Working on a set of bookshelf speakers and trying to find something neat to pair with my coax (KEF SP1632). The issue I've been running into is trying to find something with good bass response and sensitivity while remaining relatively small. Not sure I want to go all the way to a 10" sub, but I'm open to ideas.
Are the Dayton extended range subwoofers not right for your project?
https://www.daytonaudio.com/manufacturer/56/epique
https://www.daytonaudio.com/manufacturer/56/epique
Purifi’s to me only make sense if you use them for mid too. I’d spend my money on specialized sub drivers, amps and a good DSP.
Funny you should mention those. That was the original plan. The SP1632 has a sensitivity of 93db. The dayton is only 83. With them I kept trying to fight physics and just got fed up with it.
Was actually thinking of fiddling around with the crossover to do so. The crossover at the moment is 300hz LP, 300-3000 BP, and 3000 HP. Nobody says I can't move the LP up.
I think there is more to it than simply picking some expensive drivers, with all due respect. Do you measure acoustic response yourself?
Two of the E180HE-44 Epique's by Dayton Audio in a 50 litres vented cabinet would dig F3/F6/F10=27/25/22 Hz deep without any help of active boosting,
and be driven pretty hard without ever reaching Xmax.
and be driven pretty hard without ever reaching Xmax.
Don't have a mic right now so I've just been using software.
I'm trying to keep the enclosure relatively small if possible. A couple of the purifis would need less than half of that space (22 liters with PRs according to their website)
Of course they could be, but not with that good deep bass. Try simulating.
You can put any driver in any small sealed cabinet and apply linkwitz transform to tailor the cut-off frequency.
You can put any driver in any small sealed cabinet and apply linkwitz transform to tailor the cut-off frequency.
Sure, but at some point I overshoot the power handling pretty quickly. It's at least 20db to hit the target low notes with the daytons. With the purifis I don't even need to compensate for anything. Two of them will get me to the 93db sensitivity without the need to add any extra amplification. What's more, lets say I want to run the SP1632 at 40 watts. I can hook the two purifis together as a 2 ohm load and only need to use 160 watts (using a class D to drive them so it can handle a 2 ohm load).
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In HiFi power handling of the loudspeaker is reletively unimportant, irrelevant, and in many cases, given that there is no definition, so even the numbers thrown out ou tby the marketing department arter not comparable,
I've been running into that jerk a lot lately 😛
I'm confused. Then how is one able to calculate anything when designing? I would like to think the TSPs mean something at least.
If I'm going up to 10" then dayton is not a place I would stay. At that point I would probably sniff through vituixcad's speaker library and find something.
Also, there seems to be a lot of hungry people on this forum. Someone should really leave out snacks.
I forgot to ask why you don't want to copy an existing KEF bookshelf design. I ask because I don't know anything about speakers and if I had a KEF driver the first thing I'd do is see how KEF used it and copy their work. Spinorama dot org has a lot of KEF measurements to help you see which of their designs work most closely to your goal. For example, they say the R3 has bass extension to 37Hz. Then at the KEF website you can see what size woofer they use, their box dimensions, and where they placed their port (plus estimate their port size).
https://www.spinorama.org/?sort=date&reverse=false&brand=KEF
It sounds like you have a ton of money for your project so buying a few throw away woofers to copy a KEF probably wouldn't be a problem for you. Then after getting your results you can see if you want to buy the expensive Purifis or some other options that exist in the high end. But again, I don't know anything about speakers so that's why I'd personally lean so heavily on an existing KEF design.
https://www.spinorama.org/?sort=date&reverse=false&brand=KEF
It sounds like you have a ton of money for your project so buying a few throw away woofers to copy a KEF probably wouldn't be a problem for you. Then after getting your results you can see if you want to buy the expensive Purifis or some other options that exist in the high end. But again, I don't know anything about speakers so that's why I'd personally lean so heavily on an existing KEF design.
I just noticed the Spinorama dot org measurements for the R3 Meta (different from the R3) shows measurements for both ported and sealed. That could be useful for you as well.
Confused already? And ready to spend >$2000 on bass drivers? What is your ultimate goal? Top quality or just spending big time? No offends, but....
Their design is passive. I am building active. That and for coaxial drivers the SP1632s perform really well.
I actually did not know spinorama was a thing before. Rather, I had the misconception that it was just a measurement method. Clearly I was wrong
HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAA no. I got lucky on an ebay deal for the KEF speakers. That's what started my project in the first place. I squirreled away a little bit in case I wanted to maybe get a fancy part or two.
So then sensitivity matching is not necessary? Also, why specifically PA?
Trying to make bookshelf speakers that sound much bigger than they are while maintaining good distortion figures. I'm actually calling the build Tiny Titan lol
That is completely different. If you are doing a multi-way you need to know sensitivities… hard to pad down woofers.
And you are typically looking for a sensitivity in the sense that It will play as loud a you need with the amplifier you have (and that does not necessarily mean its “rated” power.
dave
Yes that seems to be the issue I keep running into. Example being the dayton epique woofer. Trying to make up a 20db disparity in sensitivity with power is not a terrific idea. Not only would I have to use a lot more power, but I would also have to worry about the speaker dancing off of its stand.
I'm making the amplifier myself so I can be a little more flexible on that front, but one thing I did want for this build is at least a little power efficiency. That said, if I used a pair of 4 ohm speakers as opposed to just one, I can wire them in parallel and run them at 2 ohms. PRs would be the cherry on top so I can get good low end response and not have to port the thing.