The amps are Joule Electra Stargate SET Monos, and sorry, yes Lighter Note. I had one with a multiple inputs which I sold and currently have another that's just a single input. Both Lighter Notes sounds fantastic except for the hum. When I hook up an active preamp, no hum. My system is vinyl only so there's a phono preamp (Dynavector P75) going into the Lighter Note. I was told by the builder of my Lighter Note that when you connect regular "active" preamps they have their own ground than runs from plug earth connector all the way to rca connector ground, so whenever you connect it to the amp, even without a source, the connection is already grounded. The Lighter Note does not provide signal ground, it passes whatever ground comes from the source. Is this the same with the Warpspeed?
There's a couple of guys over on the hub.Audiogon.com (Identify this hum, please) that are talking about this very same thing - Minorl, Atmasphere, etc.
The Warpspeed has the very same signal path setup as the LighterNote - the series resistor followed by the shunt resistor to signal gnd - no connection whatsoever to any chassis earth power supply earth or anything - it's like having a volume pot just stuck in the middle of your Interconnects cables - the variable resistors of the LDRs are completely isolated so the earth loop problem (assuming that's what it is) is something to do with the earth connection of the source phono preamp &/or the power amps from the brief look I had.
It also sounds like your Stargate's have their central 0 volt point of the actice circuitry tied directly to the chassis earth - nothing wrong with that but it does tend to magnify any ground loop problems and there's easy ways of getting around this problem (seperating central 0volt point from chassis earth via 10 Ohm thermistor, diodes plus resistors, etc) but not sure if the simple mods will void any gaurantee/insurance.
The same thing works for any component using mains power - for a phono preamp, particularly if it's a good one, it's a 100 ohm resistor to separate the chassis earth from the preamp central 0volt point (usually in the power supply between the power caps)
Another thing to check with Uriah's LighterNote is that the impedance setting can easily be changed and you need to know if this has been setup for your Stargate's input impedance, and from a Review, I gather this varies from 20kR (SE) to 50kR (PP mode) - so this will need to be addressed properly too - this is the advantage of the LighterNote design, and it's well worth investigating it.
I too, use a WarpSpeed in my system and it doesn't have the LighterNote flexibility but it is quite a bit more tolerant of load resistances.
Neither units present any problems with 'hum' or 'ground loops', and wouldn't expect them too, if properly built.
'hope this is of some use to you ...
The Warpspeed has the very same signal path setup as the LighterNote - the series resistor followed by the shunt resistor to signal gnd - no connection whatsoever to any chassis earth power supply earth or anything - it's like having a volume pot just stuck in the middle of your Interconnects cables - the variable resistors of the LDRs are completely isolated so the earth loop problem (assuming that's what it is) is something to do with the earth connection of the source phono preamp &/or the power amps from the brief look I had.
It also sounds like your Stargate's have their central 0 volt point of the actice circuitry tied directly to the chassis earth - nothing wrong with that but it does tend to magnify any ground loop problems and there's easy ways of getting around this problem (seperating central 0volt point from chassis earth via 10 Ohm thermistor, diodes plus resistors, etc) but not sure if the simple mods will void any gaurantee/insurance.
The same thing works for any component using mains power - for a phono preamp, particularly if it's a good one, it's a 100 ohm resistor to separate the chassis earth from the preamp central 0volt point (usually in the power supply between the power caps)
Another thing to check with Uriah's LighterNote is that the impedance setting can easily be changed and you need to know if this has been setup for your Stargate's input impedance, and from a Review, I gather this varies from 20kR (SE) to 50kR (PP mode) - so this will need to be addressed properly too - this is the advantage of the LighterNote design, and it's well worth investigating it.
I too, use a WarpSpeed in my system and it doesn't have the LighterNote flexibility but it is quite a bit more tolerant of load resistances.
Neither units present any problems with 'hum' or 'ground loops', and wouldn't expect them too, if properly built.
'hope this is of some use to you ...
Ground loop(s) somewhere between your components? Not having the same exact system as yours I can only speculate the cause, but a good place to start is with your interconnects and power cords with safety ground. There are articles on how to hunt for these loops and they're better at explaining. Here are examples: https://www.passdiy.com/project/articles/ground-loops and How To Fix Turntable Hum: The Most Common Turntable Problem | Best Turntables
Being battery operated, the W'speed's signal ground is separate from the battery (-) ground. Being off the grid might help to break a ground loop between your phono preamp and power amplifier.
There are several W'speed owners on heavy daily dosage of vinyl but I have not heard from any of them of any hum issues. Here's one -check out his shelves of vinyl -just half of his collection!: Enjoy life with LP's and Turntables: Have you ever thought of a "45/45 rpm" dual pulley for Rega?
Being battery operated, the W'speed's signal ground is separate from the battery (-) ground. Being off the grid might help to break a ground loop between your phono preamp and power amplifier.
There are several W'speed owners on heavy daily dosage of vinyl but I have not heard from any of them of any hum issues. Here's one -check out his shelves of vinyl -just half of his collection!: Enjoy life with LP's and Turntables: Have you ever thought of a "45/45 rpm" dual pulley for Rega?
