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Old 9th January 2013, 04:20 PM   #5891
ds23man is offline ds23man  Netherlands
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And now for something completely different:
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Old 9th January 2013, 05:12 PM   #5892
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Default Suckered?

If this is true I'd want the NC1200, as I care about music rather than numbers on a spec sheet, Bruno is a numbers guy at least what I have read leads me to believe that. If the NC400 is indeed inferior then the opamps in NC1200 must be some fantastic beasts, or maybe the discrete circuit in the NC400 is.....Oh never mind I'll save my money for devialet d premier.
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Old 9th January 2013, 06:44 PM   #5893
Julf is offline Julf  Europe
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Originally Posted by calvert73 View Post
Oh never mind I'll save my money for devialet d premier.
You clearly like crappy numbers
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Old 9th January 2013, 08:32 PM   #5894
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Originally Posted by calvert73 View Post
If this is true I'd want the NC1200, as I care about music rather than numbers on a spec sheet, Bruno is a numbers guy at least what I have read leads me to believe that. If the NC400 is indeed inferior then the opamps in NC1200 must be some fantastic beasts, or maybe the discrete circuit in the NC400 is.....Oh never mind I'll save my money for devialet d premier.
Yes for him numbers is the game and music is the claim

That said, there are no indications that the buffer stage is vital to the reported differences -neither numerically nor musically.

Reading way too many specs sheets on various class D amps the tendency is that higher power ratings relates to higher distortion numbers -if everything else is equal. There is absolutely no reason to believe that this is different for the Ncore variants. -at least if one looks at the numbers.

Interesting though, is that this number-game in practice does not seem to be consistent in how it conveys into music...

My hunch is that the reason lie partly in the implementation and partly in the control circuitry´s dependence on rail voltage.

Has anyone compared similar implementations of the two Ncore variants -e.g. same type of chassis and exactly the same PS ?
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Old 9th January 2013, 08:47 PM   #5895
ChrisPa is offline ChrisPa  United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by ds23man View Post
And now for something completely different:
Nice

That belongs on another thread too...
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Old 9th January 2013, 08:59 PM   #5896
vulture is offline vulture  United States
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Originally Posted by ds23man View Post
And now for something completely different:
What PSU's are these? And, can you feed two ncore modules from a single PSU board?
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Old 9th January 2013, 09:03 PM   #5897
ChrisPa is offline ChrisPa  United Kingdom
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What Bruno said iirc, a long time ago, for this is a very long thread, is that he designs for both measured and audible transparency between input and output, and that he uses measurements to help determine the cause of what he can hear.

He said that one of the ways he determines audible transparency is by comparing (listening to) the differences between the input and the output signals. I am sure he has listened to both the nc400 and nc1200 and his and hypex's observations are not simply based on measurement. I also suspect that the observations won't have been based simply on component substitution of nc1200 for nc400

Whether he is right or not is, of course, up to us all to interpret individually
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Old 9th January 2013, 09:05 PM   #5898
ChrisPa is offline ChrisPa  United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by vulture View Post
What PSU's are these? And, can you feed two ncore modules from a single PSU board?
Smps 600

Of course you can
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Old 9th January 2013, 11:24 PM   #5899
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Originally Posted by ChrisPa View Post
What Bruno said iirc, a long time ago, for this is a very long thread, is that he designs for both measured and audible transparency between input and output, and that he uses measurements to help determine the cause of what he can hear.

He said that one of the ways he determines audible transparency is by comparing (listening to) the differences between the input and the output signals. I am sure he has listened to both the nc400 and nc1200 and his and hypex's observations are not simply based on measurement. I also suspect that the observations won't have been based simply on component substitution of nc1200 for nc400

Whether he is right or not is, of course, up to us all to interpret individually
You are right, I recall Bruno to say something very similar to what you describe.

But the question -regarding observations - is always about the conditions under which they were produced. Observations are staged through instruments and methods and are by no means ever entirely "objective" in the word´s strictest sense.

Making comparative listening between a source´s output and that source´s output run through an amp must mean that the instrument was headphones - which as far as I know, is what Bruno use for that kind of tests.

I would be very hesitant to convey interpretations made through earphones onto speakers. We simply can´t neglect that speakers are a very different load than earphones that can be driven by a source component. When strong current flows change direction through the O/P stage and (unfortunately) through the ground plane as consequence of a speakers dynamic load, be sure that the conditions for the observation changes
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Old 9th January 2013, 11:51 PM   #5900
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When comparing NC400 and NC1200 amps you change many variables by moving from amp A to amp B - the input stage is just one of them.
It is not wise to jump into conclusions about the contribution of any of the specific variables to by just comparing the two amps.
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Last edited by TheShaman; 9th January 2013 at 11:53 PM.
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