about the Telos 390 clone since I do not want to pollute Dario's thread.

Thanks
Do
__________________
PREAMPs : AMB α10 + USSPA | Bal DCB1 | Bal LDR3x | AMPs: AMB β24 | USSA3 & 5 | TGM8 | VZ Audio NS OPS | NX Amp | FC-100
DACs : TPA BII + OPC's NTD1 I/V | Signalyst DSCv2 | Mirand AK4490 + Discrete Output Speakers : Troels Gravesen ATS-4 | Sagwee LT V3
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th June 2013, 01:35 PM   #470
bcmbob is offline bcmbob  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Bay City, Michigan
Vladimir,

That is a glowing report and I'm sure will serve to encourage others to complete their builds. You will find the upgrades well worth the cost and effort. I was really impressed with what the Munforf AG caps at C101/C102 add to the body and depth of the sound.
__________________
Bob M.
"Arrange Whatever Pieces Come Your Way."

Last edited by bcmbob; 27th June 2013 at 01:39 PM.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


My_Ref Fremen Edition - Build thread and tutorialHide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My_Ref Fremen Edition - Beta build/Fine tuning ClaveFremen Chip Amps 1526 8th October 2017 03:03 PM
My_Ref Fremen Edition RC - Build thread ClaveFremen Chip Amps 1273 4th July 2016 06:21 PM
My_Ref Fremen Edition - need help on PCB evaluation ClaveFremen Chip Amps 450 23rd October 2013 03:38 PM
My_Ref Fremen Edition Interest/Group Buy ClaveFremen Group Buys 348 25th June 2013 09:58 PM
Last My_Ref Fremen Edition RC boards for sale ClaveFremen Swap Meet 3 4th December 2012 01:04 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 11:25 PM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 15.00%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2018 diyAudio
Wiki