I have to confess im not exactly a FR fans, BUT these looked interesting, if the data can be believed (and the bumps in imp plot arent terrible).
Has anyone used these things:
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/w5-1611sa.htm
or...
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1230_04/w5-1880.htm
Has anyone used these things:
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/w5-1611sa.htm
or...
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1230_04/w5-1880.htm
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here's an example of the w5-1611...I've found it good for the money, but it's not the last word at the top end in my experience
http://www.vitalstates.org/hma/gallery/img-dam-g1.jpg
http://www.vitalstates.org/hma/gallery/img-dam-g1.jpg
Yeah that's me. Trying to finish up my subs so the 1611 cabs are on the back burner, however I find they are far from lacking on the top end from initial break-in open air listening.....actually might be a bit hot for my taste. I guess we'll see when I can conjure some bass from them in Scott's suggested cabs.
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I'm not sure 'lacking' is the word I would use but I couldn't say they were the best when it came to things like ride and crash cymbals or high hats and cowbells.....
www.vitalstates.org/diy/misc/damarte-mls.jpg
but as I said, for the money it would be churlish to criticise
Ed
I have used the W8-1808 to build a pair of large bass reflex type speakers. I really like them. I put a helper tweeter on the back of the enclosure but so far I have not felt the need to connect it. I get good bass and treble from this setup. The driver has a nice organic quality to the sound. It works great with jazz and blues.
>>> I have used the W8-1808 to build a pair of large bass reflex type speakers. I really like them. I put a helper tweeter on the back of the enclosure but so far I have not felt the need to connect it.
I was enjoying my 1808's this weekend with my son. He wanted to know what the magnet did and was intrigued by the spider, basket and phase plug, lol... we listened to all sorts of music for about an hour and a half. I connected an old radio shack pod tweeter using a 1uf cap and found it too bright overall so added a 2.2 in series for a total of .69uf and it sounds just about right to me. I agree you don't need a helper tweeter with this driver and yes it does do bass (but i use helper woofers). Overall, i think it's a wonderful driver but i certainly have not heard them all.
I like all the TB drivers i heard and think you can do a lot worse and not much better depending on cabinet design. TBs work great in simple cabinets imo. They have a more neutral sound compared to Fostex which have a more forward sound.
I like em!
Zilla
I was enjoying my 1808's this weekend with my son. He wanted to know what the magnet did and was intrigued by the spider, basket and phase plug, lol... we listened to all sorts of music for about an hour and a half. I connected an old radio shack pod tweeter using a 1uf cap and found it too bright overall so added a 2.2 in series for a total of .69uf and it sounds just about right to me. I agree you don't need a helper tweeter with this driver and yes it does do bass (but i use helper woofers). Overall, i think it's a wonderful driver but i certainly have not heard them all.
I like all the TB drivers i heard and think you can do a lot worse and not much better depending on cabinet design. TBs work great in simple cabinets imo. They have a more neutral sound compared to Fostex which have a more forward sound.
I like em!
Zilla
The above mentioned "Sarah" was born after Flogatt had used and loved the "Flat 5" from Blue Planet (oaudio). Have a look at their website Flat 5 - Lautsprecher Selbstbau by blue planet acoustic for the plan for the Flat 5 BR version. There is also a TML version which is told to go a tad deeper (the TML plan is not open published, but you could contact Blue Planet to ask for the plan -- I guess you'll get the plan when you place the order. This was the case for me). Depending on room and taste the BR or TML is the "best" choice.
I'm going to build the Flat 5 TML which I have heard and really fell in love with that speaker. I think I can explain what "organic" means in the post above. I don't know why, but when listening to the Flat 5 TML the speakers just disappeared for me. I just had so much fun to listen to different types of music. The presentation for me was very natural -- especially when I listend to own recordings (Piano and female voice) I had made. The speaker might not be the most high-end speaker ever, yes. But who cares? I am not looking for high-end sound, but for a sound which brings the music to life for me. That was what the Flat 5 offers. The music was _there_ on good recordings of course, but even so so recordings where o.k. and still fun to listen -- of course a nice recording is still better to have
I also listend to a three way speaker with the W5-1611SA speaker. This was a real fun speaker for Rock and the like, _but_ the magic was lost in my ears. I guess it was because of the added tweeter, which I don't think is needed -- at least if you're not someone looking for a more traditional speaker setup. But depending on taste and usage type the three way construction can also be a good choice for some.
One option for the 1611 could be to add a subwoofer or to build a FAST with an added bass to complement the FR speaker. I heard a set of two dipole subwoofers with the Flat 5 and was shocked how well that worked and the subwoofer just added a bit of lowest end bass, without any effect to degrade the pure Flat 5 sound. You could not even hear if the subwoofer was turned on or off when no deep bass was in the music signal. But when deep bass was in the recording this was clearly heard. That's how it should be in my opinion. Although I'm pretty sure that die-hard techno fans who look just for "boom" might prefer a coloured and slower bass response in a traditonal subwoofer cabinet (in the corner). But for music lovers this combination Flat 5 + Dipole Sub was a real hit.
