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12AU7 vs 12BH7 vs 6CG7
12AU7 vs 12BH7 vs 6CG7
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Old 16th November 2011, 08:40 AM   #41
MrCurwen is offline MrCurwen  Finland
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These discussions are always somewhat of word games, but here's my 2 euro cents.

A system can be lifeless without adding anything - it can be lifeless by not amplifying something in the music, losing it along the way.

A well done lively record absolutely should sound lively, but I find that many systems don't project this through. I would characterise these systems as 'lifeless'. So the mark of a truely magnificent system would be that dry records always sound dry, and lively records sound rich and lively. My opinion is that a good system makes all kinds of music and recordings sound more of what their own character is, becoming truely transparent.
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Old 16th November 2011, 09:19 PM   #42
fdegrove is offline fdegrove  Europe
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Originally Posted by Original Burnedfingers View Post
I guess I'm still learning but I always thought the makings of a good audio system was the ability to amplify the signal without adding something to it that isn't there. You talk about the lifeless of a 6SN7 for example. I'm confused... so a tube is supposed to alter and inject something into the mix that just isn't there? I had always thought that a recording of a performace should sound just like the performace did. Boy was I wrong

So, my Aikido (6sn7/6sn7) and my Frank's 6sn7/5692 line stages are incorrect because they are more true to life sounding? My Quicksilvers with 12BH7 should have the 12BH7's pulled in favor of the 12Au7?

Oh, I almost forgot about the 6fq7/6cg7. The 6cg7 is better because its got a magical screen in it but yet when I have tried a one lb coffee can of assorted tube I can tell no difference in my 6FQ7/5687 Aikido. Still confused

Granted what I have is minimal compared to some of the systems and equipment that some here own but for accuracy against the real thing I'll go with what I have.
There is a large margin between what the industry considers as equivalent and to what actually is electrically.

Without even considering so called equivalents from data books etc, there's enough difference from one tube to another to make you wonder about the building blocks you're using in your search for the holy graal.

Just like lookng for DNA matches, sometimes it happens and you find yourself in the presence of something that actually matches your master tape.

In real life it rarely ever happens. Just as rarely as anyone winning the lottery and then some.

Why is this, you may ask?

The answer is quite simple: Money talks.

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Old 17th November 2011, 03:05 PM   #43
donerlank is offline donerlank  South Africa
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Interesting that Hans Beijner first used 12AX7 in the preamp stage and 12AU7 in the driver stage and 6C33C in the output stage in the 1st schematic of his OTL amp and subsequently published his latest OTL schematic with 12BH7 replacing the 12AU7 in the driver stage 12AX7 and 6C33C being retained. There will be a reason for this. I have not gotten round to ask him perhaps it works better in this topolgy, There is no guarantee that the one is better than the other in all configurations. I will surely ask him why he changed from 12AU7 to 12BH7. I also note that some SET,s use 12AX7 and 12BH7 and 6C33C.
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