Beautiful power supply! Brian's Chipamp.com

[danielwritesbac]

I have the new chipamp.com power supply.

Its impressive.

Really, I just thought it was durable and elegant, with well-done thermals as a bonus.

Today, I just receive news that the layout has facilitation that allows greater tolerance in adjusting attached amplifiers to personal preferences on tonality, with cooler thermals for attached amplifiers as an additional bonus, no matter what amplifier you attach to it. Well!! I had no idea!

KUDOS!!! And, a big thank-you to chipamp.com for going the extra mile on the power supply!

 

[Greg Erskine]

Today, I just receive news that the layout has facilitation that allows greater tolerance in adjusting attached amplifiers to personal preferences on tonality, with cooler thermals for attached amplifiers as an additional bonus, no matter what amplifier you attach to it. Well!! I had no idea!

Hi Daniel,

Can you post a translation into Australian?

regards

 

[danielwritesbac]

In Australian? Okay! "Gits ya computa chip off tha barbie!" Is that about right?

EDIT: Two different facilitations for less heat, and less heat *can* be used for . . .
Um, extra tolerances that are really fun to play with! Or, 5 channel amp. Or the original intent--probably so that you can use a wide variety of enclosures without so much thermals to worry with. I like having all of these options enhanced--really appreciate it!

 

[Speedskater]

Re: Re: Beautiful power supply! Brian's Chipamp.com

Hi Daniel,

Can you post a translation into Australian?

regards

Some of us would settle for a translational into Midwest USA English.

 

[leadbelly]

Ditto. "Thermals" doesn't translate well into Canuck. Up here, 90% of the time it refers to long underwear, and 10% of the time it refers to gliding. Word.

 

[danielwritesbac]

Ah Midwest USA? Okay. 2 things:

#1
In a comparison between a textbook power supply and chipamp.com power supply,
When running chipamp.com lm3886tf, and/or
When running K50 LM1875t, and/or
several in surround sound (rockin out man!)
The chipamp.com power supply ran the amplifiers at cooler temperature.
They were all cooler (thermals) on chipamp.com power.
I don't know why, but. . .

#2
And because. . . If you've used the earlier (older) model amplifier kits (that don't have this power supply), the large caps at point blank range to the chip can heat up NFB, give her PMS, she'll dump you and send her friend, Spike over to make ya wiz on the lectric fence!
(that was Midwest Translation)
Instead of whizzing on the electric fence. . .
So, now (newer models) putting the big caps on its own seperate power supply, is audiably beneficial--because it reduces heat at a spot on the amp, NFB (gain loop structure), which is one of the two tone controls of the amp chips.
*There's a whopping page of math about that topic.
**There are upgrade products at chipamp.com to convert the older kits to the new power.

In these two ways, 1 and 2 above, the chipamp.com power supply reduces heat at the amplifier chip.

Less heat in the gain circuit is a REALLY fun thing for an amplifier, and beyond the scope of this thank-you letter posting.

This IS a thank-you posting to chipamp.com. Out of respect I'm not going to mention how to exploit the product's extra-power-at-less-heat-advantage on THIS posting. That's over at the LM1875 thread (surround sound project uses both amps), and it is a work in progress, not quite right yet, so that's the reason that I sidestepped explaining exactly why I'm so grateful for the excellent power supply.

I can say that the elegant power supply is capable of powering "concert level" presentations in-home and at high fidelity. It facilitates this and more.

If you'd like to save a buck on the transformer, I can post a photo of how to connect a center tap transformer. Anyone want it?

 

[MJL21193]

Wow.

 

[BWRX]

Assuming ALL other things are held equal (supply voltage, input, load, etc.) the value of the power supply caps should have NO effect on the power dissipation of the chip! That really sounds like you have an oscillation problem with the other power supply because the chip gets hotter with that than it does with the chipamp supply.

Daniel, the reason these guys are razzing you is because the terminology you're using is rather hard to understand! It's certainly not what most people use when talking about circuits. I whole-heartedly applaud your enthusiasm, but it might help to browse through some other posts in this forum or have a look at basic op amp theory before making wild assumptions/assertions. What you're investigating now has been covered many times and is certainly not new.

 

[danielwritesbac]

At certain values, the NFB is sensitive to power supply structure, and the power arrangement of the stereo kit that I received from chipamp.com. . . is a big step in the right direction, according to the really hairy math sent to me by AndrewT.

I certainly don't understand why the location of the capacitors is better offboard the amplifier, except for that document hinting that more NFB options work in that layout.

Of course it also provides good quality power in addition to that (above).

Specifically, I used the extra tolerance(s) for. . . more rocking down the house for me.

And, I'm grateful. I'm amazed that the power supply already included a feature that I really wanted. . . before I even knew about it.

Its not just elegant quality power--it also facilitated my adjusting the amplifier NFB for the tone and power that I desired. . . and helped me succeed in getting the tone and power, because of its quality power, sure. . . but also because of the power layout in the kit product. Thats two different ways it helped me. And, its elegant too.

Rarely does one purchase something that does much better than advertised.

THANKS AGAIN!!!

 

[danielwritesbac]

Daniel, the reason these guys are razzing you is because the terminology you're using is rather hard to understand! It's certainly not what most people use when talking about circuits. I whole-heartedly applaud your enthusiasm, but it might help to browse through some other posts in this forum or have a look at basic op amp theory before making wild assumptions/assertions. What you're investigating now has been covered many times and is certainly not new.

So, I tried to explain it by function in case there's cowboys building amplifiers. I've seen it!! Did you know that Liquid Nails glue works for thermal compound?
This funny thing happens from just sending out specs: "Use siliconized thermal compound."

