Art,
Have you also gone to the other diy manufacturer forums that actively promote and sell their products on their forums here, and tell them essentially the same that you have posted here? Some of those forums are quite active compared to the Aksa forum.
Or have you just singled out this one forum?
Are you familiar with Jason's September 2011 post on the nature of the vendor forums on diyaudio that is referred to in Post #32 in this thread?
$930 AUD per one module?..that will be around $1800 USD for a stereo!...Wow that is insaneThis remains me of the brand BOSE lol.
Do not get me wrong but, with that much money I can build an excellent amp from some of our members here like: Nelson pass, Crazycat, Anthony (Aussie amplifier) or my favorite the M400 from HDamp and still have a lot money left.
That AKSA 80 can be an excellent amp kit, but I do not see, picture or find in my mind that people are willing to pay that much money for an AMP KIT
Even though I will not buy these amp kits, I think if He gets "realistic" and lower the insane price He can get more customers.
Wait a minute !!
Isn't this is a commerical section and the vendor can charge what he likes ? No one is twisting your arm to buy anything from anyone here.
You can pay over 300K for an amp at www.HigherFi.com !! check it out
regards
Trev
can you imagine putting hundreds of hours R&D into a product which is your full time job and then someone telling you what a rip it is?
I know I would loose my temper from time to time too.
Just an interesting thing someone in the industry told me a while ago. I'm not sure how true it is but relevant to this discussion. A certain manufacturers mainframe costs $10 million to buy (can cost a lot more or less depending on the deal) yet they only cost $42K to build. The rest is R&D divided by projected units sold plus margin.
Hello Hugh and other
For long time ago ,i bought a Lifeforce 100...i do not own it anymore,,,but the only reason is the power...for my speaker i need a good deal more. (i use now a gryphon amp 1000w 4ohm)..but i will tell you,,i have newer heard a better diy amp than this Lifeforce..my brother use it now,and is wery happy with this amp..
The reason why i write this,,is to tell those people who said Aksa product cost too much money ,,,,have you ever heard it ??? it is not fair to be mad of the price,,without having heard the amp..i have not heard the new one.. so i will not have any ideer about it..
but i will hope the great musicality from the Lifeforce.. is still in this new amp
maybe some day Hugh,, you will come with a bigger amp..---
Have a nice day
Bjarne
For long time ago ,i bought a Lifeforce 100...i do not own it anymore,,,but the only reason is the power...for my speaker i need a good deal more. (i use now a gryphon amp 1000w 4ohm)..but i will tell you,,i have newer heard a better diy amp than this Lifeforce..my brother use it now,and is wery happy with this amp..
The reason why i write this,,is to tell those people who said Aksa product cost too much money ,,,,have you ever heard it ??? it is not fair to be mad of the price,,without having heard the amp..i have not heard the new one.. so i will not have any ideer about it..
but i will hope the great musicality from the Lifeforce.. is still in this new amp
maybe some day Hugh,, you will come with a bigger amp..---
Have a nice day
Bjarne
Thanks Guys,
Much appreciated.
The NAKSA 80 was developed prior to July 2012, just before I suffered an aortic aneurisym. I was in a coma for almost a month, and when I came through I could not speak or write. I didn't mind the damage to the body, I'm 62 now and age is inevitable, but I used the next six month during my recovery to prove to myself that my brain could work.
Because audio is my life, I loved the work. But moving from the prototype/proof version to production layout took me during the time from Sep 12 until May 13, and there was a lot of work and organisation in difficult circumstances. I had a lot of encouragement and a couple of very, very clever, helpful friends, and they helped with the tested, organisation, and numerous visits. At the time I was helping with a proaudio design, which is now a reality too, and one is used by our national broadcasting, the ABC.
The NAKSA 80 is the last design, and is up to the minute with sonic performance. Perhaps I put into 300 hours, it's hard to put a figure. But for people who think it's too expensive, then they should never buy it. I won't buy a Benz AMG 6.3 either, but I can dream...... at least my amps are affordable, perhaps I'm the fool.
My daughter works for a fashion accessory company in NYC. She tells me they have a $40K crocodile handbag - and they well well. In our area, regard D'Agostino's latest amp - I think they are about $50K (or maybe more?). Good luck to him. If he sell them most people of us will be amazed, but there are plenty of wealthy people around.
I've done my 10,000 hours, and I've done my dues. I have something with my amps that I believe are quite something, and I won't give up now!!
I really need to get my throw headache, it's driving me mad..... to all my customers, please indulge me a few more days, I'm spending most of my day in darkened bedroom, the legacy of my illness last year.
Bjarne, I'm working with bigger amps, count on it!!
It would be great if the thread could get back to the original topic!!
Cheers,
Hugh
Much appreciated.
