Turntable Reliability and the Dual 1249

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henrylrjr

henrylrjr

Member
Joined 2012
#1
There were many brands of direct drive TTs in the 70s and 80s. Among many others, Micro Seiki, Luxman, Denon, Technics and Pioneer seem to have been highly regarded back then. What of those brands were considered most reliable?

Thanks
 
#2
I bought a Dual 1249 new around 1975 and it still sounds very good. My question is it's spec.. for rumble. Dual lists it as 63dB weighted and it has had many very good reviews. Other TTs made in the 70s have SNR values of 75 and 78dB. Did Dual use a different standard?
 
#6
I have a Dual 1237. Its only noticeable flaw is wow on long sustained notes.

The other problems are fixable or tolerable: the intermittent headshell contacts, the pitch is right at +3, the motor damping capacitor burns out, and the VTA is right only on the fourth stacked record.
Ed
 
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#7
Excellent, seems a perfect fit Ed !
and this review aligns with that too 🙂
especially like "the device keeps evolving or changing its state and comes with more advanced features"
Darwin would be most impressed....
and...
"Tonearm: The tonearm consists of many things that include; tubular aluminum, and it adjusts itself. Also, it has torsion resistance. It is also pre-fitted with around a four-point gimbal bearing. The bearing distinguishes it from other devices that perform the same function."

However the O/P may take heart from the reviewers measurement...
"Rumble: Its rumble is 60 db when you weigh it and if you don’t weigh is around 40db. "

and not to skip over this advice..
"You’ll need to be able to set aside a clean, safe, and long-lasting location for your new audio equipment.
If you leave a turntable on the floor or somewhere else risky, you risk damaging your investment and possibly the record on the platter."

https://audiogadgetreviews.com/dual-1237/
 
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#10
My dual 1249 is set at 1.5g and I thought I could check it out by putting a 1.5g weight on the counterweight, and if the counterweight marking was accurate the tonearm would float off the tonearm rest. It didn't. I then used a 2.0g weight...no float and finally a 5,0g weight and still no float. Why no float?

Thanks
 
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#11
Would only work if the counterweight position was as far away from the pivot as the needle. I think what may work is put the 1.5G on the headshell, set the weight to "0" and have it float. Remove the counterweight and adjust the weight of the counterweight to 1.5G. The arm should float. You removed 1.5G weight and added 1.5G via counterweight for a net change of 0, so arm should still float. I think...
 
#13
I set the tracking force dial to 0, put a 1.5g weight on the head shell and turned the counterweight ring until the tonearm floated horizontally. I'm getting a Neotech tracking force scale and will be interesting to see what happens when I set the dial to 1.5g.
 
#14
Why that effort? Just set the tracking force dial to zero, adjust the counterweight to get the tonearm floating, then let the conterweight alone. Tracking force is applied exclusively by a spiral spring behind (or within) the dial. If you want to check it's accuracy, set it to some certain value and check with the help of a tracking force scale.

Best regards!
 
#15
I agree and will set the dial to 0 and turn the tracking force ring until the arm floats. When I get the neotech scale I can check it out by putting my weights on it. They are laboratory grade weights used with an analytical balance. And then check out the Dual tracking force dial accuracy.
 
#16
I own a Hitachi HT350 from the 70s. Direct drive, strobe, auto return.
For me its the best I've ever heard. Heard you can get a lot of these for peanuts used. And all they need are new caps and some grease.
Had to re-cap it and freshen up the grease. Play with some trimpots to get the speed control to work.
Love it.
Why so complex. I get it to float. And then touch the digital scale surface. The scale has a range off 0-50 grams.
Get it to read 0.001 with the head just touching it. Then dial in 2 Grams.Or whatever weight you want. Use the needle guard if you want. Just factor its weight in.
 
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#17
I found this Dual 1249 info on worldradiohistory.com. "The rumble measurement, alluded to before, is -63 /2 dB by the CBS-ARLL method. ANSI/IEEE peak wow is very low at 0.05% average and 0.08% maximum". What would the CBS-ARLL value be if converted to SNR DIN-B.
Thanks
 
#20
I found this Dual 1249 info on worldradiohistory.com. "The rumble measurement, alluded to before, is -63 /2 dB by the CBS-ARLL method. ANSI/IEEE peak wow is very low at 0.05% average and 0.08% maximum". What would the CBS-ARLL value be if converted to SNR DIN-B.

I've been asking about SNR standards and searching for info because I thought a Technics or Pioneer direct drive table with rumble/SNR spec.s of 73dB to 78dB might sound noticeably better than my Daul 1249 that I bought new in 1975. Its rumble spec is listed as 63dB so I was going to sell it and buy a DD TT. However, after reading answers and finding the documents it seems the Dual rumble would be around 75dB A weighted. I'm glad I got hung up on the spec.s because now I'm keeping the Dual. It has always sounded good to me.
 
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