-290 dB Distortion?

[jan.didden]

Jan,

The EC is not knowing, there is nothing AI or new here, just inverted output fed back to the input with the level adjusted with a potentiometer.

You know, fiddle with the pot while watching the plot on the analyzer.

Thanks DT

So, this is standard Hawksford then. Pro's and con's clearly known. No -290dB ;-)

Jan

 

[hellokitty123]

I know I said I didn't want to discuss my circuit anymore but I'm interested in this noise conversation. As far as HD performance arguments regarding my circuit go I'm done though.

I figured out why my noise was higher with the EC attached in my earlier sims in response to Hans's inquiries. The EC is making the output noise equal to its own noise. So I lowered the noise of the EC through paralleling components and the noise goes way down.

For my PCB prototype I want to use series/parallel resistors as suggested for the feedback network for reduced noise and distortion, however what do you suggest would be a reasonable amount of series/parallel resistors to achieve X noise/distortion? Vishay metal foil resistance network ICs seems like a good option but they are very expensive and I don't know if they are overkill or not.

Come on! How could changing a scale of a graph change the actual voltage??

Jan

That's not what I meant.

Repeating things which are untrue or confused does not make them true and clear. Looking from our side, we cannot easily tell between someone who will not tell us what he is doing and someone who cannot tell us what he is doing because he doesn't know hmself. You think we don't understand; we are sure we understand only too well.

We are still patiently waiting for you to begin to discuss your circuit. Thus far you have told us nothing about it, apart from some amusing claims about what you think it can do.

Every time you open your mouth you prove my point.

 

[jan.didden]

For my PCB prototype I want to use series/parallel resistors as suggested for the feedback network for reduced noise and distortion, however what do you suggest would be a reasonable amount of series/parallel resistors to achieve X noise/distortion?

Surely you know how to do the sums ??

Jan

 

[chris719]

Surely you know how to do the sums ??

Jan

To be fair, I think he's just asking how many he needs to use to keep the distortion products low, not necessarily the values.

 

[jan.didden]

We are still patiently waiting for you to begin to discuss your circuit. Thus far you have told us nothing about it, apart from some amusing claims about what you think it can do.

I don't think there is anything there.

Jan

 

[scott wurcer]

If you struggle with this simple concept I wonder how you made any EC, let alone one with anything like your wild claims.

You have to admit a lot of folks have been drawn in trying to explain the obvious.

 

[jan.didden]

To be fair, I think he's just asking how many he needs to use to keep the distortion products low, not necessarily the values.

And? Surely it's a simple exercise for someone who claims to have the chops to invent a radical new EC that delivers -290dB ??

Jan

You have to admit a lot of folks have been drawn in trying to explain the obvious.

Yes, but it was fun to see him wiggle ;-)

Jan

 

[hellokitty123]

Sigh, screw you guys. Clearly the point of constructive conversation has ended. I'll take my leave again.

 

[spladski]

If you measure two ropes, one is 123 feet, the other is 234 feet, is it reasonable to state that the two ropes together are 357 feet long, even if you haven't measured them as a single rope? I think it is.

Jan

You have described the source of the problem, which is why we end up with -290dB. If -180db is accepted, then any figure is on the table. One end of the rope is disappearing into the pond.

 

[DualTriode]

So, this is standard Hawksford then. Pro's and con's clearly known. No -290dB ;-)

Jan

Hello,

In my mind not so much Hawksford as Jerald Graeme, at another time in another thread you posted a paper by Graeme. Jerald Graeme published about the same time as Hawksford’s paper and shows the same feedback and feed forward diagrams. Graeme’s books show practical operational-amplifier circuits that I found easily adaptable for me to fabricate.

Thanks for posting Hawksford.

I took a small handful of LM4562 operational amplifiers and screwdriver adjustable pots and did what I thought was magic to a 12B4A headphone amplifier distortion products.

I have thought about feeding forward mains hum to reduce the hum in the output. I have not attempted that yet. As far as I am concerned hum and buzz is the worst.

No -290dB ;-

Thanks DT

 

[MarcelvdG]

For my PCB prototype I want to use series/parallel resistors as suggested for the feedback network for reduced noise and distortion, however what do you suggest would be a reasonable amount of series/parallel resistors to achieve X noise/distortion?
Vishay metal foil resistance network ICs seems like a good option but they are very expensive and I don't know if they are overkill or not.

See post 343 if you are still targeting -290 dB. For each doubling of the voltage across a resistor, D3 should increase by 12 dB and D2 by 6 dB.

 

[spladski]

Modifying Jan's analogy, there is a rope disappearing into a pond. The coil at the bottom of the pond is infinite. You can pull as much rope as you like from the pond ad infinitum. At some point you take a measurement. However, the rope must be returned to its operating place, the use case. Henceforth the only extra rope you will get, is if the level of the pond is lowered.

Otherwise, the deaf dumb and blind kid sure plays a mean pinball.

 

[syn08]

Sigh, screw you guys.

You are welcomed.

 

[davada]

Sigh, screw you guys. Clearly the point of constructive conversation has ended. I'll take my leave again.

Hellokitty123 you just said screw you to the guys that can help you most. The point of constructive conversation began with the first criticism you got here.

These guys are not only educated but have 40+ years of experience. Yet you openly admit to not understanding some of the most basic fundamentals of what you're doing.

You keep telling everyone that they didn't read what you wrote. Well they did read it. The issued is that what you wrote is fundamentally wrong and that is the source of your frustration. Not these gents. They went out of there way to point that out.

If you were to step down from your position, I'll bet these guys would even forgive the screw you and help you with what you're doing.

 

[jazbo8]

Thread closed for maintenance.