Two 10"inch and two 12" inch subwoofers and what to do??

[Gentle1Man]

Two 10"inch and two 12" inch subwoofers and what to do??

I have two ten inch subwoofers and two ten inch subwoofers. I want to build two boxes for them. Would a box with a ten and a twelve sealed from each other. I want them to be as accurate as possible.
Thanks

Infinity Perfect 10.1
Size 10 -inch
Impedance 4 ohms
Cone Material Aluminum
Surround Material Butyl rubber
Sealed Box Volume (cubic feet) 0.6
Ported Box Volume (cubic feet) 1
Port diameter (inches) 3
Port length (inches) 10.4
Free-Air Yes
Dual Voice Coil No
Sensitivity 94dB
Frequency Response 18 - 0.2k Hz
RMS Power Range (Watts) 75-350
Peak Power Handling (Watts) 1400
Top Mount Depth (inches) 5 13/16
Bottom Mount Depth (inches) 6 1/2
Cutout Diameter or Length (inches) 9
Vas (liters) 32.13
Fs (Hz) 28.35
Qts 0.42
Xmax (millimeters) 14.15
Parts Warranty 3 Years
Labor Warranty 3 Years

10"
THIELE-SMALL PARAMETERS
VOICE COIL DC RESISTANCE: REVC (OHMS) . . . . . . 4.11
VOICE COIL INDUCTANCE @ 1 KHZ: LEVC (MH). . . . . . . . 2.96
DRIVER RADIATING AREA: SD (IN2) . . . . . . . . 53.40
SD (CM2). . . . . . . 346.00
MOTOR FORCE FACTOR: BL (TM) . . . . . . . . 16.64
COMPLIANCE VOLUME: VAS (FT3). . . . . . . . . 1.36
VAS (LITERS). . . . . . 32.13
SUSPENSION COMPLIANCE: CMS (ìM/N) . . . . 189.00
MOVING MASS, AIR LOAD: MMS (GRAMS) . . . . 166.71
MOVING MASS, DIAPHRAGM: MMD (GRAMS). . . . 163.01
FREE-AIR RESONANCE: FS (HZ) . . . . . . . . 28.35
MECHANICAL Q: QMS. . . . . . . . . . . . 8.83
ELECTRICAL Q: QES . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.44
TOTAL Q: QTS . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.42
MAGNETIC-GAP HEIGHT: HAG (IN) . . . . . . . . . 0.39
HAG (MM) . . . . . . . . 9.80
VOICE-COIL HEIGHT: HVC (IN) . . . . . . . . . 1.50
HVC (MM) . . . . . . . 38.10
MAXIMUM EXCURSION: XMAX (IN) . . . . . . . . 0.56
XMAX (MM). . . . . . . 14.15


Infinity Kappa Perfect 12.1 12" 4-ohm subwoofer
Size 12 -inch
Impedance 4 ohms
Cone Material Aluminum
Surround Material Butyl rubber
Sealed Box Volume (cubic feet) 1
Ported Box Volume (cubic feet) 1.75
Port diameter (inches) 4
Port length (inches) 12.33
Free-Air Yes
Dual Voice Coil No
Sensitivity 96dB
Frequency Response 18 - 0.2k Hz
RMS Power Range (Watts) 75-350
Peak Power Handling (Watts) 1400
Top Mount Depth (inches) 6 1/8
Bottom Mount Depth (inches) 6 7/8
Cutout Diameter or Length (inches) 10 15/16
Vas (liters) 83.28
Fs (Hz) 23.32
Qts 0.44
Xmax (millimeters) 14.15

12"
THIELE-SMALL PARAMETERS
VOICE COIL DC RESISTANCE: REVC (OHMS) . . . . . . 4.00
VOICE COIL INDUCTANCE @ 1 KHZ: LEVC (MH) . . . . . . . 3.05
DRIVER RADIATING AREA: SD (IN2) . . . . . . . . 81.94
SD (CM2) . . . . . . 531.00
MOTOR FORCE FACTOR: BL (TM) . . . . . . . . 16.90
COMPLIANCE VOLUME: VAS (FT3) . . . . . . . . 3.53
VAS (LITERS) . . . . . 99.97
SUSPENSION COMPLIANCE: CMS (ìM/N) . . . . 208.00
MOVING MASS, AIR LOAD: MMS (GRAMS). . . . 224.00
MOVING MASS, DIAPHRAGM: MMD (GRAMS) . . . 216.96
FREE-AIR RESONANCE: FS (HZ) . . . . . . . . 23.32
MECHANICAL Q: QMS . . . . . . . . . . 10.28
ELECTRICAL Q: QES . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.46
TOTAL Q: QTS . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.44
MAGNETIC-GAP HEIGHT: HAG (IN) . . . . . . . . . 0.39
HAG (MM) . . . . . . . . 9.80
VOICE-COIL HEIGHT: HVC (IN) . . . . . . . . . 1.50
HVC (MM) . . . . . . . 38.10
MAXIMUM EXCURSION: XMAX (IN) . . . . . . . . 0.56
XMAX (MM) . . . . . . 14.15

 

[Cal Weldon]

Hi,

Please tell us your thoughts behind using two different woofers. This is a non-standard practice and it's something I would avoid. Two woofers covering the same frequencies will sound different and it will be very hard to achieve anything accurate because of that.

 

[tinitus]

3.5way

 

[judtoff]

IMHO sell all 4 and then get something that is more suitable for your application(whatever it is).

Those are decent drivers, but finding one thats more application specific might be better. IIRC they are car audio subs anyways.

get some dayton titanics the HiVi 10" sub it looks potent.