I thought about the option of a FAST and adding a bass driver but deceided against this (at least for the moment), because the Flat 5 has the advantage (in my opinion) that the loudspeaker works close to a wall. Indeed Thorsten Fischer who created the speaker told me that he designed the speaker to hang them on the wall in his home and then he was surprised how good the speaker worked "free standing" too. BTW, the Flat 5 has _no_ filters, but just the plain driver, while the BSC is done by clever placement of the speaker on the quite large front. I also like the different (flat) designs, which gives lots of options to make a unique speaker which matches the own taste and room. Some examples:
(Hanging "poster" -- not done nicely here, but the idea is an option):
"Klingende Poster" oder: Flat5-Br modifiziert, Projekte der Nutzer / Nachbauten - HIFI-FORUM
Great looking design matching the wall:
Verstärker für FLAT 5, Kaufberatung - HIFI-FORUM
I'm now going to use the W5-1611 in a desktop test system (closed box) to see how this works for me in general (with DSP filtering by PC). And then the W5 will get into their "home" Flat 5 enclosure for a different room. For the desktop I will most likely use the Alpair 10 then - except the W5 would just please me so much in the test setup that I might deceide to buy another pair, but for the desktop (my main listening place) I think that AP10 will be the better fit?
So, longg story short. Buy the W5-1611 and try if you capture the magic
I'm going to build the Flat 5 TML which I have heard and really fell in love with that speaker. I think I can explain what "organic" means in the post above. I don't know why, but when listening to the Flat 5 TML the speakers just disappeared for me. I just had so much fun to listen to different types of music. The presentation for me was very natural -- especially when I listend to own recordings (Piano and female voice) I had made. The speaker might not be the most high-end speaker ever, yes. But who cares? I am not looking for high-end sound, but for a sound which brings the music to life for me. That was what the Flat 5 offers. The music was _there_ on good recordings of course, but even so so recordings where o.k. and still fun to listen -- of course a nice recording is still better to have
I also listend to a three way speaker with the W5-1611SA speaker. This was a real fun speaker for Rock and the like, _but_ the magic was lost in my ears. I guess it was because of the added tweeter, which I don't think is needed -- at least if you're not someone looking for a more traditional speaker setup. But depending on taste and usage type the three way construction can also be a good choice for some.
One option for the 1611 could be to add a subwoofer or to build a FAST with an added bass to complement the FR speaker. I heard a set of two dipole subwoofers with the Flat 5 and was shocked how well that worked and the subwoofer just added a bit of lowest end bass, without any effect to degrade the pure Flat 5 sound. You could not even hear if the subwoofer was turned on or off when no deep bass was in the music signal. But when deep bass was in the recording this was clearly heard. That's how it should be in my opinion. Although I'm pretty sure that die-hard techno fans who look just for "boom" might prefer a coloured and slower bass response in a traditonal subwoofer cabinet (in the corner). But for music lovers this combination Flat 5 + Dipole Sub was a real hit.
I thought about the option of a FAST and adding a bass driver but deceided against this (at least for the moment), because the Flat 5 has the advantage (in my opinion) that the loudspeaker works close to a wall. Indeed Thorsten Fischer who created the speaker told me that he designed the speaker to hang them on the wall in his home and then he was surprised how good the speaker worked "free standing" too. BTW, the Flat 5 has _no_ filters, but just the plain driver, while the BSC is done by clever placement of the speaker on the quite large front. I also like the different (flat) designs, which gives lots of options to make a unique speaker which matches the own taste and room. Some examples:
(Hanging "poster" -- not done nicely here, but the idea is an option):
"Klingende Poster" oder: Flat5-Br modifiziert, Projekte der Nutzer / Nachbauten - HIFI-FORUM
Great looking design matching the wall:
Verstärker für FLAT 5, Kaufberatung - HIFI-FORUM
I'm now going to use the W5-1611 in a desktop test system (closed box) to see how this works for me in general (with DSP filtering by PC). And then the W5 will get into their "home" Flat 5 enclosure for a different room. For the desktop I will most likely use the Alpair 10 then - except the W5 would just please me so much in the test setup that I might deceide to buy another pair, but for the desktop (my main listening place) I think that AP10 will be the better fit?
So, longg story short. Buy the W5-1611 and try if you capture the magic
Organic
Listening without chemicals or pests.
I still can't figure out what that word means when referring to sound.
Listening without chemicals or pests.
I still can't figure out what that word means when referring to sound.
Organic by definition as in "close to nature". In sound reproduction I'd presume it means close to the original recording, particularly in live recordings.....nothing added or taken away.
>>> i gather the general consensus is fair to good...
In general i would imagine when nice builds start popping up for a specific driver it must be pretty good. There will always be opinions on what's better but it's usually a good sign when others make an effort to maximize a drivers performance in several different types of cabinet designs. I never heard this TB but it does look good on paper... and in that FLAT box.
Zilla
In general i would imagine when nice builds start popping up for a specific driver it must be pretty good. There will always be opinions on what's better but it's usually a good sign when others make an effort to maximize a drivers performance in several different types of cabinet designs. I never heard this TB but it does look good on paper... and in that FLAT box.
Zilla
it does look good on paper, like always if only distortion measures were published....maybe you could judge a small bit more without listening to them.
i think i may see what you are saying by flat box.......that would be an interesting experiment...i have a few 4' square 1" mdf lying around.....
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