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USB to I2S 384Khz - DSD Converter

I received the board today, thank you!

I have issues implementing the board with my Buffalo II, and I am curious if anyone has any suggestions. I have the older 80Mhz clock version of the Buffalo II, and use a Volumite. I run OSX Lion on a hackintosh as my source.

I hooked up the Amanero to the Buffalo II with about 8 inches of CAT5 cable, using three sets of twisted pairs, with the white cables soldered to ground, and the colored cables from Amanero to Buffalo- DATA to D2, FSCLK to D1, BCLK to DCLK.

It works, with the ground connected or not connected, but I get an annoying high pitched noise that is constant. I also get what sound like very quick dropouts, short stutters that seem to have no discernable pattern.

Any suggestions? Has anyone had success with this board and the 80Mhz Buffalo II? Do I have to unhook the USB power supply and hook the Amanero up to the 5 volt supply on my Buffalo?

I have an Otto II i2s switcher that I haven't tried yet, perhaps that will magically get rid of the noise. I have been considering getting the Transporter to use with my hacked SACD player with a DSD output, perhaps the transporter would solve the noise problem? There is also different firmware available from Twisted Pear, perhaps that is all I need?

Thank you for your time and help.
Aaron.
Hi

I also have noise, look in the documentation there is a simple isolation circuit, 8" is too long, mine is at 1" and so far it is rock solid except for the noise, noticed even when the DAC is turned off, I don't however have this noise when connecting the module to my notebook, so this appears to be a PC issue rather than a problem with the module, the isolation circuit is very simple to do though, have ordered the parts, will post back how it goes once done.
 
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I received the board today, thank you!

...

It works, with the ground connected or not connected, but I get an annoying high pitched noise that is constant. I also get what sound like very quick dropouts, short stutters that seem to have no discernable pattern.

...
Aaron.

Sounds like a problem in the PC side.

Things to try:
- Different USB port
- Power conditioner for the PC and also for the DAC
- Put a ferrite at the end of the USB cable or use a USB cable that already has a ferrite built in
- Shield the board
- The board has a CLC filter for the USB power. Try adding capacitance to the first capacitor (C27)
 
what samplerates are you trying to play? also try loosening DPLL bandwidth settings on BII. 8" is a bit long, but I wouldnt have thought it would be enough to make it unusable. unlock issues with some sources were common with early firmware, also try as low tech as it sounds, to let the system warm up for 30 mins or so.

the OTTO wont help

Unfortunately I think that the only way to change the DPLL settings on the Buffalo II is through an Arduino (which I have not yet implemented) or getting a new firmware chip from Twisted Pear. My firmware is at least a few years old, I got it when I installed the Volumite. I did let the DAC warm up for that time period and still experienced the same issues. Perhaps I should order new firmware from TP (and get cracking on that arduino).

The problems occur at 44.1khz and up, with more than 192khz resulting in just noise because the clock in the Buffalo II (old version, 80Mhz) cannot handle those sampling rates (at least I think that's why they don't work).

The cable is shorter than 8 inches, I overestimated the length. I just eyeballed it with a sheet of paper, and it is probably around 5 inches.

Is there a simple way to power the Amanero with the 5 volt supply that is powering my DAC? I think that might help, because other people have had issues implementing the MUX with a separate power supply.

I looked at the application notes and saw that there is a recommendation for an isolator (mentioned above as well). The isolator would be difficult to implement without a board. TI sells an a board for the isolator for $49, which I could get, but I hope to find a different solution. There is also a board that isolates the USB supply that might help, but I am not certain that it would (might be fun to try though...).

Thanks for everyones help and suggestions. Hopefully I will be able to get this working well.

Aaron.
 
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Unfortunately I think that the only way to change the DPLL settings on the Buffalo II is through an Arduino (which I have not yet implemented) or getting a new firmware chip from Twisted Pear. My firmware is at least a few years old, I got it when I installed the Volumite. I did let the DAC warm up for that time period and still experienced the same issues. Perhaps I should order new firmware from TP (and get cracking on that arduino).

The problems occur at 44.1khz and up, with more than 192khz resulting in just noise because the clock in the Buffalo II (old version, 80Mhz) cannot handle those sampling rates (at least I think that's why they don't work).

The cable is shorter than 8 inches, I overestimated the length. I just eyeballed it with a sheet of paper, and it is probably around 5 inches.