 

[Gentle1Man]

I was thinking two sealed enclosures. Two with tens and two with twelves. Used as subwoofers. Do you think this is a problem???

 

[Gentle1Man]

Correction. Four sealed enclosures. A ten inch on top of a twelve inch enclosure on each side under my bookshelf speakers.

 

[Thawach]

hi Gentle1Man


i cannot see the quality with your design. The spl may be high too much more than your bookshelf speaker. sometime you must adjust the volume's lower.


regards

 

[PeteMcK]

Here's a way different drivers have been combined before (by Thorsten, iirc):

http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/xentar/1179/theory/dddllqd/dddllqd.html

Your woofers are fairly similar in everything except Vas, so the 'compound driver' approach should work...

 

[Moondog55]

What's the problem here? Try it and see if it works, put the drivers in series to make an easy load for the amp, the Qts is close enough as is resonance. Chip board is cheap enough, but use one volume. I have a vented quad box here I use for parties, uses different size woofers with similar resonant frequencies, it breaks all sorts of "RULES" but manages to sound loud and strong, with no nasty discordances.
try 2 X 15 plus 2 X 12 nominal ^ohms load to the amp in a 250 litre ported box. Impotant thing here it was an experiment that "worked"

regards Ted

 

[Corax]

Hi Gentle1Man,

according to the TSPs they are all heavy coned car speakers which aren't really capable of reproducing anything above 200Hz IMHO though. I still wonder about the SPLs given in the tables you provided - 94dB for 10" and 96dB for 12"?! At what frequency are they measured. Do you have a frequency plot handy?
Car chassis do go deep down in frequency easily (sometimes even below 20Hz) but with the cost of sound pressure level. That's the reason why enthusiasts desperately need so many kilowatts in their cars to get the (car)body shaking.

My advice would be to use either the 10" or the 12" chassis depending on your desire to get a little more SPL below 30Hz (then use the 12" - diameter is all that matters for sound reproduction at low frequencies) or a smaller enclosure (then the 10" might be the better choice). Neither one has a really noticable advantage over the other one.

My favourite design for such subwoofers would be the following:
Use two chassis in a vented enclosure (preferably bass reflex - with the duct pointing to the floor for instance or on the others sides, or ...) which are mounted on opposing sides. Provide the "cube" with a plate mounted active subwoofer electronic (available in various (internet-)shops) and with various power ratings and amplifier topology. I like those class-D kinda things, because of their less weight and outstanding performance besides efficiency (no big heat sink).

 

[Gentle1Man]

Here is all the info, follow the link.

http://manuals.harman.com/INF/CAR/Boxes and Parameters/Perfect10_1.pdf

http://manuals.harman.com/INF/CAR/Boxes and Parameters/KAPPA PERFECT 12-1 Enclosure Sheet.pdf

Would it be louder to use the tens with the twelves or could I tell a difference.

 

[Moondog55]

If you mount and wire in series you will lose 3dB, thats quite a lot, but you will gain in power handling and the sound may very well be different, you will only really know when you do it and listen.
I have heard those drivers a while ago, quite good for a car subbie/ have you thoughtr of using them in a quad box? you would get the 3dB back use a decent plate amp ( Class D?) 1000watts should do it but should then fill a biggish room.

Personally I would use a sealed box, fairly big Q= 0.7 at least.
regards Ted

 

[bjorno]

Hi Gentle1Man,

Your 10" drivers should suit this box:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1436141#post1436141

See also the picture 1(1) where a slightly larger box is shown to fit your 12” drivers.

b

1(1)

 

[richie00boy]

Build a box for the tens and another box for the twelves. See which suits your application best then sell the spare drivers and box or just smash the box up or burn it or whatever

Running both kinds of drivers will likely produce a low quality boom sound.

 

[Cal Weldon]

Running both kinds of drivers will likely produce a low quality boom sound.

Agreed.

 

[leadbelly]

Well, here's what *I* would try in this situation (what's one more opinion ) :

1) 10" in a pair of sealed enclosures.

2) 12" in a pair of vented enclosures tuned as low as possible.

3) Steep active crossover slopes, say 6th order, to keep them from interacting with each other. Unfortunately, that 10" doesn't look like it has a nice top end, so you'll need to use a steep crossover on that side too.

 

[Moondog55]

Respectfully I disagree; the 12 inch has very high Qms, perfect candidate for a first order highpass and using complementary drivers in a simple sealed box does have a history, especially if one is used as a :filler: for the low low bass.
Yes they are car subbies and should be rolled off early, I'm guessing 80-120 Hz, but putting a first order low pass from the 10 to the 12 and using a simple capacitor bank as well would not be boomy in terms of one note bass, admitted that this aproach would need seperate sealed boxes for each driver.

 

[leadbelly]

You're obviously a car audio guy, right?

 

[Moondog55]

Actually NO! I do not even own a car. It's just that Hi-Fi woofers are soooo expensive here in OZ that I tend to experiment with what is cheap and some of those experiments have turned out quite well.

 

[Gentle1Man]

I have each twelve in a 1.55 cu ft sealed box at the moment under each bookshelf speaker with 250 watts ran in a series so 125 watts apiece. The sound to the amp comes out of the LFE output on my Sony receiver. I have noticed that I am missing some of my upper bass. I guess it is the speakers only going up to 200 hz. So I might need different woofers. What are some suggestions for some 15's or 12's in two sealed boxes. I like speakers with high sensitivity.


I have the two tens left over from my old tower speakers. I seemed to miss some upper bass on them with the tens.


Thanks Y' all, All the input is helpful.