Legato Tweakers Thread... - Page 4 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Commercial Sector > Manufacturers > Twisted Pear

Twisted Pear Superior quality electronic kits

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 3rd October 2010, 08:26 AM   #31
needsp is offline needsp  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Hi barrows

He already did-

Legato pcb v 2.0.0 - Legato Discrete I/V Stage - Twisted Pear Audio Support

And sorry, I missed that you had already replaced R1-4 etc with 1W PRP's

Russ

Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ White View Post
Yes if your not going to use balanced outputs at all then I would definitely omit the buffer.
which I was referring to when I said "Russ felt the buffer he provided wasn't beneficial anyway"- when using the provided Bal to SE converter

I'm not throwing away the rest of my system to accomodate one source component, so SE is it is! And it's not as if this is a minority position- outside of the US, the vast majority of amplifiers are SE

Thanks

Paul

Last edited by needsp; 3rd October 2010 at 08:45 AM. Reason: clarification
  Reply With Quote
Old 3rd October 2010, 01:52 PM   #32
leo is offline leo  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: notts
Quote:
Originally Posted by needsp View Post
Hi Leo

Nice to hear from you! We must compare notes

At first I added just doubled up the FETs' using the BS250's from a second Legato I have. Got improved detail and naturalness. I find extra detail helps to identify a step in the right direction, but it's the extra naturalness that matters to me long term. I attend a lot of chamber concerts, and realistic timbe is ultimately everything to me

I then added a third FET to each pair (at first, I added the TP0610's the same way round, effectively "shorting" out the CFO with an internal protective diode until I noticed the different pinning ). Not so sure I like this, which is, I admit, very odd. I'm still using the B1 buffers, the 2SC2547E's, and the FET CCS pair

I'll equip my second Legato board with some extra SIL sockets so I can play around with FET no. CCS, buffers etc. But not straight away- want to get some music in first!

Best wishes

Paul
Hi Paul,

Thanks, nice to hear from you too Comparing notes would be great.

How I have things at the moment for Legato is for the psu 3 x transformers , 3 x +/-v PH shunt regs . I altered their output from 15v to 12v.
The BP Muse coupling caps Russ and Brian provide with the Legato are excellent caps for lytics and probably fine for most, like some others I wanted to try alternatives, at first I tried these polyester (10uf 50v ) which are compact enough to be a good fit http://www.wima.com/EN/WIMA_MKS_2.pdf I'm also trying various other film caps, obviously downside with the MKP types is that they are physically much larger , I find the film caps to sound cleaner compared to lytics , just a personal thing of course.

I've also been trying out alternative values for the 15nf filter cap with interesting results (SQ wise) for filtering I personally like the Evox PFR's more than the Wima MKP types. Highest values they do is 10nf though so I've been trying that as well as lower values .

I'm looking forward to trying parelling the fets, soon as they arrive and I've tried them I'll post impressions . I've not tried the output buffer yet

Got to say though Legato is a very nice performer , its quite different to the IVYIII , its certainly worth trying both

Last edited by leo; 3rd October 2010 at 01:55 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 3rd October 2010, 06:32 PM   #33
needsp is offline needsp  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Hi Leo

As it happens I have some 10u/50V Wima MKS2- I'll give them a try. Sometimes we all get too caught up in the whole bespoke capacitors for audio thing. The Nichicon Bipolars are superb electrolytic coupling caps; but even a (well made) polyester type like the Wima should best them

I also have IVY II and much- and increasingly- prefer the Legato

Paul
  Reply With Quote
Old 3rd October 2010, 10:34 PM   #34
diyAudio Member
 
Russ White's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Nashville, TN, USA
Send a message via Yahoo to Russ White
Quote:
Originally Posted by needsp View Post
Hi barrows

He already did-

Legato pcb v 2.0.0 - Legato Discrete I/V Stage - Twisted Pear Audio Support

And sorry, I missed that you had already replaced R1-4 etc with 1W PRP's

Russ



which I was referring to when I said "Russ felt the buffer he provided wasn't beneficial anyway"- when using the provided Bal to SE converter

I'm not throwing away the rest of my system to accomodate one source component, so SE is it is! And it's not as if this is a minority position- outside of the US, the vast majority of amplifiers are SE

Thanks

Paul
Hi Paul,

The main point is that *I* indeed would suggest that people try without the buffers first. The reason being I found no difference in performance between the two configurations. But, I never meant to imply that everyone should feel the same way.

