Hi,
We’re pleased to present a design we’ve worked on for the last 8 months. The project is realized with cooperation of MisterRogers.
The final design took a little longer than anticipated - resulting in several stages:
We’ve also designed a control LCD indicator board, along with the firmware needed to provide complete control of all DAC chip features.
Specifications
All available features of the DAC are accessible via indicator board / firmware
Realization
Price for USB input board, DAC board and LCD indicator board: Euro 546.
Regards,
Joro
We’re pleased to present a design we’ve worked on for the last 8 months. The project is realized with cooperation of MisterRogers.
The final design took a little longer than anticipated - resulting in several stages:
First stage, the analogue circuit was designed for ‘through hole’ components.
Second stage, the analogue circuit was reworked for SMD components.
- The idea was to compare both designs sonically. Many different listeners at different gatherings verified the SMD design to be as good, or better than the first stage through-hole design. Corrections or tweaks were identified during testing to insure the best possible sonic performance.
- Third stage, apply these changes to our SMD board.
We’ve also designed a control LCD indicator board, along with the firmware needed to provide complete control of all DAC chip features.
Specifications
USB (XMOS based) input: up to 384kHz 32 bit, up to DSD128
- AES/EBU up to 192kHz, 24 bit
- S/PDIF up to 192kHz, 24 bit
- Optical up to 192kHz, 24 bit
- Outputs: RCA (Single Ended) & XLR (Balanced)
All available features of the DAC are accessible via indicator board / firmware
- 5 different sonic filters
- DSD mode - volume bypass and normal path
- 5 different sound quality settings
- Volume control
- Phase inverting
- De-emphasis
Realization
- Two AK4495S DAC chips are used in a Dual Mono configuration
- Discrete power supplies - one per channel
- Pre-regulator / LDO for digital circuit
- ADM7150 LDO is used for oscillators
- NDK NZ2520SD oscillators, optionally Crystek CCHD 957’s can be used
- All inputs are Galvanically Isolated
- In the analogue circuit we’ve only used PPS Film capacitors, no ceramic ones. All signal path resistors are Susumu.
- To power this board one will need three transformers: 2x22V and 1x12V.
Price for USB input board, DAC board and LCD indicator board: Euro 546.
- For EU additional 20% VAT.
- Estimation for ready boards: late August 2015.
- All signup’s on or before 7/31/15 receive free shipping.
Regards,
Joro
Attachments
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Very nice!!!
Just a quick question... Will you be supporting a remote control such as the Apple remote?
If I may also add, wouldn't it be easier for DIY to use a rotary encoder with push button instead of the four buttons? It is easier to implement on a faceplate than those four buttons.
Thanks
Do
Just a quick question... Will you be supporting a remote control such as the Apple remote?
If I may also add, wouldn't it be easier for DIY to use a rotary encoder with push button instead of the four buttons? It is easier to implement on a faceplate than those four buttons.
Thanks
Do
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Hi Joro and Lyuben,
First of all, Congratulations on this project! The team has gone along way. Well done!
Please note - I have made an order for the complete combo AK4490 with LME49710 and LCD Yetersday, unaware this will be available. Would you kindly allow me to exchange the order made Yetersday for AK4490 combo to this dual mono AK4495S with Crytek CCHD-957's? Please invoice me the differences to my PayPal account.
I will also email Lyuben to get this assistance.
Many thanks,
Chanh
First of all, Congratulations on this project! The team has gone along way. Well done!
Please note - I have made an order for the complete combo AK4490 with LME49710 and LCD Yetersday, unaware this will be available. Would you kindly allow me to exchange the order made Yetersday for AK4490 combo to this dual mono AK4495S with Crytek CCHD-957's? Please invoice me the differences to my PayPal account.
I will also email Lyuben to get this assistance.
Many thanks,
Chanh
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You meant having I2S direct from BeagleBone Black via Botic driver in the absence of I2S over USB add-on XMOS board? If so, I would also be interested!
Chanh.
Curious, yesterday I read about the DAC (with Google Translate) in this Bulgarian web:
Нещо интересно на хоризонта
-> MYHIFI - ???? ????????? ?? ?????????
with GT to English: Something interesting on the horizon
-> https://translate.google.es/transla...акво-слушахме/209-нещо-интересно-на-хоризонта
Нещо интересно на хоризонта
-> MYHIFI - ???? ????????? ?? ?????????
with GT to English: Something interesting on the horizon
-> https://translate.google.es/transla...акво-слушахме/209-нещо-интересно-на-хоризонта
Agreed! Though it would deviate somewhat from the original design nor will it be feasible?
May be Joro would enlighten us all its feasibility?
Hi,
Regards,
Joro
I have to write some more code for adaptive receiver.
Yes, that's correct, for me it would be easier with this encoder, but some friends didn't approve this scenario.
Thank you. No problem at all.
