Goodmans Axiom 80 Advice

[goldjazz]

Hi All,

Just like some advice please on a single Axiom 80 I'm considering purchasing.

Firstly can I enjoy listening to a single Axiom 80 in mono? The intent is to find a mate eventually but I'd like to start listening now.

When inspecting the driver what should I be looking for? Are there any common issues with them that I should look out for?

Is their any hierarchy among the different versions? Now I know the Havant is less desirable than the Wembley ones. But what about the various types I see with slightly different labels? There's three I have fond: A silver that says Wembley, a gold that says Wembley and another Silver that doesnt say Wembly.

Also the attached an image with the corner cabinet it comes in. Doesn't appear to be to the Goodmans spec. The driver seems quite low, the cabinet is short, and no ARU. Do we think this cabinet might be an issue?

Thanks.

 

[analog_sa]

Firstly can I enjoy listening to a single Axiom 80 in mono?

Funny you should ask as 15 years ago i had a single of these and listened to it in mono for quite a while. It was in a home office and the speaker was a good 5-6m away from me. Very pleasant sound with the right music. It was in a huge vented box.

There is no way i would consider a pair of these working full range in my main system. Magical midrange and speed but absolutely no guts or dynamics.

At the time a friend had a pair of these in an open baffle with a 12" Goodmans bass driver and a ribbon tweeter and they were much more flexible this way but then he only listened to chamber music and ecm type jazz.

 

[goldjazz]

Cheers for the reply. I'll be bring my amp and having a listen to it when I check it out on the weekend. Will bring a variety of stuff to play. Perhaps in the right cabinet they can be effective full range?

I'm not too worried if they are not super dynamic range and deep bass, I've kind of got speakers that all ready do that if you know what I mean. I just like the idea a full range speaker on nice clear vocals and acoustic music mainly. I'd even like to explore some old mono recordings with this one

There's also a much tall, beautiful old corner cabinet I've had my eye on at a local vintage/junk shop that I was considering fitting it too.

 

[Colin]

If you want to make your own ARU, the original design article by Ted Jordan is on our website

"A cabinet of reduced size …" Wireless World, Feb 1956

articles - E J Jordan Designs

Hope that helps.

 

[goldjazz]

Cheers Colin will do this if I end uo getting the cabinet. Thanks.

 

[bondini]

I have PMed you measured T-S parameters for Axiom 80

They might help you select an enclosure.

 

[Colin]

Given the age of the driver, it would be better to measure the drive unit in question.

 

[goldjazz]

So the Driver in question is actually three Ohms, not fifteen. would be interested if anyone has any info on the three ohm version. It's also the early model which has no Axiom 80 marking on it. thanks.

 

[VaNarn]

The first model of this Goodmans speaker was mentioned in a BBC Research Department Report, M008 of Feb. 1948,"The Selection of a Wide-Range Loudspeaker for Monitoring Purposes". It was mentioned as, Goodmans (Infinite Baffle) loudspeaker and described as a twin-cone unit with a free-edged 10'' main cone with a three point suspension. A later Report ,M.008/3, dated Feb. 1952 indentifies a modified version as being the Goodmans"Axiom 10". It is not all that uncommon to find vintage speakers being supplied in an impedance other than their nominal advertised value,as a different voice coil be fitted subject to a special order.
Given that there is a significant air leakage path at the cone periphery any attempt to match an enclosure to this speaker in an effort to optimise the bass response would seem to be an impractical task with or without the T & S parameters.