That's what I was hoping, that having a battery operated unit might break the ground loop but unfortunately it's one of those trial and error things. I have a Bottlehead kit here that's battery operated that I may just have to go ahead and build to try out that theory. I've swapped all the interconnects and lifted all the grounds one at a time and that's what isolated the Lighter Note as being the problem. An active preamp solves the problem but the difference in sound quality is pretty startling. My wife had a sad look on her face when the Hagerman Clarinet was in the system because even she could hear the difference.
Thanks so much for the help.
Thanks so much for the help.
The only way the LighterNote could create this ground loop is if the guy that built it has mistakenly added a chassis ground connection via the phono plugs or the output pcb circuitry - if there is a connection (simple check with multimeter), it shouldn't be there and just remove it. (This is the signal plugs for the interconnect, not the chassis earth)
I repeat this for emphasis, that there shouldn't be any ground or chassis connection between the signal interconnects and the earthed chassis, and the LighterNote shouldn't be the source of any ground loop at all.
Also, please check that the phono plugs themselves are isolated from the metal chassis - this could have been missed in the build.
Apart from that, there really isn't much else to go wrong - there just the 4 resistors part of the LDRs that are connected top the signal path - the Leds themselves don't carry any hum, or low freq anything, across to the photo-sensitive resistors.
It's a bit of a puzzle why you're having this problem.
However, Alan's battery power system of the WarpSpeed will certainly make sure there's nothing at all connected to the mains, so pretty much guaranteed no source of ground loops there either, and the ready built construction will make sure it's built to specs.
Either units are well worth perservering with if the improvement in clarity, detail and transparency suits your system - there's nothing quite like it anywhere else and you just have to make sure your source's output impedances (of the phono preamp) is low enough not to cause problems - the amp's 20 -> 50kR is okay, IMO.
I repeat this for emphasis, that there shouldn't be any ground or chassis connection between the signal interconnects and the earthed chassis, and the LighterNote shouldn't be the source of any ground loop at all.
Also, please check that the phono plugs themselves are isolated from the metal chassis - this could have been missed in the build.
Apart from that, there really isn't much else to go wrong - there just the 4 resistors part of the LDRs that are connected top the signal path - the Leds themselves don't carry any hum, or low freq anything, across to the photo-sensitive resistors.
It's a bit of a puzzle why you're having this problem.
However, Alan's battery power system of the WarpSpeed will certainly make sure there's nothing at all connected to the mains, so pretty much guaranteed no source of ground loops there either, and the ready built construction will make sure it's built to specs.
Either units are well worth perservering with if the improvement in clarity, detail and transparency suits your system - there's nothing quite like it anywhere else and you just have to make sure your source's output impedances (of the phono preamp) is low enough not to cause problems - the amp's 20 -> 50kR is okay, IMO.
Yes, I did a bit of mucking about but ran into a problem in that my AKGs (k701s) are power hungry and the W/Speed gave rather thin, distorted sound and didn't want to push my luck - could have been the o/p stage of the CD player that I used (based on the 627 opamps)
I tried my old Senn HD424s (about 2,000 ohms) but again, not a good result - possibly the same problem with the drive chips - might try the W'Speed on the output of the Aikido pre, as it certainly will supply plenty of current -
I'm a bit hesitant, as not sure if the LDRs will accept the higher current use without complaint, but not sure.
It's operating so well that I'm not too keen to risk it.
I tried my old Senn HD424s (about 2,000 ohms) but again, not a good result - possibly the same problem with the drive chips - might try the W'Speed on the output of the Aikido pre, as it certainly will supply plenty of current -
I'm a bit hesitant, as not sure if the LDRs will accept the higher current use without complaint, but not sure.
It's operating so well that I'm not too keen to risk it.
Yes, that's where I'm got the W'Speed, at the input to the Aikido as per standard preamp setup - I've used the 6SN7s gainstage and buffer so it's got a gain of 10 (18dB I think) and will output 10 volts easily - current thru buffer is 7.5mA so will probably push out a couple of mA bit not at all happy with a 65R load!! I use the DAO current buffer for this and it'll put out at least 50mA+, no effort but it's a purpose built unit.
I thoughtbthe old Senn wouldn't have any problems as they have a very high Z of about 2kR - will go back and check this out as maybe didn't do it right.
Have a set of Beyer 880s but only 250R version so don't think the current thru the W'Speed will be enough or all too good for it -
Again, not sure af any of this but if you think with using the cd player as source (2V output via opa627 chips) and it'll be okay, I'll give this another try.
I thoughtbthe old Senn wouldn't have any problems as they have a very high Z of about 2kR - will go back and check this out as maybe didn't do it right.
Have a set of Beyer 880s but only 250R version so don't think the current thru the W'Speed will be enough or all too good for it -
Again, not sure af any of this but if you think with using the cd player as source (2V output via opa627 chips) and it'll be okay, I'll give this another try.
Quoting a gentleman from Bluegrass Kentuckee...