The device is already done and I don't think to add I2S input. USB to I2S deals quite good, IMHO.
Regards,
Joro
Hi Joro.
I'm using your current USB-I2S interface. I really like it.
However. With any kind of USB filter (iPurifier, USB-Regen, etc.) attached to it
it improves/changes its performance. ( I use external power supplies and have the 5V
line disconnected)
I'm wondering if you have put some extra focus on the USB interface to make it even better.
Have you tested it against e.g. Uptone Audio USB-Regen, Schiit Wyrd, etc. ??
With the new board @650€, you're entering a different market segment.
The board gotta be better then pretty much all other DIY solutions around.
And then there are also plenty of capable commercial DACs in that ballpark.
You'll face a tough competition.
A properly implemeneted USB interface that wouldn't require an e.g. USB-regen or Schiit Wyrd etc., anymore could make THE difference to me.
THX
I'm using your current USB-I2S interface. I really like it.
However. With any kind of USB filter (iPurifier, USB-Regen, etc.) attached to it
it improves/changes its performance. ( I use external power supplies and have the 5V
line disconnected)
I'm wondering if you have put some extra focus on the USB interface to make it even better.
Have you tested it against e.g. Uptone Audio USB-Regen, Schiit Wyrd, etc. ??
With the new board @650€, you're entering a different market segment.
The board gotta be better then pretty much all other DIY solutions around.
And then there are also plenty of capable commercial DACs in that ballpark.
You'll face a tough competition.
A properly implemeneted USB interface that wouldn't require an e.g. USB-regen or Schiit Wyrd etc., anymore could make THE difference to me.
THX
Hi Joro,
I have some questions regarding the hummingbird dac.
- boardsize, main and control.
- power requirements.
- is there a remote control possibility?
- output voltages?
- delivery incl XLR and cinch connectors.
just curious why needs the output stage 2*22 v (answer probably because of the regulation....)
Gr GJ
I have some questions regarding the hummingbird dac.
- boardsize, main and control.
- power requirements.
- is there a remote control possibility?
- output voltages?
- delivery incl XLR and cinch connectors.
just curious why needs the output stage 2*22 v (answer probably because of the regulation....)
Gr GJ
Hi,
Regards,
Joro
I haven’t tested with this device
- 230 x 173mm ; 123 x 40mm
For analogue power supplies – less than 50mA from a pin, for the digital one – less than 180mA
I’ll embed at least RC5.
3V RMS RCA; 6VRMS XLR, of course these voltages could be changed.
It’s not a problem to supply them
This board could be feed by one transformer, but on different listening sessions it was clear that there should be two transformers, i.e. one transformer for every channel and a separate transformer for the digital part.
Regards,
Joro
It's not about compatibility!
Wyred or USB-Regen are USB-hubs with filtering and reasonable power supplies.
The USB-Regen seems to be currently one of the best devices in this category.
These devices get you one step further in being less affected by upstream transports. Usually they cause worthwhile audible improvements.
Many of us learned that XMOS and asynchronous USB and galvanic isolation and more tweaks didn't really solve all the computer-audio related issues. (e.g. Joro's USB-I2S shows impact when hooking up a simple USB filter, switching USB cables asf. -- But he's is not alone!!)
Now. My logic is simple.
If a USB-DAC won't show any audible and measurable difference by hooking up e.g. the USB-Regen, the DAC designer has simply done his homework.
I'd expect that also the SW and HW tuning of the transport should have much less to none impact.
Bottom line.
Each designer should get himself such a device and test his DAC against it.
Switching and/or tuning the transport side becomes more and more irrelevant this way.
Beside that the designer would currently still have a kind of unique selling point.
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Hi,
Why cables and different additional filter USB devices have influence?
According to me based on some measurements, which I made with spectrum analyzer, different kinds of cables transmit the common noises/disturbances from the computer in a different way. The additional filter USB device such as Wyrd and AudioQuest JitterBug and others reduces these noises before going to the case (if the device has a case) or if it is a bare PCB board – away from the device. When the USB cable is plugged directly to the end device, these noises are already in the case or immediately next to the receiving part, further the influence of the noise may have different perform.
There is a whole industry dealing with reducing the influence of the cables such as Neotech, Audience Conductor, Tara Labs, AudioQuest, Furutech and so on. The prices vary from several Euros to couple of thousands Euros. The fact that this industry put a lot of resources for development of better cables (for a pity more expensive ) means that this makes sense. And the additional filter device contributes for better attenuating of the noises.
Of course that the galvanic isolation doesn’t solve all issues, but the positive effect, which is given for the sound is proven on many listening sessions.
For sure the influence of every single component of the sounds could be estimated strongly subjective.
Regards,
Joro
Yes, the analogue output part can be bypassed.
Why cables and different additional filter USB devices have influence?