I trust there are a few who may prefer the buffers be there. I personally do not. This is true for me regardless of whether the circuit is balanced or SE.

Now if someone were to show me objectively (measurably) that the SE output is enhanced by the buffers I would be very happy to change my advice.

I am just glad your enjoying it!

Cheers!
Russ
__________________
Less pulp more juice Twisted Pear Audio.

Last edited by Russ White; 4th October 2010 at 11:39 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2010, 07:53 AM   #35
needsp is offline needsp  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Hi

Just to be clear, I've no opinion on the optional emitter follower buffers. I'm talking about the FET B1-type buffers I used

Paul
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2010, 05:55 PM   #36
avr300 is offline avr300  Denmark
diyAudio Member
 
avr300's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: DK
Quote:
Originally Posted by needsp View Post
.
.
.
I've tried putting two extra BS250's (actually TP0610KL- see below) in parallel with each existing FET- wow! You guys are going to love Legato 2.
.
.
.
Paul N
Hi Paul.

Pls define "wow" (I like wow's, they often appeals to your feelings ).
  Reply With Quote
Old 5th October 2010, 06:41 AM   #37
sureshm is offline sureshm  Australia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ White View Post
I am glad you found the same results as me when paralleling FETs. I trust people will enjoy the new Legato revision. But for those who have the current boards it is a very very easy thing to add a couple more FETs.
Russ
Russ,

Could you please describe the differences you heard when you paralleled the FETs? I am guessing it was significantly better given that you have designed new boards for it.

Also, is there much difference between having 2 FETs and 3 FETs in parallel?

Suresh
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th October 2010, 02:40 PM   #38
anbello is offline anbello  Italy
diyAudio Member
 
anbello's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Italy
Hi,
I simulated legato2 with LTspice and i obtained a strange behavior:
with +12V/-12V of PS i get a second harmonic (of a 10KHz test signal) at -80dB, with +12V/-8V i get a second harmonic at -125dB (astonishing).
It seems that legato2 (and also legato - always from simulations) works better with asymmetrical PS.
Maybe i did some error on my simulation so i include the files to let you see and try.

Ciao
Andrea
Attached Files
File Type: zip legato2-iv.zip (2.0 KB, 37 views)
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th October 2010, 06:58 PM   #39
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by anbello View Post
Hi,
I simulated legato2 with LTspice and i obtained a strange behavior:
with +12V/-12V of PS i get a second harmonic (of a 10KHz test signal) at -80dB, with +12V/-8V i get a second harmonic at -125dB (astonishing).
It seems that legato2 (and also legato - always from simulations) works better with asymmetrical PS.
Maybe i did some error on my simulation so i include the files to let you see and try.

Ciao
Andrea
Hi Andrea,
I was lucky enough to receive a Legato 2.0 board when I ordered from Twisted Pear. Been listening to it for a week and it sounds superb. Just did a FFT with 10kHz sine wave with Placid BP at +12/-12v and it looks ok to me.
See below.

Regards
Cornelius

<table style="width:194px;"><tr><td align="center" style="height:194px;background:url(http://picasaweb.google.com/s/c/tran...background.gif) no-repeat left"><a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/vanwykca13/BuffIILegato20?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="http://lh4.ggpht.com/_87ClgeqViVA/TKzGFATYlEE/AAAAAAAAABA/gOx6-ozkhPA/s160-c/BuffIILegato20.jpg" width="160" height="160" style="margin:1px 0 0 4px;"></a></td></tr><tr><td style="text-align:center;font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:11px"><a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/vanwykca13/BuffIILegato20?feat=embedwebsite" style="color:#4D4D4D;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none;">Buff II + Legato 2.0</a></td></tr></table>
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th October 2010, 09:05 PM   #40
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Try again

Picasa Web Albums - Cornelius van Wyk
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Legato or IVY III outputs for Buffalo II? natzev_i Twisted Pear 272 21st March 2011 08:08 PM
One for Thorens tweakers Klimon Analogue Source 2 11th October 2008 09:05 PM
Priboi tweakers ? Zen Mod Tubes / Valves 4 14th May 2007 08:22 PM
Legato link dac chip,It reads data? Raj1 Digital Source 7 25th April 2007 11:25 AM
For all T-amp tweakers filholder Class D 13 14th July 2005 08:52 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 12:03 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2