The NAKSA 80 was developed prior to July 2012, just before I suffered an aortic aneurisym. I was in a coma for almost a month, and when I came through I could not speak or write. I didn't mind the damage to the body, I'm 62 now and age is inevitable, but I used the next six month during my recovery to prove to myself that my brain could work.
Because audio is my life, I loved the work. But moving from the prototype/proof version to production layout took me during the time from Sep 12 until May 13, and there was a lot of work and organisation in difficult circumstances. I had a lot of encouragement and a couple of very, very clever, helpful friends, and they helped with the tested, organisation, and numerous visits. At the time I was helping with a proaudio design, which is now a reality too, and one is used by our national broadcasting, the ABC.
The NAKSA 80 is the last design, and is up to the minute with sonic performance. Perhaps I put into 300 hours, it's hard to put a figure. But for people who think it's too expensive, then they should never buy it. I won't buy a Benz AMG 6.3 either, but I can dream...... at least my amps are affordable, perhaps I'm the fool.
My daughter works for a fashion accessory company in NYC. She tells me they have a $40K crocodile handbag - and they well well. In our area, regard D'Agostino's latest amp - I think they are about $50K (or maybe more?). Good luck to him. If he sell them most people of us will be amazed, but there are plenty of wealthy people around.
I've done my 10,000 hours, and I've done my dues. I have something with my amps that I believe are quite something, and I won't give up now!!
I really need to get my throw headache, it's driving me mad..... to all my customers, please indulge me a few more days, I'm spending most of my day in darkened bedroom, the legacy of my illness last year.
Bjarne, I'm working with bigger amps, count on it!!
It would be great if the thread could get back to the original topic!!
Cheers,
Hugh
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Since we live in global free world market, every seller or manufacturer has a chance to state the price, how he or she or company management wants. The same goes for customers or buyers this days. He or she will decide, where wants to spend their money and for what price. In this days of google, making a decision was never before easier.
As regard the prices...the truth is in the eye of beholder. Some people are happy driving VW mk7 Golf instead of high salary, as on the other side, some folks wants Porsche or AMG. Anyway...normally we make a opinion on car after ride. The same should go on audio, right?
As regard the prices...the truth is in the eye of beholder. Some people are happy driving VW mk7 Golf instead of high salary, as on the other side, some folks wants Porsche or AMG. Anyway...normally we make a opinion on car after ride. The same should go on audio, right?
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Hugh,
This new amp sounds exciting, you've made some further changes in your approach here by using a pair of MOSFETs in the output. Can you tell us more about this, what was your thinking behind this and the kind of 'sound' you were looking to achieve ?
I think also you continue to emphasize the importance of the power supply and by integrating it with the amp you are able to guarantee good results - is this correct ?
I received my two NAKSA 80s some days ago, but unfortunately life has gotten in the way of me starting to install them in my system ...
However, I completely agree with the other posters here, who have seen the N80s "in the flesh" - it's a beautiful amp, and I just love that red colour on the PCB!
With regard to pricing - well, everyone is allowed to form their own opinion, but no one should be allowed to express it in such an insulting and agressive manner as we have seen from a few m....s here - in any forum. And even more so since this is a Manufacturers Forum, which means that Hugh is actually paying money to have this forum!
My personal opinion on Hugh's prices is that they are very reasonable indeed, considering the high sound quality of his products. Granted, you do not get fancy cabinetry or volume knobs weighing several hundred grams, but if you can live without all the fancy stuff (and some can even make this themselves), you get amps that deliver music in spades
These are not traditional hi-fi amps - these are amps for music lovers!
I for one am looking very much forward to listening to the NAKSA 80s - I am certain they are marvellous
Cheers,
Jens
However, I completely agree with the other posters here, who have seen the N80s "in the flesh" - it's a beautiful amp, and I just love that red colour on the PCB!
With regard to pricing - well, everyone is allowed to form their own opinion, but no one should be allowed to express it in such an insulting and agressive manner as we have seen from a few m....s here - in any forum. And even more so since this is a Manufacturers Forum, which means that Hugh is actually paying money to have this forum!
My personal opinion on Hugh's prices is that they are very reasonable indeed, considering the high sound quality of his products. Granted, you do not get fancy cabinetry or volume knobs weighing several hundred grams, but if you can live without all the fancy stuff (and some can even make this themselves), you get amps that deliver music in spades
These are not traditional hi-fi amps - these are amps for music lovers!
I for one am looking very much forward to listening to the NAKSA 80s - I am certain they are marvellous
Cheers,
Jens
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Wow, what an unBlievable post.
I am speechless ... so cannot make any further response.Regards,
Andy
My car can usually leave some exotics for dead in terms of performace, at a fraction of the price,
Same for my Hifi,
My Aksa 100 and now Naksa 100 coupled with my GK1R will leave most exotic audio embarrassed. I listened and so I bought.