Computer network engineers, like myself, are always believing that there's both an interrelation and the possibility of much more performance, awaiting, with just one little tweak.
I think that most computer guys are just like Tim Allen's character on the "Home Improvement" television show.

Anyway, in my case, that was one tweak too many. I didn't need both a double gain boost and greater voltage in combination with 4 ohm speakers. Oops! Too much.

Reading up on "basic op amp theory" has helped me a lot--basically bailed me out of trouble from using too much amplifier with too much load. Sounds great. Too hot!
There was a good band-aid in the op amp documents. Temporarily, I have installed 1 ohm Mills speaker resistors in series with the speaker output terminals, per the documents. What a nice surprise! The amp runs cool now.
It was good reading indeed.
I'll be getting some 8 ohm drivers soon.

And the cowboys? They're great! That midwestern thermal compound, Liquid Nails, can heatsink my Mills resistors.

Where is the power supply? Its in here (see picture) at higher fidelity and power than it ever had on its NEC transistors.
All of the features that you see controls for, are all fully functional.

 

[jan.didden]

At certain values, the NFB is sensitive to power supply structure, and the power arrangement of the stereo kit that I received from chipamp.com. . . is a big step in the right direction, according to the really hairy math sent to me by AndrewT.

I certainly don't understand why the location of the capacitors is better offboard the amplifier, except for that document hinting that more NFB options work in that layout.

Of course it also provides good quality power in addition to that (above).

Specifically, I used the extra tolerance(s) for. . . more rocking down the house for me.

And, I'm grateful. I'm amazed that the power supply already included a feature that I really wanted. . . before I even knew about it.

Its not just elegant quality power--it also facilitated my adjusting the amplifier NFB for the tone and power that I desired. . . and helped me succeed in getting the tone and power, because of its quality power, sure. . . but also because of the power layout in the kit product. Thats two different ways it helped me. And, its elegant too.

Rarely does one purchase something that does much better than advertised.

THANKS AGAIN!!!

Daniel,

I have read all your posts above but I have no idea what you are talking about. You keep on going about tolerances, but that doesn't say anything. Tolerance of what? Power, voltage? Component values? And what do the tolerances influence?

I agree with Brian that 'power structure' whatever THAT is has nothing to do with the nfb.

The only way that power supply voltage influences amp heat dissipation is when the actual voltage changes: higher supply voltage means higher output device temperature in the amp, assuming constant bias current and no oscillations.

A power supply should have no further ambitions than to supply stable, constant and noise free power to the amp. Everything else is anecdotes.

Jan Didden

 

[tangmonster]

I am loving this website and forum , but i am starting to get more and more posts across the forum that takes the science out of the lm range of op amps

THEY ARE JUST OPAMPS!!

Don't tell me that stripping a capacitor makes the amp sound better.
Don't tell me that my enclosure needs spikey feet because that makes the amp sound better.
I find it VERY hard to believe that carbon resistors sound better than film resistors.

And this list goes on and on.

 

[Nuuk]

Don't tell me that stripping a capacitor makes the amp sound better.
Don't tell me that my enclosure needs spikey feet because that makes the amp sound better.
I find it VERY hard to believe that carbon resistors sound better than film resistors.

I've thrown together more chip amps than I can remember now, hardly ever having a problem with heat or noise. So I too have been mildly amused by Daniel's posts.

However, I must say (from my own experience) that 'spikey feet' do make a difference to the sound of a an amp, depending on which spikey feet you use, and what those spikey feet are coupled too.

And if you cannot hear the difference between a metal film, and carbon film feedback resistor, you sadly won't be able to glean total success from this hobby (or the rest of your system needs upgrading)!

Yes, there are some old wife's tales as well but it is important not to mix them up with the genuine tweaks!

 

[tangmonster]

Please explain how the spikey feet have a change on the amplifier sound?

 

[Nuuk]

Please explain how the spikey feet have a change on the amplifier sound?

Quite simply by removing 'noise' (caused by microphonics ) from the amp.

 

[jan.didden]

Quite simply by removing 'noise' (caused by microphonics ) from the amp.

It's the other way around. Spikes isolate the amp enclosure from a damping effect of floor, shelf, what have you to sit your amp on.

With the spikes, the enclosure can humm and buzz as much as it likes, due to transformer humm/buzz, heatsink noise etc. So there may be an audible difference with/without spikes. But most people don't realize that with the spikes, the mechanical noise INCREASES. But, you pays your money, it sounds different so it must be better, no?

Jan Didden

 

[AndrewT]

well, I'm relieved to find that it's not just my mind that is lacking in understanding Daniel's posts.

 

[nelsonvandal]

If it's isolation from vibrations we want, why spikes? Do they really isolate vibrations? Wouldn't something soft and absorbing be better?

 

[tangmonster]

I Have to confess...

My production manager cost vs quality point of view isn't the correct one when it comes to DIY Audio.

This is the hobby Where cost is not the deciding factor.

And if putting spikes (and other ad-ons) underneath your enclosure (which obviousely have a VAST variety of reasons according to people) makes you feel better about your amplifier and you are sure it sounds better or makes you feel better it must be good.

If you believe that Slow or Fast rectifier diodes give the best sound , GREAT.

And the list goes on.

 

[Nuuk]

The supports that my equipment sit on cost me pennies to make (the granite slabs cost less than ten pounds at a local supermarket)! There really needn't be a conflict between trying most of these ideas and protecting the bank balance!

I agree, there is nothing worse than seeing all the ideas put forward and not being able to know for sure what works and what is hocus pocus. I also agree that if something is being sold to you at considerable expense, it is good to have some scepticism. But don't let it put you off keeping an open mind!