Is there a simple way to power the Amanero with the 5 volt supply that is powering my DAC? I think that might help, because other people have had issues implementing the MUX with a separate power supply.

I looked at the application notes and saw that there is a recommendation for an isolator (mentioned above as well). The isolator would be difficult to implement without a board. TI sells an a board for the isolator for $49, which I could get, but I hope to find a different solution. There is also a board that isolates the USB supply that might help, but I am not certain that it would (might be fun to try though...).

Thanks for everyones help and suggestions. Hopefully I will be able to get this working well.

Aaron.

What were you using before? SPDIF input?. I believe the original TPA firmware had the DPLL set at "lowest" and thus it will work with SPDIF but with I2S you will get dropouts. However, the dropouts will be much reduced as the DAC warms up. There is a difference between "dropouts" and "crackling". In dropouts you will see the lock LED flash. If it is "crackling", then that is from the source.

My experience is that cable length even at 8" would not cause any problems.

The USB isolator does not handle USB2 speeds.

Try finding the source of the noise before trying to filter it at the end. I would consider this a last resort solution. Try the zero or near zero options first before spending any money. Try a laptop or another source to determine if you have a faulty device or not.

Based on the schematics, the Amanero board is well engineered with good power filtering and bypassing everywhere...
 
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This certainly looks interesting. Is there any reasonably simple way to turn that I2S into SDIF-2 to feed my dCS 972/955 inputs?

umm, no...

even if you could I really dont know why you would get this board if you were going to do that. for starters there is no way to send the DSD over spdif and the max PCM you could send is 192khz. With the added jitter and cost for adding a further i2s->Spdif stage to this, you may as well just get another USB->SPDIF module.

I presume you thought you could send DSD somehow?
 
I looked at the application notes and saw that there is a recommendation for an isolator (mentioned above as well). The isolator would be difficult to implement without a board. TI sells an a board for the isolator for $49, which I could get, but I hope to find a different solution. There is also a board that isolates the USB supply that might help, but I am not certain that it would (might be fun to try though...).

Thanks for everyones help and suggestions. Hopefully I will be able to get this working well.

Aaron.

The Isolator board that you linked to also does not support USB 2.0 High Speed, so you would be limited to 24/96.
 
What were you using before? SPDIF input?. I believe the original TPA firmware had the DPLL set at "lowest" and thus it will work with SPDIF but with I2S you will get dropouts. However, the dropouts will be much reduced as the DAC warms up. There is a difference between "dropouts" and "crackling". In dropouts you will see the lock LED flash. If it is "crackling", then that is from the source.

My experience is that cable length even at 8" would not cause any problems.

The USB isolator does not handle USB2 speeds.

Try finding the source of the noise before trying to filter it at the end. I would consider this a last resort solution. Try the zero or near zero options first before spending any money. Try a laptop or another source to determine if you have a faulty device or not.

Based on the schematics, the Amanero board is well engineered with good power filtering and bypassing everywhere...

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I appreciate your help.

Right now I am using the Buffalo with a MUX, SPDIF to i2s. I don't experience any noise or dropouts with this configuration. I also have a Philips 963 SACD player hacked to output DSD, and this works without noise or issues into the i2s inputs on my DAC as well. I assume that I have the firmware that has the DPLL at the "lowest" setting, it has been a few years since I installed my Volumite (I think before the clock on the Buffalo II went to 100Mhz).

Should the ground be connected from the Amanero to the Buffalo? It plays music either way, but is one a better choice?

I did try my laptop last night, but it made too much noise and I had to stop (likely because it seems the default setting on the Amanero is maximum). I will try to get it working better this afternoon and report back. I'll look for the lock light and see if it goes on and off.

Aaron.
 
Thank you for taking the time to respond. I appreciate your help.

Right now I am using the Buffalo with a MUX, SPDIF to i2s. I don't experience any noise or dropouts with this configuration. I also have a Philips 963 SACD player hacked to output DSD, and this works without noise or issues into the i2s inputs on my DAC as well. I assume that I have the firmware that has the DPLL at the "lowest" setting, it has been a few years since I installed my Volumite (I think before the clock on the Buffalo II went to 100Mhz).

Should the ground be connected from the Amanero to the Buffalo? It plays music either way, but is one a better choice?

I did try my laptop last night, but it made too much noise and I had to stop (likely because it seems the default setting on the Amanero is maximum). I will try to get it working better this afternoon and report back. I'll look for the lock light and see if it goes on and off.

Aaron.

