Cheap, high power SMPS

I'm building a linear power supply right now rated for 800-1000VA, does anyone know of a good audio grade (not super HiFi) SMPS that could do 60-0-60VDC? I've seen some single output SMPS, but they run nearly $400-$600 a peice :bigeyes: ! I know ColdAmp has a good unit, a little under powered and they are expensive. I'm looking around $200-$300 for the supply. Anyone know of anything?


*EDIT - this will need 120VAC in. I'm using this for a home audio project.
 

iand

Member
2007-02-05 10:58 pm
London
MotoMan_Yz400 said:
I'm building a linear power supply right now rated for 800-1000VA, does anyone know of a good audio grade (not super HiFi) SMPS that could do 60-0-60VDC? I've seen some single output SMPS, but they run nearly $400-$600 a peice :bigeyes: ! I know ColdAmp has a good unit, a little under powered and they are expensive. I'm looking around $200-$300 for the supply. Anyone know of anything?


*EDIT - this will need 120VAC in. I'm using this for a home audio project.

Coldamp CPS80 (800W cont, 1200W max) is 198 euros + VAT.

CAD Audio in Denmark have several modules, but some people have reported bad experiences with dealing with the company.

http://www.cadaudio.dk/pwmaudio_en.htm

CAD SW1000 (1000W cont? 2000Wmax?) is 153 euros + VAT
(same design as in their 2000W/4ohm module)

CAD SW1500 (PFC, 1500W cont, 3000W max) is 240 euros + VAT

Cheers

Ian
 

iand

Member
2007-02-05 10:58 pm
London
bremen nacht said:
I was looking at CAD audio, what are these problems you mention? I want to build an amp for stage use and reliability is obviously crucial; any issues here?

thanks!

I guess your application is similar to mine, which is why I was also looking hard at CAD audio -- basically, nobody else makes/sells (or claims to :) SMPS at these power levels to the non-OEM market (Powersoft have the Digimod 3000PFC but have said it's only available in volume to OEM customers).

I've been in contact with them several times over the last couple of years about various modules (amp and PSU) and have found it *very* difficult to get technical information out of them, or even any replies to emails in some cases.

It seems strange to me that a company which claims to offer a large range of attractive class-D amp and SMPS modules doesn't really seem to want to either sell them or support them afterwards...

It's possible that their main business is big OEM customers and they can't really be bothered to support the DIY market -- in which case they should say so! -- but even this doesn't justify/explain the multiple posts in this forum about support/repair/refund problems with modules and/or ready-built amplifiers.

But given the lack of alternatives I'm still tempted to give them a try, maybe just a single CAD2000ASW to start with -- though this still means risking about 350 euros, and I don't like gambling...

Ian

P.S. Does anyone have any *good* comments about CAD audio (or digiamps.com) like "I got these modules from them and they work fine" ?
 
well I'd almost be willing to build my own if someone had their hands on a good working high power SMPS they would be willing to post. I have software here that will able me in building a PCB board, and get components is easy.

I dont know enough on the in/outs of it all to build my own, how-ever if i had a schematic, with a parts list I dont see why I couldnt get one made.
 
iand said:


I guess your application is similar to mine, which is why I was also looking hard at CAD audio -- basically, nobody else makes/sells (or claims to :) SMPS at these power levels to the non-OEM market (Powersoft have the Digimod 3000PFC but have said it's only available in volume to OEM customers).

I've been in contact with them several times over the last couple of years about various modules (amp and PSU) and have found it *very* difficult to get technical information out of them, or even any replies to emails in some cases.

It seems strange to me that a company which claims to offer a large range of attractive class-D amp and SMPS modules doesn't really seem to want to either sell them or support them afterwards...

It's possible that their main business is big OEM customers and they can't really be bothered to support the DIY market -- in which case they should say so! -- but even this doesn't justify/explain the multiple posts in this forum about support/repair/refund problems with modules and/or ready-built amplifiers.

But given the lack of alternatives I'm still tempted to give them a try, maybe just a single CAD2000ASW to start with -- though this still means risking about 350 euros, and I don't like gambling...

Ian

P.S. Does anyone have any *good* comments about CAD audio (or digiamps.com) like "I got these modules from them and they work fine" ?

It doesn't look good, does it - if the service is so unreliable I'm not about to risk having an amp die mid-gig.
 
