Poll: Cymbals of different sampling rates listening test

Which cymbal sample is the original?

  • A1 B1 C1

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A1 B1 C2

    Votes: 2 12.5%
  • A1 B2 C1

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A1 B2 C2

    Votes: 1 6.3%
  • A2 B1 C1

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A2 B1 C2

    Votes: 1 6.3%
  • A2 B2 C1

    Votes: 2 12.5%
  • A2 B2 C2

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I can't hear any difference

    Votes: 10 62.5%

  • Total voters
    16
Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.
UPDATE (10 January 2020): The result is now presented in post #24 including decryption key for the encrypted text in post #2.


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A simple listening test, in this poll we have 3 randomly selected cymbal samples divided into pairs.
Each pair, for instance A1 and A2, are of the same cymbal sample but with the difference that one of them have undergone a re-sampling, ditto with the pairs B1 B2 and C1 C2, each sample is only 2 seconds long.

Your task is to pick the real deal from each of all 3 pairs, ie. the original cymbal sample in each pair, and cast your vote without in beforehand inspect and/or analyze the files in any way or form that could reveal eventual differences.
It has to be pointed out that the differences between the two samples within one pair is quite small and may be indistinguishable on a lower quality audio reproduction system such as listening through laptop speakers, it's advised in such case to at least use headphones/earbuds.



PS. Due to limitation of this forum, the .WAV sample files file extension had to be changed to .MP4 in order to allow uploading, however many media players (VLC..) will play the files fine without the correct file extension, but one could of course change the extension from .MP4 back to .WAV to be on the sure side.

PS2. Cymbal samples are from:
Welcome Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity
Cymbal Reviews with Spectral Analysis | Drummerworld Forum

PS3. The poll is anonymous, even I as the thread starter can not see who have taken part in the poll.
 

Attachments

  • A1.mp4
    2 MB
  • A2.mp4
    2 MB
  • B1.mp4
    2 MB
  • B2.mp4
    2 MB
  • C1.mp4
    2 MB
  • C2.mp4
    2 MB
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Additional info

Below we have an AES256 encrypted text, it contains a short information how the re-sampling was done and which of each pair is the unaltered original cymbal sample, and which is the re-sampled.

After some 10 votes or so I will post the decryption key so anyone can check for themselves, ie. thus I can not steer the voting and manipulate the outcome.

The encryption was done on AES encryption
and is the site where one can also decrypt the encrypted text.

Code:
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


Just in case I attached the encrypted text as a file.
 

Attachments

  • AES_1578011111280.txt
    1.5 KB · Views: 18

TNT

Member
Joined 2003
Paid Member
I listened to some. Even took an ABX for B1/B2. Could not confidently discriminate between B1 and B2. But still, I think I could hear a difference - maybe. I did a spectral anlysis - there seem to be differences below 20k, even at 5k, but I'm not sure it's not Audiacity?

What re-sampler did you use at what settings? A resampler is like the filter in a DAC - it really effects the "output" ;-)

//
 
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@TNT

Interesting, but yes the difference isn't in your face, have to listen very carefully, can say so much I did use Audacity too, who knows what's going on, let's soon find out! :)


@wrinkle

You are welcome, looking forward to hear from you again when you have done the listening test with a better DAC.
Edit: I hope you do not listen directly from the laptop speakers, the differences between the samples are quite small, you better would do it using headphones at least.
 
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I listened to some. Even took an ABX for B1/B2. Could not confidently discriminate between B1 and B2. But still, I think I could hear a difference - maybe. I did a spectral anlysis - there seem to be differences below 20k, even at 5k, but I'm not sure it's not Audiacity?

What re-sampler did you use at what settings? A resampler is like the filter in a DAC - it really effects the "output" ;-)

//
Same thing here. "I think I could hear a difference" (I just listened on my PC, because my listening room is not heated and it is winter, here ;-).
In any case, not enough to be classified as a real matter in my book.

Something sounded strange to me: the feeling that there is some sound that precede the impacts of the sticks (that are not enough underlined on my taste on all the samples). Like if the impact was done while the cymbals were still resonating from a previous hit ?
Or an effect of the reconstruction filters ? (not enough silence before, and not enough length)
Anyway, I need to have enough silence and room atmosphere before the hit on the cymbals for my brain can put the things in the room's space.
Anyway, let me try, without to be able to say what the originals are and their copies, I feel the same kind of differences between A1, B2 and C1 and A2, B1 and C2.
 
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I listened on my chromebook using Grado SR80 headphones. Everytime I played them they seemed to sound different, probably due to focusing on different parts, forced to focus on very small areas each time because the samples are so short and cut off. Bottom line I couldn't tell the difference between the two samples.
 
They usually find an excuse not to participate......don't they, Mark, Richard?....etc...

How about a test to see if you can hear the resampler algorithm?
I would suggest solo and choral vocals, since the human brain is more sensitive to that sort of thing.

Cymbals are very different. I recorded some here at 24/192 just recently and couldn't properly play them back on my laptop, they came out very distorted (maybe because no LP filter was used when recording, and there was some very LF cymbal sound). Played fine on Richards M2s though.

My guess would be if people do hear a difference in the cymbal test here it would likely be due to resampler artifacts. If so, how could you make a conclusion about the cymbals and US?
 
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I listened on my chromebook using Grado SR80 headphones. Everytime I played them they seemed to sound different, probably due to focusing on different parts, forced to focus on very small areas each time because the samples are so short and cut off. Bottom line I couldn't tell the difference between the two samples.
That is exactly why I dislike the "Blind listening ABX" religion that our service muezzin serine us in loop at each of his posts: that's not how we listen to music.
 
Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.