I encourage othes to do the same......when possible.
I choose value over nameplate, and intelligent and passionate design is always of value.
Rick
Same for my Hifi,
My Aksa 100 and now Naksa 100 coupled with my GK1R will leave most exotic audio embarrassed. I listened and so I bought.
I encourage othes to do the same......when possible.
I choose value over nameplate, and intelligent and passionate design is always of value.
Rick
Thanks Jens, Andy and Rick,
Bottom line; if you think the NAKSA is too expensive, no problem, just pass!
Bigun,
Thanks for your post.
Yes, by putting the power supply right near the amp has some benefits. It seems to make it quicker, and you can improve even more with small filter capacitors.
The input and VAS stages of the NAKSA are single ended, Class A of course. Input is singleton, so you can assume that it uses current feedback.
The drive to the mosfet permits more output power to clip; it enables kicking the gates a bit higher/lower. There is a constant power buffer between the VAS and the output driver stage. I decided to go with complementary mosfets again so I could more precisely control the H2 and H3 harmonics. Finally, there is a reduction in global NFB, which of course increases the H2/H3/H4, but reduces the trail of higher artefacts.
As this is a commercial product I prefer not to go any more detail. Maybe in a few years!
Cheers,
Hugh
Bottom line; if you think the NAKSA is too expensive, no problem, just pass!
Bigun,
Thanks for your post.
Yes, by putting the power supply right near the amp has some benefits. It seems to make it quicker, and you can improve even more with small filter capacitors.
The input and VAS stages of the NAKSA are single ended, Class A of course. Input is singleton, so you can assume that it uses current feedback.
The drive to the mosfet permits more output power to clip; it enables kicking the gates a bit higher/lower. There is a constant power buffer between the VAS and the output driver stage. I decided to go with complementary mosfets again so I could more precisely control the H2 and H3 harmonics. Finally, there is a reduction in global NFB, which of course increases the H2/H3/H4, but reduces the trail of higher artefacts.
As this is a commercial product I prefer not to go any more detail. Maybe in a few years!
Cheers,
Hugh
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Absolootely, Rick!
However, some people (as we have seen here) have different values. They think DIY = cheap ... they have no interest in the sound of the product. Hehe, but Rick ... you really need to upgrade to the GK-2!
Regards,
Andy
The biggest difference between DIY and commercial design ( and ultimately manufacture!) is that you don't have the kind of pressure on you that comes with commercial ventures. One still need's to rack one's brain to understand things and achieve whatever it is one wants and try and make a product that one thinks is equal to or better than what one can generally afford to buy.
So the end cost is usually very high because of one's own time and effort which goes into making one or just a few ( identical) units. So no one can object to how much some design is sold for because it wasn't designed to 'order' and costs have to be recovered over the units that could be sold!
No one HAS to buy it. So Hugh can charge whatever he wants for his design and he isn't even asking anyone here to buy it ! Price is always related to perceived value . So if one likes the amp and finds it equal to or better than one's costing several times more , it would be well worth the price. If not , we have the freedom to walk away and look for something better. There's nothing to complain about.
So the end cost is usually very high because of one's own time and effort which goes into making one or just a few ( identical) units. So no one can object to how much some design is sold for because it wasn't designed to 'order' and costs have to be recovered over the units that could be sold!
No one HAS to buy it. So Hugh can charge whatever he wants for his design and he isn't even asking anyone here to buy it ! Price is always related to perceived value . So if one likes the amp and finds it equal to or better than one's costing several times more , it would be well worth the price. If not , we have the freedom to walk away and look for something better. There's nothing to complain about.
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Joined 2009
Paid Member
The economics of the audio industry deserves a separate thread - it's an interesting topic and Hugh likely has just as many insights in this area as the technical side. But I thought this thread might be about the new NAKSA - the design philosophy, some hints about the design, listening impressions, getting the most out of it system-wise etc.
Now in the process of replacing my NAKSA 70s with the new NAKSA 80s.
For ease of transportation, I ordered my NAKSA 80s without heatsinks, since they use exactly the same heatsinks and drillings as the NAKSA 70s, and I have just moved the first NAKSA 80 onto the existing heatsink, as can be seen in the attached photo.
Everything fitted nicely!
Hope to be able to move on to the second NAKSA 80 later today ...
Cheers,
Jens
For ease of transportation, I ordered my NAKSA 80s without heatsinks, since they use exactly the same heatsinks and drillings as the NAKSA 70s, and I have just moved the first NAKSA 80 onto the existing heatsink, as can be seen in the attached photo.
Everything fitted nicely!
Hope to be able to move on to the second NAKSA 80 later today ...
Cheers,
Jens
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