According to me based on some measurements, which I made with spectrum analyzer, different kinds of cables transmit the common noises/disturbances from the computer in a different way. The additional filter USB device such as Wyrd and AudioQuest JitterBug and others reduces these noises before going to the case (if the device has a case) or if it is a bare PCB board – away from the device. When the USB cable is plugged directly to the end device, these noises are already in the case or immediately next to the receiving part, further the influence of the noise may have different perform.
There is a whole industry dealing with reducing the influence of the cables such as Neotech, Audience Conductor, Tara Labs, AudioQuest, Furutech and so on. The prices vary from several Euros to couple of thousands Euros. The fact that this industry put a lot of resources for development of better cables (for a pity more expensive
) means that this makes sense. And the additional filter device contributes for better attenuating of the noises.Of course that the galvanic isolation doesn’t solve all issues, but the positive effect, which is given for the sound is proven on many listening sessions.
For sure the influence of every single component of the sounds could be estimated strongly subjective.
Regards,
Joro
Joro.
We're in the digital world here. Bits are bits.
The whole industry pretty much ignored the subject of upstream induced distortions,
data jitter, poor signals etc. on the digital paths -- at least to a large extent.
Customers were forced to shut up by the industry if problems were reported.
Asynchronous USB-Audio has been marketed as the holy grail for years.
I'm having similar discussions for more than 8 years. (usually over at Audio Asylum. You can meet several industry hot shots over there)
It's not about technology. It's about ignorance!! And it's about marketing tactics.
It's about the same and similar excuses, you just brought up.
These guys sell DACs at $6000 or more and seriously tell you to hook up a $200 USB filter, use "audiophile" PCs, distributions and/or players.
All that wouldn't be needed if the DAC manufacturers would do their homework.
If you think applying the filtering inside a DAC is too late, you're IMO wrong.
There's IMO no better place. Only the designer can measure the impact of upstream technology. For the user it's gonna be a never ending tweaking story.
It's a matter how you do the engineering. How you build your input, ground, powersupply...
Of course you can't just apply a standard XMOS engineering blueprint. That's what everybody does. And that's why everybody fails. You realized too that this is not good enough. The USB-Regen folks gave you guys a lot of nice hints what to look for.
Bottom line. You're late to the party. You're asking 650€ for a AK4495S DAC module without PS, case switches.... . That's pretty much the upper range for DIY boards.
I'll get a complete Aune S16, that comes with the same DAC chip, for less. And that one I can resell at least.
Of course there are more interesting DIY DACs at a lower entry ticket.
Again. What's your unique selling point??
My point. Have a look at the USB interface. If 20$ more effort for you would mean $200 less in USB gadgets and even more on transport optimizations to me (and many more people) the business case starts becoming interesting.
Anyhow. Good luck with the project.
I'm still enjoying your IMO very competitive <€100 USB-I2S-5102 combo. ( I don't expect such a device to come up with a close to perfect USB interface. )
Cheers
We're in the digital world here. Bits are bits.
The whole industry pretty much ignored the subject of upstream induced distortions,
data jitter, poor signals etc. on the digital paths -- at least to a large extent.
Customers were forced to shut up by the industry if problems were reported.
Asynchronous USB-Audio has been marketed as the holy grail for years.
I'm having similar discussions for more than 8 years. (usually over at Audio Asylum. You can meet several industry hot shots over there)
It's not about technology. It's about ignorance!! And it's about marketing tactics.
It's about the same and similar excuses, you just brought up.
These guys sell DACs at $6000 or more and seriously tell you to hook up a $200 USB filter, use "audiophile" PCs, distributions and/or players.
All that wouldn't be needed if the DAC manufacturers would do their homework.
If you think applying the filtering inside a DAC is too late, you're IMO wrong.
There's IMO no better place. Only the designer can measure the impact of upstream technology. For the user it's gonna be a never ending tweaking story.
It's a matter how you do the engineering. How you build your input, ground, powersupply...
Of course you can't just apply a standard XMOS engineering blueprint. That's what everybody does. And that's why everybody fails. You realized too that this is not good enough. The USB-Regen folks gave you guys a lot of nice hints what to look for.
Bottom line. You're late to the party. You're asking 650€ for a AK4495S DAC module without PS, case switches.... . That's pretty much the upper range for DIY boards.
I'll get a complete Aune S16, that comes with the same DAC chip, for less. And that one I can resell at least.
Of course there are more interesting DIY DACs at a lower entry ticket.
Again. What's your unique selling point??
My point. Have a look at the USB interface. If 20$ more effort for you would mean $200 less in USB gadgets and even more on transport optimizations to me (and many more people) the business case starts becoming interesting.
Anyhow. Good luck with the project.
I'm still enjoying your IMO very competitive <€100 USB-I2S-5102 combo. ( I don't expect such a device to come up with a close to perfect USB interface.
)Cheers
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