"I just wanted to post a few thoughts on Allan's wonderful Warpspeed I love it in my system . I only have two sources a Mac Mini computer with a Ultra Fi Musicstream DAC and external hard drive with 23000 songs . My analog setup is a Basis 2001 turntable , Graham 2.2 tonearm, Dynavector XX2 MK2 cartridge and 1600 records. This feeds a Aesthetix Rhea phono stage then on to a NAT SE2SE SET tube amp with 211 tubes. I use all Ridge Street audio cables [ power cords , interconnect , phono and speaker ] love them also . The speakers are from North Creek Music Systems when they made kits I have the Manifest model a MTM design with Scan speak woofers and a pair of ribbon tweeters one front one back side. I had the cabinets made by a local wood worker who did beautiful work with a waterfall bubinga wood . The room was built just for music in the basement of my home its size is 17 X 24 X 7.6 the room size was picked by the speaker designer . I have to say in my system a passive pre works wonderful i have never had better sound the first records i played gave me goose bumps and i had tears in my eyes . I can think of no better compliment to give Allan for his Warpspeed just great . I would say if a passive works in your system give it a try you will love it and it is also beautiful to look at. Allan is just great to work with he keep me updated on the build progress and the packing for shipment was great also Thanks so much for a great product. Allan feel free to quote me if you like or e mail me with any questions again thanks for letting me get closer to the music..."
Thanks, Marc...enjoy your V4x2 for years to come!
"I just wanted to post a few thoughts on Allan's wonderful Warpspeed I love it in my system . I only have two sources a Mac Mini computer with a Ultra Fi Musicstream DAC and external hard drive with 23000 songs . My analog setup is a Basis 2001 turntable , Graham 2.2 tonearm, Dynavector XX2 MK2 cartridge and 1600 records. This feeds a Aesthetix Rhea phono stage then on to a NAT SE2SE SET tube amp with 211 tubes. I use all Ridge Street audio cables [ power cords , interconnect , phono and speaker ] love them also . The speakers are from North Creek Music Systems when they made kits I have the Manifest model a MTM design with Scan speak woofers and a pair of ribbon tweeters one front one back side. I had the cabinets made by a local wood worker who did beautiful work with a waterfall bubinga wood . The room was built just for music in the basement of my home its size is 17 X 24 X 7.6 the room size was picked by the speaker designer . I have to say in my system a passive pre works wonderful i have never had better sound the first records i played gave me goose bumps and i had tears in my eyes . I can think of no better compliment to give Allan for his Warpspeed just great . I would say if a passive works in your system give it a try you will love it and it is also beautiful to look at. Allan is just great to work with he keep me updated on the build progress and the packing for shipment was great also Thanks so much for a great product. Allan feel free to quote me if you like or e mail me with any questions again thanks for letting me get closer to the music..."
Thanks, Marc...enjoy your V4x2 for years to come!
jh,
I actually listed them on one post but is now buried in the thread. Anyway here's a link where they're listed with a brief description, not including the iER options though... 6moons audio reviews: Warpspeed V8xW1 The list is in the middle of webpage #2.
When this post gets buried, just use the wormhole on my signature below to get you there...
I actually listed them on one post but is now buried in the thread. Anyway here's a link where they're listed with a brief description, not including the iER options though... 6moons audio reviews: Warpspeed V8xW1 The list is in the middle of webpage #2.
When this post gets buried, just use the wormhole on my signature below to get you there...
Warpspeed pilot on snooze...
This is not something out of left field for me but has been brewing for some time now. Due to what I'm sure now will be increased workload at my day job in the coming months I will not be accepting new orders at this time. Building new Warpspeeds will be put on snooze indefinitely while I concentrate my efforts on the job at hand. Gotta satisfy the bosses.
I might come up with a very limited number of builds per year just to keep it going but right now I'm not sure -we'll see. Just keep an eye on this thread
as this is where I update as needed.
Thank you to all who have been following this thread, I'm quite happy how it turned out -I still can't believe interest would be this much. For those who now own a kit or a fully-built unit, enjoy! If used as intended it will last a lifetime...or more.
This is not something out of left field for me but has been brewing for some time now. Due to what I'm sure now will be increased workload at my day job in the coming months I will not be accepting new orders at this time. Building new Warpspeeds will be put on snooze indefinitely while I concentrate my efforts on the job at hand. Gotta satisfy the bosses.
I might come up with a very limited number of builds per year just to keep it going but right now I'm not sure -we'll see. Just keep an eye on this thread
as this is where I update as needed.
Thank you to all who have been following this thread, I'm quite happy how it turned out -I still can't believe interest would be this much. For those who now own a kit or a fully-built unit, enjoy! If used as intended it will last a lifetime...or more.
Allan ; I have to say I like your warpspeed more and more everyday . I just put in some very nice tubes in my Aesthetix Rhea and the improvement in sound was dramatic . This allowed me to love the warpspeed even more and bring me even closer to the music I love . I hope at some point you are able to start production again and let other music lovers discover what a LDR can do for there system. Thank you so much for your product everybody that comes over for a day of music says the same thing [ that my system sounds great ] .
Marc from Kentucky
Marc from Kentucky