Talk me outta this bad idea the $ is a non issue. Things to know fully active every driver has a amp and dsp with upto 65k taps per driver. Delay is no problem I already use my plex server to delay hdmi when watching movies.
Drivers :
1x Bliesma 25b + 5 inch augerpro waveguide 4k+
2x bliesma 74b 400 to 1k and 400 -4k
4x LOM165_vPA-H-8 60 to 400 ported or different ideas are welcome ( can't look ugly this is strictly a wife approved speaker)
All xo at 98 or higher dB brick walls also doable.
T-M ctc is 3.5"
M-T-M ctc is 7"
W ctc is undecided and side mounted woofers are not out of the question.
General idea is spacing of 1 with steep filters no comb no lob in theory ehh.
Box will be kurfed vennerd mdf 3" roundover of 2" thick walls cld of 48"x 12" x 17".
Goal 95db from xx up crossed to 2x uxl-18s that will be built like a modern media center.
Cardioid ? I did this active in my other speaker.
Correcting group delay of the ported mids ?
The woofers seem to be peaky would it be better to use 3 different ported hz ie 55 75 85 ?
I hope to have time to learn VituixCAD next week.
Drivers :
1x Bliesma 25b + 5 inch augerpro waveguide 4k+
2x bliesma 74b 400 to 1k and 400 -4k
4x LOM165_vPA-H-8 60 to 400 ported or different ideas are welcome ( can't look ugly this is strictly a wife approved speaker)
All xo at 98 or higher dB brick walls also doable.
T-M ctc is 3.5"
M-T-M ctc is 7"
W ctc is undecided and side mounted woofers are not out of the question.
General idea is spacing of 1 with steep filters no comb no lob in theory ehh.
Box will be kurfed vennerd mdf 3" roundover of 2" thick walls cld of 48"x 12" x 17".
Goal 95db from xx up crossed to 2x uxl-18s that will be built like a modern media center.
Cardioid ? I did this active in my other speaker.
Correcting group delay of the ported mids ?
The woofers seem to be peaky would it be better to use 3 different ported hz ie 55 75 85 ?
I hope to have time to learn VituixCAD next week.
Big speakers with a vertical array of drivers look impressive. One only needs to open an audio magazine to see such a grand display. However, it's another compromise.
As it was explained to me years ago, the WMTMW (or as elaborate as one wishes it be be) is finicky in set up. If the listener is seated too high or low, the time difference between the upper and lower midrange are fall further out of alignment and cause some cancellation and detail smearing. If the listener stands up, the treble disappears, or dips in the response appear at the crossover points.
I was on a similar path with the RAAL 140-15DAM and Bliesma M74B-6, and decided a single midrange and single large 12-15" woofer offered better performance in what I was looking for.
As it was explained to me years ago, the WMTMW (or as elaborate as one wishes it be be) is finicky in set up. If the listener is seated too high or low, the time difference between the upper and lower midrange are fall further out of alignment and cause some cancellation and detail smearing. If the listener stands up, the treble disappears, or dips in the response appear at the crossover points.
I was on a similar path with the RAAL 140-15DAM and Bliesma M74B-6, and decided a single midrange and single large 12-15" woofer offered better performance in what I was looking for.
few in series with crossover roll off and angled baffle
would get it closer to feasible.
I was just playing around with 2" or 2 1/2" mids.
and 15 to 30 degrees all was needed to fix vertical
needed check basic summing, now moving to checking
sitting and standing position
Beryllium dome doesn't sound to bad really.
pretty cool fun driver
Dont know if tweet needs waveguide.
very small 3/4" tweet would keep upper really clean
would get it closer to feasible.
I was just playing around with 2" or 2 1/2" mids.
and 15 to 30 degrees all was needed to fix vertical
needed check basic summing, now moving to checking
sitting and standing position
Beryllium dome doesn't sound to bad really.
pretty cool fun driver
Dont know if tweet needs waveguide.
very small 3/4" tweet would keep upper really clean
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It can be improved with crossover design. Check this paper. Part 1 and Part 2.