 

[goldjazz]

Thank you VaNarn very interesting comments. I wonder why one would want a lower impedence version, any thoughts? Do you anticipate any advantages or disadvantages of a three ohm version sonically compared to the 15 ohms version? As for your comment on the difficult of improving bass response via the cabinet...I'll take your word on that I'm not even going to pretent I can understand that topic just yet

 

[VaNarn]

Early valve radiograms ,rather than the high fidelity amplifiers in the '50,s ,came with a fixed low impedance O/P transformer and an owner or a manufacturer who wanted a better speaker to hear the improved high frequency performance from LP recordings and FM radio may have wanted the Axiom for just this purpose. A three ohm voice coil wound to the same winding height will have a lower Bl factor and this will effect other parameters to a small degree.The only precaution would be if the speaker is to be used with a solid state amplifier and this can involve excessive power that may exceed the speakers power handling ability. The cantilever suspension is a delicate arrangement and the attachment points to the cone are prone to fatigue. There are speaker technicians that can fit a 15 ohm voice coil if you need the Axiom to comply with the original specifications. Bass response and power handling have been the Achilles' Heel with this speaker and the manufacturers solution rested on using them in multiples. Cabinet designs were supplied that used up to four speakers per enclosure. Construction wise it is a fascinating speaker on looks alone.

 

[goldjazz]

Thanks again for the interesting reply VaNarn. It sure is a fascinating design.

 

[goldjazz]

So I picked up this speaker this evening. Also had some original documents that came with it for those interested. See attached Technical Data for the Driver and a sketch of the cabinet. Very lucky to have these documents! I'e been enjoying listening to is propped up in the corner. It's very nice indeed.

So the Mystery is solved it is an Axiom 80 Type R.117/1 014/3

Overall diameter: 9 1/2"
Overall depth: 6 1/8"
Baffle Hole diameter: 7 3/4"
Mounting Holes: 4 - "O" B.A. Clearance equally spaced on 8 7/8" p.c.d
Diaphram: Patented Twin Exponential Assembly
Suspension: Specially designed low stiffness type on the Duplex cantilever principle.
Fundamental Resonance: 17 c.p.s
Voice Coil Diameter: 1"
Voice Coil Impedance 3 Ohms at 400 c.p.s
Maximum power capacity: 10 Watts peak A.C.
Flux Density: 17,000 gauss
Total Flux: 62,600 maxwells
Net Weight: 9lbs
Shipping weight: 9lbs. 8 ozs,

 

[goldjazz]

Listening a bit more to the speaker now...It's bloody exceptional!

It needed a bit of volume to get it going. Place on the floor in the corner it is presenting vocals with crazy presence. Jazz with vocals it is just amazing.

 

[goldjazz]

Took off the driver for a closer look this evening. It loos good. Cantilevers still attached, main cone good, whizzer cone good without coating chipped off as ive seen on others. Suprised how little the cantilvers move when playing.

 

[klipschorn]

Mr Goldjazz,

If that speaker is what I think it is, I've seen some bring several thousand for a pair. the units to which I am referring have a center ring with 3 spokes attached which go to the outer frame. That smaller ring houses the diffuser cone or horn. Alsio attached to the outside of the smaller ring are 3 pairs of p0henolic strips which is the annulus for the larger 8 inch cone. The spider, if I recall, is similarly affixed.

As for the 3 ohms, that may be the dc resistance of the voice coil. With the suspension described as above, the nominal impedance will be much higher, probably around 6 to 8 ohms. Typically, such vintage Goodman's and Wharfedales were around 10 to 15 ohms.

Just for schitts & giggles, look up that Goodman's Axiom 80 on ebay. You may have found a mother lode. I hope you bought that speaker.

At the time Iposted this message, I was so excited that you found such a speaker that I didn't notice the second page to this thread. With that in mind, please forgive my redundancy. Robert.

I have pictures of the one of which I made mention but they are from other sites and out of respect for the original uploader, I hesitate to post them here.

You might enter Goodman's Axiom 80 into google which will brimng up a plethors of info.

Robert

At the time I submitted this reply, I was so excited at your finding such a speaker that I hadn't noticed the second page to the thread. With that in mind, please forgive my redundancy.

 

[goldjazz]

Thanks Robert yep I sure did get it. Tajnsk for your excitememt ha. I've been enjoying listening to it very much. It actually lives up to the hype im my opinon. The only downside being the 3 ohms thing as thats very unusual ie ive never seen another one. So I'll only ever be able to listen in mono, but thays ok.

 

[christempler]

This reply a bit late. Previous post by Ted Jordan was also worth its weight in gold. Ted designed them, sadly he died earlier this year.