Just spotted it- good looking little driver- big rise above 10 khz
W3-1285SG - TB speakers 3 inch titanium cone fullrange - Europe Audio
W3-1285SG - TB speakers 3 inch titanium cone fullrange - Europe Audio
I'm looking at those drivers recently - the "3 and 4" TB's
What my eye sees is that from 10 kHz to 20 kHz the rise is about exactly 12 db.
And from 10 to 20 kHz it is exactly one octave...
So you could try a second order low pass filter - 12 db/oct
But someone with more experience should tell whether you should calculate the values of C and L using 15 khz (-6 db) as a crossover point - If I state that I might mislead you.
Otherwise the SPL looks pretty good between 300 hz and 8-9-10 khz it seems to be +/- 1.5 db - if I see is correctly it's minimum is 85 db and it's maximum is 88 db for that range - pretty impressive.
Now as I look more carefully the 12 db gain is between about 8 khz and 16 kHz - again one octave.
-6 db point should be at about 13500 hz, someone else should tell us what crossover point that corresponds to and what Q crossover/slope should be used - Linkwitz, Butterworth or Tchebishev...
That's from me and thanks in advance to the one who explains the needed crossover point.
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great driver, only weak in bass. one of TB's finest imho
and with regards to the rising high end: just listen a bit off axis and all will be fine 😎
Good to know they perform well, they look like they should. How far off axis? anyway, a little rise is a good thing for large rooms imo.. if I use, I don`t want anything in signal path other than 1st order.
10deg was enough
I had a RCL in the Needle (can't find the values, sorry). with another baffle maybe not?
just 10 degrees toe in? great! My first choice was the alpair 6 but the surround is far too wide for my build. How do you think the sound compares?
[disclaimer: this goes from memory of a couple years ago]: the Alpair6 is more neutral than the W3-1285, the TB has more crisp. what you like more in the long run I can't tell, I did not have the speakers with the little TBs long.
one important thing: the TB really needs a woofer, it has virtually no capability for bass. it really is more a midtweeter than full range. The Alpair6 (given the right cabinet) can give you full range (at moderate volumes of course, it still is a small driver)
btw: if you can get hold of a pair of the square basket Alpair6s, you should be able to squeeze them in a slim space
one important thing: the TB really needs a woofer, it has virtually no capability for bass. it really is more a midtweeter than full range. The Alpair6 (given the right cabinet) can give you full range (at moderate volumes of course, it still is a small driver)
btw: if you can get hold of a pair of the square basket Alpair6s, you should be able to squeeze them in a slim space
cheers, thats v interesting. I want a crisp sound. I will use a 1st order so little to no bass duties for the full range drivers, 2 each side and stereo 'subs' underneath
The enclosures are 'bullet' shaped, hence the need for a small diameter unit.. it would mean hack sawing the edges off the alpair 6 to fit.. not something i want to try.
On the images of the Tang band, there is a shiny glue(?) 'ring' on the rubber surround- does it make it a bit cheap looking?
The enclosures are 'bullet' shaped, hence the need for a small diameter unit.. it would mean hack sawing the edges off the alpair 6 to fit.. not something i want to try.
On the images of the Tang band, there is a shiny glue(?) 'ring' on the rubber surround- does it make it a bit cheap looking?
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for me this shiny ring makes it cyber high-tec looking 😀 the downside is that it's "sticky" for dust
just recieved some of these, and from running tests i find them very good indeed. the rise above 10k isnt a huge issue and i myself would probably opt for a 1st order LP, considering the phase plug and effectively tiny SA, its only a problem if you use them as headphones...just a coil would suit me fine.
in the centre. 😉
the frames ring a bit despite looking strong, so im planning to damp them a little.
in the centre. 😉
the frames ring a bit despite looking strong, so im planning to damp them a little.
Finally doing my build in a few weeks, getting the carbon fibre mould kit for the cabinet and these TB's from europe audio and 2 small subs underneath. Want to cover the fugly surrounds/screw heads with a flat cover.
theyre gret, im running a pair in series with an audax 5"er crossed at ~300 hz and theyre brilliant. even with the pair side by side, horizonatally, on top 4 inches away from the bass driver they sound impressive.
I have some toys too 😀
more pics here
http://www.diyaudio.rs/topic/2989-jeftini-tang-band-w3-823-vs-ma-alpair-6/page__st__80
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
more pics here
http://www.diyaudio.rs/topic/2989-jeftini-tang-band-w3-823-vs-ma-alpair-6/page__st__80
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Very nice driver collection! The flat sandwich cone ones are rather interesting, how did you find the sound? Good off-axis I guess is the intention?
On the subject of the W3-1285SG, I am vaguely considering it as a midrange in a 3-way, but that 0.4mm Xmax seems limiting. Modelling in WinISD, with a 12dB X-over at 240Hz (to make 24dB acoustic in 1.1L box) I can't put more than 2.5W into it before exceeding Xmax, giving me around 91dB from each driver, so 97dB a pair. Probably enough for a smallish bedroom really, but it seems like a lot to spend on a driver which might not keep up if the system was used in a larger space.
How do you find it sounds if the driver is pushed beyond Xmax? If it could actually do 1mm it'd be fine up to its thermal rating in my application!
So, since I have a tweeter (Hi-Vi ribbon) and intend to use it either way, would the W4-1337SD be more logical? Would be a bit of a squeeze for size is all.
On the subject of the W3-1285SG, I am vaguely considering it as a midrange in a 3-way, but that 0.4mm Xmax seems limiting. Modelling in WinISD, with a 12dB X-over at 240Hz (to make 24dB acoustic in 1.1L box) I can't put more than 2.5W into it before exceeding Xmax, giving me around 91dB from each driver, so 97dB a pair. Probably enough for a smallish bedroom really, but it seems like a lot to spend on a driver which might not keep up if the system was used in a larger space.
How do you find it sounds if the driver is pushed beyond Xmax? If it could actually do 1mm it'd be fine up to its thermal rating in my application!
So, since I have a tweeter (Hi-Vi ribbon) and intend to use it either way, would the W4-1337SD be more logical? Would be a bit of a squeeze for size is all.
Sound of those flat TB is unusual for a wideranger, it has immense HF, like a new drug, I don't know maybe the whole cone produces High Frequencies, it changes the density of the air and creates new dimensions in time & space
Beaming?! What is that? 😛
If some speaker "dissapear", then it's the flat TB 😉
Beaming?! What is that? 😛
If some speaker "dissapear", then it's the flat TB 😉
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Dr EM: Ive found that from use full range, i can drive these easily at 7-8 on my 30 watt A1 amp, they do not bottom out at all. they easily have 'room' to move +/-4mm, i think the air gap height is 8mm(?).
Since it is hard to measure an excursion of 0.4mm with the eye, i know im exceeding it most of the time at the volumes i listen, but to be totally honest I cant hear an audible change in sound until excursion becomes extreme and close to the mechanical limits, even though i KNOW it will probably measure worse. I have confidence that these would work just fine as mid tweeter in a FAST system, im looking at 8-10" woofers to partner at present. I think 8" maybe the best option due to polar resp around the xover point. hope this is of some help.
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