Next Project : FE206En cabinet

[seb4lo]

Hi all ,

I've just finished a pair of FH MK3 with FE126En drivers for my son .....

I have to say that the bang for buck is just CRAZY

I'm so impressed with the result that i'll have a go for myself with a set of cabinets for the FE206En

The questions i have are :

Hedlund Horn or Dallas II ( my wife has no WAF issues )
Plywood 18 or 25 MDF

Thanks in advance for your advices

 

[Scottmoose]

Dallas II of the ones you mention, although if you've space, Kirishima and particularly Vulcan should outperform both. No replacement for displacement.

 

[seb4lo]

thanks for the reply , i've found that the vulcan needs 5 ft distance from the wall ?

i won't have more than 1 feet from tje wall , what would you advice for front mouth design ?

 

[Scottmoose]

thanks for the reply , i've found that the vulcan needs 5 ft distance from the wall ?

Good gracious no. Optimal positioning for Vulcan is about 10in - 18in from the front wall or a corner. It's a boundary (wall) loaded design specifically intended to be used close to room walls.

i won't have more than 1 feet from tje wall , what would you advice for front mouth design ?

Kirishima or Dallas II if you want something shorter.

 

[seb4lo]

Damn Ft / inch for frenchies )))

In fact as i do have about 10in possible from the rear wall Vulcan would also be fine

So i need to forget the Hedlund design ? right ?

 

[Scottmoose]

Caveat: I designed both Kirishmia and Vulcan so they reflect my design goals. Dallas II however was designed by Ron Clarke, and of the smaller horn designs for the 206 [these things are relative], this is the one I rate most highly.

With that stressed, while I like the looks of the Hedlund horn, but in design terms, it takes an approach I don't personally favour. Smooth curves look nice, but are not ideal for bass horns, especially back-loaded bass horns. The LF wavelengths are too long to be significantly affected one way or the other, but they do help shorter, higher frequency wavelengths near the upper end of the horn's passband -i.e. right where you actually want to be rolling the thing off to avoid excess group delay. This is a matter of operating physics. There are plenty of people who are happy with their builds of the Hedlund though, so ultimately, this is a case for the individual to decide.

 

[seb4lo]

I'm here to listen to people who know and have experience

 

[planet10]

What Scott said. There are 3 decent FE206 boxes. Dallas II, Kirishima, and Vulcan.

Joes, the new Frugel-Horn member, might wotk with FE206En (it does work with FF225wk).

Do notr that for the FE206En (and FE126En) you should really have a higher output impedance (largest population of which are SE tube amps & Pass ACA).

Wha tamp do you have? And for interest, your sons?

Hedlund is really from the ear of horn design by guess. Modern design tools have made (back loaded in particular) horn design much less compromised.

dave

dave

 

[seb4lo]

Well my son has a smsl ad18 and it’s quite quite good with the Fh mk3 , i will test tomorow the 300b ....

I have a 300b amp that will use with the next pair of speakers i will build

Looks like i will build a set of Venom

 

[planet10]

Venom-V? For the FF125wk?

dave

 

[planet10]

… smsl ad18...

Shenzhen ShuangMuSanLin Electronic Co., Ltd.



The amp considered by itself may be good, but its low output impedance is not a good match for the FE126En. One can band-aid that by inceasing the total R between amp & speaker. What speaker wire does he have?

dave

 

[freddi]

I've a question for Dr. Scottmoose and Planet10. Here's a 3 cubic foot exterior bulk BVR for Fostex 208/225 (and assume 206). RCA-Fan for whatever reason placed the driver low and "in the chamber". It probably ran as 2-way a horn on top.

What response impact (and why - if significant) might occur from moving the driver up to a position more favorable for single driver listening use other than the small increase of path distance between driver center and vent center?

 

[Scottmoose]

I'll have a gander; a very quick eyeball of the dimensions suggests that while I'd expect detail differences in loading, it's unlikely to be night & day with this particular configuration.

 

[freddi]

THANKS! "that'll do" applies

 

[Vix]

Hi all ,

I've just finished a pair of FH MK3 with FE126En drivers for my son .....

I have to say that the bang for buck is just CRAZY

I'm so impressed with the result that i'll have a go for myself with a set of cabinets for the FE206En

The questions i have are :

Hedlund Horn or Dallas II ( my wife has no WAF issues )
Plywood 18 or 25 MDF

Thanks in advance for your advices

Hi seb4lo,

Just one question, before you start building:
Do you already have the Fe206En driver or no?
If yes, then go and build Kirishima or Vulcan, or even Karlsonator 12...
If you don't have the driver, don't rush. I am saying that because I had Fostex Fe206E drivers. I had built MLTLs (back in 2005). They didn't work properly in thtat box, even with high output impedance amp(Pass F2). Tried them as fullrangers in the OB as well. But, regardless of the box (or the lack of) I didn't like their sonic signature (too shouty, unpleasant to my ears). So they ended up in thier original box (packaging).
So, unless you have the drivers, please consider something else. (Markaudio 10.2 in FHXL for example)
Just my 2c...

Regards,
Vix

 

[Scottmoose]

THANKS! "that'll do" applies

The attached should give a rough idea; this isn't an exact sim (as you can see), but it's close enough for the purposes intended; in essence it shows the relative effects of altering the driver tap location in the chamber relative to the throat in approximately this box. Varies with design of course, but we're basically dealing with load to the throat which affects (to a point) the fundamental, but primarily the harmonics.

There was a thread over on the multiway forum, oh, probably about 18 months back now where I pointed out with some similar examples that the response of many chambered lines was compromised by poor throat location and / or driver tap position in the chamber.

 

[freddi]

thanks Scottmoose - I would use a removable baffle to allow flipping driver positions. Bill called these things "half horn" - maybe that term would apply if the stubby "horn" vent occupies ~ 50% of the cabinet's internal volume.

Are you going to upload any more video presentations/dissertations on loudspeaker design ?

 

[Scottmoose]

I might, if they're of any interest. The one's I've done have mostly been at the North West Audio Show & aimed at people relatively new to DIY; I've got a slightly more advanced one on QW loads & one or two others planned though. Will be down with Stefan, who made the videos, at some point over the next fortnight, so we might get them recorded. Is there anything you'd like me to include? I defer to / would like to reference people like yourself & others who have spent far longer in the field than I have & have a lot of knowledge.

 

[zman01]

seb4lo,

If you are open to explore other drivers beyond Fostex, then the Mark Audio Alpair 10P (paper) or Alpair 10.3 (metal) are worth considering. More laid back presentation vs the Fostex, and better low end response even in smaller cabinets. The Alpair 12P is also good in the right cabinets (which are on the larger side).

 

[GM]

Bill called these things "half horn".........
Are you going to upload any more video presentations/dissertations on loudspeaker design ?

Aren't these 1/8 WL same as the simple stub horn vents?

What video presentations/dissertations?

GM