one woofer is shiney and one is dull . . .

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I have two Eton 8-800 woofers; one has a shiney finish and one is dull. How can I make the dull one shiney or the shiney one dull? I can post pics.

I was thinking of spraying or painting the dull one with something that would leave it shiney. I want to do this because of the appearance.

Any suggestions?
 
Jimmy154 said:
I sent Eton an e-mail, they did not respond.

What is Capaplex? I cannot get that in the US, at a store. Is there something similar?


I would try to ask the place you bought them why they are different and if possible request a pair that match. I had a pair of these woofer long while ago, they were both shiny with a heavy coat on the front surface of the cone.
 
knorke said:
Capaplex is made for shiney coatings, it's based on PVA like wood
glue. I don't know if there something similar available in the US...
A quick "coating shiney" google search gives the following result:
http://www.abra-electronics.com/catalog/chemicals/04176.html
Maybe it's useable...

Why is it necessary to that the coating be for electronics? I'm asking about the coating because I thought that some one would know what type and/or brand of coating(s) affect the sound the least. What does "PROTECTIVE COATINGS FOR DRY-TRANSFERS" mean? I guess if I find nothing else, I will go with the brush on coating since it is stated to leave a shiney finish.

Feyz said:
I would try to ask the place you bought them why they are different and if possible request a pair that match. I had a pair of these woofer long while ago, they were both shiny with a heavy coat on the front surface of the cone.

I bought these on ebay and when I got them about a year ago it did not bother me. I contacted the person, but he has no more he says. I want to build a different box for these woofers, so I would like them to look better. Since I will put effort into the new box to look good, I want the woofers to look good too.
 
I got an e-mail form the person I bought these woofers from and he said, what I originally thought when I got the woofers, that the dull woofer is dusty.

Feyz did this happen to your woofers?

I started to think that this was untrue because I had the woofers for more than a year and the shiney one is still shiney. Also I forget now if the back of the dull woofer is dull too. If the back was shiney and the front was dull, I would have certainly concluded a year ago that it was dusty. But today I am not sure if the back is shiney. I will see when I take the woofers out to try to measure the woofers.

I guess I will try to put some dust on the shiney one and see what happens. What you think? The guy who I bought them from suggested saw dust.
 
Jimmy154 said:
I got an e-mail form the person I bought these woofers from and he said, what I originally thought when I got the woofers, that the dull woofer is dusty.

Feyz did this happen to your woofers?


It is hard to tell without seeing them but if one of them had been subjected to "a lot of" dust and other wasn't, it is possible. Mine were behind grill cloths in their enclosures, so dust wasn't an issue.

If I remember correctly, only the front of those cones are shiny and coated. Back of the cones were not coated at all from what I remember. The front coating was somewhat tacky, it could have been the result of dust but too much of it.

One thing that comes to my mind is to try to gently wipe the dull cone with a slightly damped lint free cloth. Will it bring back some shine back? Any extra coating you add to the woofer may change the behaviour of it, it will increase its mass at the least. But you may get away with a very thin coating. PartsExpress have something called "Wet Look", which may be of help.
 
Feyz said:
PartsExpress have something called "Wet Look"

Ooooo :eek:, that sounds sexy :D I think I will try that.

I think they are different finishes on these cones afterall. I will have to do something about them. But I will measure them first. I figure the one with no finish might have a lower Mms, allowing me to add mass in the form of a shiney coating. Unless the dull one is shiney on the back, then I figure it was dust causing it to appear dull and I can get the shiney one dull easily. The shiney one is definately shiney on the back too.

This is turning into quite a bit of speculation/laziness on my part. I should take the woofers out and see how the backs look.
 
knorke said:
A coating will add some mass to the the cone but the amount is normally nothing to worry about. It's unlikely that you use them in a 2 way system. Additional coating has a bigger influence on the timbre of the mid frequencies...

Yes, I understand all of this, and I do use them in a 2-way :D I think if I get the woofers to look right I will use a 3-way with a small mid, dome hopefully.
 
Story time, yay

I was dusting up the shiney cone with some saw dust and some balls of lint I found near the dryer.

I got the cone all dusty and it was starting to look duller, similar to the dull cone, but not exactly the same. When I was done I vacumed the dust off the cone. Then I went to wipe the cone down with a damp paper towel to get the rest of the dust off. A white spot appeared near the dust cap, so I started putting more and more water on the cone to try to get the spot off. After a little while I became :mad: and decided to throw all the water I had a the cone (about .5 liter). The cone turned white and I thought it was the glue and that I had ruined the woofer. I started playing with the white spot again and one thing led to another and I peeled a coat of rubber off the whole cone. But the coat was about .5 mm underneath the surround and under the dust cap. The surround was held on extremely well. But the dust cap was not glued very well at all. So the woofers look the same after peeling of the rubber coat, but I don't have a dust cap for one. The dust cap is in 2 pieces, I peeled it off in two layers. The dust caps are different than normal Eton 8-800 dust caps and might have been put on by some one else along with the rubber coating. Or the dust caps may have been put on be Eton because some one requested the woofers with them.