Application of Linear-Phase Digital Crossover Filters to Pair-Wise Symmetric Multi-Way Loudspeakers
U. Horbach, D. Keele
I'll Be crossing them at 1k which would be a touch over 1/2 wavelength with a ctc 7 inches. But who knows I can't model them till next week.
Yes, at the least. On one hand there is no benefit to symmetrical when using a LR crossover.
If you use the necessary Butterworth crossover to widen the verticals, it will narrow them below the cross. So if you space them very close and cross them low, and succeed, you take away the very need for it in the first place.
Just remember to space your MTM CTC distance based on a 1/3, 1/2, or 1.2x the crossover’s wavelength. They model best, if the physical spacing allows it.
Your choice of drivers and layout is strange to say the least.
Why a waveguide for a 4KHz+ crossover, I'd use it to lower the crossover point to 2-2.5KHz, where the mid don't beam too much.
Why using two different crossover point for the mids and why 2 mids when one alone is more efficient than the tweeter.
Why 4 woofers again when 2 of them are more efficient than the tweeter even considering some baffle step compensation. Calling them woofer is also misleading looking at the TS parameters... I'd search for a driver that goes a bit lower (2x Satori MW19P-4 maybe?).
Ralf
It is a good idea to try and work out your current plans with Vituixcad first. You might not like the vertical coverage you get from a speaker like this.
Clever engineering beats pricey drivers any time, any where. An example of clever engineering would be: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...raight-cbt-with-passive-xos-and-no-eq.330031/
Keeping the beam wide enough to be able to enjoy it sitting down and standing up won't be easy. You'd quickly get quite a narrow vertical coverage.
(Which can be an advantage if you do want that kind of coverage, like in the fractal array example I linked to or the famous Dunlavy WMTMW's)
So do test your plans in Vituixcad first, before spending a fortune on drivers, for this to succeed you don't need the so called "best drivers", instead you need the drivers suitable to do the job right. With project plans this big, you better make sure it's going to work out. Make sure you get the coverage you want, both horizontally as well as vertically.
The closest spaced WMTMW's are the Danley Synergy horns with CD tweet, mids and woofers. Those do act much like a single driver would due to their close spacing (within 1/4 wave CTC spacing).
Clever engineering beats pricey drivers any time, any where. An example of clever engineering would be: https://www.diyaudio.com/community/...raight-cbt-with-passive-xos-and-no-eq.330031/
Keeping the beam wide enough to be able to enjoy it sitting down and standing up won't be easy. You'd quickly get quite a narrow vertical coverage.
(Which can be an advantage if you do want that kind of coverage, like in the fractal array example I linked to or the famous Dunlavy WMTMW's)
So do test your plans in Vituixcad first, before spending a fortune on drivers, for this to succeed you don't need the so called "best drivers", instead you need the drivers suitable to do the job right. With project plans this big, you better make sure it's going to work out. Make sure you get the coverage you want, both horizontally as well as vertically.
The closest spaced WMTMW's are the Danley Synergy horns with CD tweet, mids and woofers. Those do act much like a single driver would due to their close spacing (within 1/4 wave CTC spacing).
I've built synergy horns around 9 years ago this speaker isn't about perfection I could bring out my 28 inch synergy horns if I could i would but I enjoy the wife in bed. But yes cad next week I'm not overly worried about the price just got done with a speaker for my dad that is a blesma 34b 8 inch waveguide to a purifi 8 at 1100 xo with 10x hivi 8 doing cardioid and acting as a sub all in 3.5 cf like I said budget doesn't matter. This speakers much less straight forward then the last.
A waveguide doesn't boost all the frequencies (if it does it would create energy from nothing). At high frequencies the SPL with the WG is more or less the one without WG. So a correct implementation is to flatten the FR, and with your chosen tweeter the max SPL is 92-93dB. From the datasheet the mid is 97dB, so one alone is more sensitive than the tweeter. And a 4KHz+ crossover point doesn't make any sense.
Ralf
Ralf
