Technics versus Pioneer rumble specs

I'm thinking of buying a NOS Japanese direct drive TT but I'm confused with their spec.s. Many dd Technics had wow and flutter of .025% and rumble numbers like 78dB. Pioneer TTs had similar wow and flutter of .025% but rumble of 70dB. Did Pioneer used a different rumble standard. It seems like Pioneer spec.s put it at a disadvantage.
thanks
 
The rumble figures are unlikely to be comparable between the different makes of turntable and I woudn't put too much emphasis on them.

I read that -80 dB is very good, but how is that measured?

To qualify as a transcription turntable for use in radio, television and recording studios back in the old days, rumble had to be better than -32 dB relative to 1 kHz at a recorded velocity of 1 cm/s.

So, there's your thread bump - over to the turntable experts! :geek:
 
Having to read between the lines I must ask - do you already own a Dual 1249?

Do you really have access to a NOS (New Old Stock), i.e., unused Japanese turntable, and has it been fully tested?

Comparing the two turntables you mention is a bit like comparing chalk and cheese.

With the Pioneer PL-707 you may encounter problems with its sophisticated electronics...

1692801400733.png



1692799660853.png


...and with the Dual 1249 you may encounter problems of a mechanical nature. Personally, I'd be happier dealing with the latter.

Whatever your preference, I don't advise buying a NOS turntable without seeing that it is fully working. A least a NOS turntable, provided it is still coddled in its original manufacturer's packaging, would be less subject to damage in transit if it has to be posted to you.
 
If you've serviced that Dual 1249 from new and it is in "excellent condition", then you should be a happy bunny.

Perhaps a cartridge upgrade would be a more economical way of improving the sound?

However, you do have a high end system which certainly would justify a more sophisticated turntable.

You haven't explained the NOS stature of the Pioneer PL-707. If I were spending loads of cash I'd err on the side of caution and purchase a TT which carried a current manufacturer's guarantee rather than one that dated back to the early 1980s and lacked one.
 
I bought the PL-707. It looks great and it was serviced which included putting in a new tonearm belt and cleaning all internal contacts. Photos included internal pics and it looked spotless. The seller has 100% feedback and their turntable tech quickly answered all my questions. Got my fingers crossed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
The PL-707 arrives tomorrow so tonight I'm listening to my favorite jazz station ( FM91.3) on my Magnum Dynalab ft 101A Fm tuner. I forgot how good the sound is.
It is here and is looks and sounds very good even with a used ADC QLM mklll cartridge. I put it together, leveled it and set tracking and anti skate. I also checked cart alignment with a Pioneer PL-707arc protractor and it was good, I put an LP on it, plugged it in and started it in auto mode and everything worked perfectly. I didn't connect it to my presamp because I first wanted to see if it would work for a couple of hours. Now I have this question. I was surprised that I could clearly hear Hubert Laws playing flute from about three feet away. When I got within a foot with the dust cover open, I could hear Laws and the rest of his group. I know this LP very well and it sounded great even at a low volume. Is that normal?
 
I replaced the QLM 30mklll with a very good condition Grado Prestige Blue and I can still hear the music but it is much quieter. The ADC QLM 30 mklll ouptut is 4.5vM and the Grado is 5.0mV. Why is the Grado quieter?
Needle talk is normal, but will vary among different cartridges.
If this bothers you, keep the dust cover closed when playing, or try a different cartridge.
It doesn't bother me, I just never heard it before because I never played a TT that wasn't connected to a preamp.
 
I set up the 707 with a Creek phono preamp connected to an Aragon 18K mk2 for testing. I just wanted to feel comfortable that it is in mechanically good condition before I put it in the closet with the Audible Illusions M3A system. So, I've played it for two days and love the sound. However, one thing seemed unusual. When leveling it, I put my high precision level on the platter and got it spot on, then rotated the platter and it was off at 180, 270 and zero. I put a precision straight edge on the platter surface and there is a slight dishing. I played with the feet and it is now level at all positions. I expected the platter surface to be dead flat. FYi, I know what flat is. I have a small machine shop with a granite surface plate that is calibrated as flat within .00005, and was an approved vendor.