Do you mean this mux: S/PDIF 4:1 Receiver/MUX Module if that is the case and you don't have dropouts, the you likely have the DPLL set at "best" (not "lowest").

The GND of the Amanero board should be connected to the BII Gnd. Make sure the wire connections are solid.

I also have a BII-80, I have not tried mine but will do so soon...
 

opc

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If it kinda works without any GND connection, then I'm guessing something is amiss with the wiring. Are you 100% confident that your ground connections are correct?

Try directly connecting the USB shell to the DGND on the DAC.

I too have a BII 80 and I have connected variety of different I2S sources to it without issue.

I'll be testing the Amanero with it this evening, so I can confirm later tonight or tomorrow.

Regards,
Owen
 
well theres probably a ground loop, if it works without being grounded, chances are the dac is grounded somewhere else that is also connected to the same ground as the USB input to amanero. this could perhaps disrupt the dac enough to cause dropouts methinks. I have the 80MHz version as well as the 100MHz version BII and the Ackodac :redface: sounds like you too have 'best' DPLL Owen, with lowest you would definitely have encountered issues at some point. best is a dynamic setting that sets as low as it can while remaining with solid lock. in practice this is normally around medium-low->medium

actually thats a question for Amanero, will the combo384 work with just the data wires if external power supply is arranged? not all USB devices will allow this.

@glt: afaik 'lowest' spdif is a different DPLL setting to 'lowest' i2s, with the spdif being set to a less demanding setting. I could be wrong there, but thats my memory
 
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Paid Member
Automatic DSD/I2S switching with Buffalo III SE?

I saw that TPA is about to release a Buffalo III SE (stereo edition) where one of the new features is that there is a header for changing the ES9018 settings between I2S and DSD. I think the Amanero USB/DSD/I2S has an output header which changes value when incoming DSD is detected.

Can this combo be wired so that Buffalo III SE changes settings automatically according to the Amanero output format?

Also, as the Amanero has an MCK output, and the BIII SE a MCK header one might play with synchronous clocking. Correct?

Any opinions?

Cheers,

Nic
 
yes and yes =D

the DSDOE (Output Enable) pin can be harnessed to trigger switching, Amanero will have to define what happens when its sensed and the timing, it was touched on a few pages ago from memory. I presume its either an i2c output, or it pulls logic high, or logic low when DSD is detected.

you can use sync mode, but the onboard clock speeds are not high enough for the ESS oversampling filter to also be enabled at the higher bandwidths. it also, although providing an MCLK output, isnt really an ideal connector type and probably not the lowest jitter. i'm sure it'll work though. it'll work for up to 88.2/96khz with the oversampling on, or the full range of speeds with it off.

so without the oversampling filter for higher speeds, as well as not ideal connections for a remote MCLK, i'm pretty certain jitter will be higher than using the async onboard clock, so will be somewhat counter-productive IMO.
 
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I played DSD trought Amanero USB-I2S with the same connection like PCM between the USB-I2S and the B3.

All my USB-I2S (Amanero & Lorien) card needs to connect is gnd ground to Sidecar gnd to play. Also my USB-SPDIF HiFace card need to connect is gnd ground to play.
 
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I assume that I have the firmware that has the DPLL at the "lowest" setting, it has been a few years since I installed my Volumite (I think before the clock on the Buffalo II went to 100Mhz).

If you have any concern on the DPLL bandwidth setting of your firmware, why don't you detach MCU and make a DAC chip default effective. In that case, please remember that a volume gets small because of no input redirections.
 
umm, no...

even if you could I really dont know why you would get this board if you were going to do that. for starters there is no way to send the DSD over spdif and the max PCM you could send is 192khz. With the added jitter and cost for adding a further i2s->Spdif stage to this, you may as well just get another USB->SPDIF module.

I presume you thought you could send DSD somehow?

The SDIF-2 interface is a three wire professional studio interface that in dCS (and Sony, pyramix, etc.) professional units can be used to transmits DSD in the configuration L, R, CLK, just like this raw I2S. But in contrast to I2S which is really only a protocol that is normally used for internal communication on short lengths between chips, SDIF-2 is suitable for normal length cables (75 Ohm BNC)

So I have DSD capable DAC that can recieve it in SDIF-2 format. I currently upsample to DSD and then go to the DAC, but if there is any way to convert I2S to SDIF-2, I could benefit from native DSD files played on my computer. But I figured it wasn't going to be easy despite the similarity of the three wire interface.