Should I replace these dust caps with ones I will probably make myself out of fiberglass, if it's a good idea? Or what I would rather do, is put some phase plugs in these woofers since I use them in a 2-way aplication. The voice voice diameter is about 37 mm. I will search for information about phase plugs, but are they even a good idea? Are the fiberglass dust caps a good idea?
 
(in billy west's prof. Farnsworth's voice) oh my...what heve you done you foolish fool?!
just kidding, a little over-zealous, maybe, but I bet you're no fool. A coat of Dammar (artists 'varnish') would have made the dull one look right I bet. Too little, too late, sorry. hopefully, you have altered them in a postive way, maybe you've stumbled onto a positive tweak.
 
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knorke said:
Capaplex is made for shiney coatings, it's based on PVA like wood
glue.

Sounds a lot like puzzlecoat. I use it all the time on paper cone woofers -- it takes quite a few coats to add significant mass. if the Etons are non-porous then a single coat should give some shine back.

OTOH if they already have a tacky coating, then it could well have a coat of dust more or less permanently attached to it, and without examining it. i'd hesitate to recommend coating with anything.

dave
 
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Re: Story time, yay

Jimmy154 said:
Should I replace these dust caps with ones I will probably make myself out of fiberglass, if it's a good idea? Or what I would rather do, is put some phase plugs in these woofers since I use them in a 2-way aplication. The voice voice diameter is about 37 mm. I will search for information about phase plugs, but are they even a good idea? Are the fiberglass dust caps a good idea?

That the coating turned white when watered likely means it was PVA-based (ie they were treated with puzzlecoated at the factory). It would be a good idea to replace the coating.

Phase plugs, IMHO, are a good idea. It is not very often a driver isn't improved thru the mid & top by removal of the dustcap, and after removal you need to fill the hole with something -- even a pile of wool felt disks or a cylindrical dowel. The FE206/207 phase plugs i have are 33mm external diameter (and i have one set of extra long ones) -- they may be large enuff for your needs.

dave
 
One woofer was already dull with no coat. The other was shiney with a coat, which I removed. So they look like they are the same now cause neither one has a coating and I can coat them with whatever I like now. But I don't know what the coating does, so I probably won't coat them.

Dammar I have heard of that I think, now I have to find it, or puzzlecoat. But like I said I don't know what the benefets would be. I read a long time ago Tony Gee did something to his scan speak woofers on his website with maybe this coating and it made a slight change in FR of his Scan Speak Revelator woofers, but I looked again few weeks ago and I think he removed it from his website.

I would like to make my own phase plugs. I would like them to be about 36-37 mm. But I don't know how long they should be or what geometric shapes phase plugs are. I got an idea, but nothing I would want to build from. I wish I had a cross-section image of a phase plug or mathmatical equation for the shape and how high the plug should be relative to the cone. "Plug" refers to the part that is not a cylinder. Any one know this information?
 
Oops . . .

Turns out that that dull one had the same coating on it as the shiney one. I found this out while removing the dust cap from the dull one.

Turns out information about phase plugs is a little scarce. But I did find some interesting measurements with different phase plugs on a Lowther driver.
 
:bigeyes:
I had only mentioned to gently tryp to wipe off the dull one with a slightly damped cloth. Did you have to kill it :smash: :)

Well, I think what you have now is a high sensitivity woofer with a lot of breakup ringgiiiiinggg. My guess of its high sensitivity is coming from the such thick coating you removed. It means you removed considerable mass from the cone. This will translate into high sensivitiy. My guess on the breakup ringing is, the Etons already have a pronounced 3Khz breakup frequency response peak. Since you removed that heavy coating, there is nothing much left to dampen it, I guess you will have a much pronounced ringing at 3Khz if you measure frequency response of the woofers. It is likely that you will have some other peaks, dips in the frequency response earlier in the frequency scale that doesn't show themselves in the coated original woofers.

I would get the wetlook from PE or some others that work like it and coat them again.

For the phase plugs, if it is possible try to make phase plugs out of aluminum or copper or other nonmagnetic conductive material. They are likely to reduce some distortion of the motor. Or make the phase plug out of wood or something like it, but place a rather thick ring of copper or aluminum with an outer diameter close to pole piece's diameter at the base of the phase plug and attach it there.
 
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