I ran into an interesting article at ESP
http://sound.westhost.com/articles/external-psu.htm

Now what's amazing to me is that all the talent that is out there producing would class class-d amplifier modules just can't seem to crack the SMPS puzzle.

I want SMPS mainly for pro-sound applications. The lightweight, and potential to work with variable line voltages, but it has to be safe and reliable.

I would also want SMPS if it saves energy for home use.

I would definitely want safe if I'm DIY using modules or playing with homemade circuits.

I know it's all heading towards SMPS - but I think it's still early in the technology curve for high powered affordable quality SMPS for audio.

:umbrella:
 

iand

Member
2007-02-05 10:58 pm
London
raintalk said:
I ran into an interesting article at ESP
http://sound.westhost.com/articles/external-psu.htm

Now what's amazing to me is that all the talent that is out there producing would class class-d amplifier modules just can't seem to crack the SMPS puzzle.

I want SMPS mainly for pro-sound applications. The lightweight, and potential to work with variable line voltages, but it has to be safe and reliable.

I would also want SMPS if it saves energy for home use.

I would definitely want safe if I'm DIY using modules or playing with homemade circuits.

I know it's all heading towards SMPS - but I think it's still early in the technology curve for high powered affordable quality SMPS for audio.

:umbrella:

Like I said before, there are plenty of people capable of designing high-power audio-capable SMPS.

But they're not doing it because they're all designing SMPS for industrial and telecomms applications, where there's a lot more money to be made (higher volume and unit cost) and the end user is willing to pay for high-quality design and manufacture.

Designing a robust high-power class-D ampifier is actually *much* easier than designing a robust high-power SMPS.

Ian
 
If they all............ Coldamp,Hypex,etc, cannot make a safe class 2 Power SMPS(>180W) why not make 1 ourselves here? For me the main thing is isolation/ safety and good performance. It should be able to use a 2 pin mains without earth connection and still be safe(isolation>3kV to any housing/secondary part). And it does not have to be a 1U, just safety first and/or performance 1st class.
 
Designing a robust high-power class-D ampifier is actually *much* easier than designing a robust high-power SMPS.

Especially if you want it not to be much more expensive then the amplifier. Basically this has a simple reason: an amplifier is a (modulated, 4/4) DC/DC converter + filter (2 stages), while a PSU is a rectifier+filter+inverter+trafo+rectifier+filter (5 stages tipically), or more with PFC.

I think I'm in the finish line with an audio PSU. This 1 kW module is resonant, has 95 % efficiency, low EMI, low input2output capacitance, it's short-circuit protected by soft current limiting + thermal shut-down, small, and relatively cheap. There is some degree of stabilisation and a very simple, though reliable power-dependent fan control on it. I think there is one major deficiency: no PFC. And this is just a prototype, not very well manufacturable (yet).
 

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Bgt said:
If they all............ Coldamp,Hypex,etc, cannot make a safe class 2 Power SMPS(>180W) why not make 1 ourselves here? For me the main thing is isolation/ safety and good performance. It should be able to use a 2 pin mains without earth connection and still be safe(isolation>3kV to any housing/secondary part). And it does not have to be a 1U, just safety first and/or performance 1st class.

Our SMPS will meet all safety standard...... :D

I cannot speak for other companies but we CAN design good SMPS designed for Audio Amplifiers!!

We are running now a pre-production batch of the follwing SMPS: http://www.hypex.nl/docs/smps180.pdf

We hope to release this product in about 6~8 weeks!

Regards,

Jan-Peter
 
Jan-Peter said:


Our SMPS will meet all safety standard...... :D

I cannot speak for other companies but we CAN design good SMPS designed for Audio Amplifiers!!

We are running now a pre-production batch of the follwing SMPS: http://www.hypex.nl/docs/smps180.pdf

We hope to release this product in about 6~8 weeks!

Regards,

Jan-Peter


At what level will the price be for an SMPS like that ?
 

iand

Member
2007-02-05 10:58 pm
London
Jan-Peter said:



Price not yet defined, but something about € 110,00.

Regards,

Jan-Peter

Any predicted prices for higher power levels and with PFC?
(I'm thinking for the 2kW bridged amp, or several of them...)

-- SMPS cost goes up much more slowly with power level than a linear supply -- high-power components are cheaper than for linear but complexity is much higher, so "cost-vs-power" slope starts a lot higher but is much flatter.

Ian