This will be the first time I build a tube amplifier.
I need to find a project that is very good value for the money and not too difficult like Al M's proac 2.5 loudspeakers.
I build the proac 2.5 and I heared the original proac 2.5 with 20W from four 300B and that was a perfect match so I know that this is the kind of tube amplifier I must build. I have 30w EL34 and the sound is good but not the same as the 300B.
What is the best and well documented project I should choose?
What is your favourite parts supplier for this project?
Thank you for helping me get started!
Perka
I need to find a project that is very good value for the money and not too difficult like Al M's proac 2.5 loudspeakers.
I build the proac 2.5 and I heared the original proac 2.5 with 20W from four 300B and that was a perfect match so I know that this is the kind of tube amplifier I must build. I have 30w EL34 and the sound is good but not the same as the 300B.
What is the best and well documented project I should choose?
What is your favourite parts supplier for this project?
Thank you for helping me get started!
Perka
Hi Perka,
I have no idea of your needs or your budget.
Presumably, you put some thought and consideration into your idea of a 300B amplifier.
I see you have been posting in the speaker forum. What efficiency and type of speakers will you use?
I'm sure you have seen that there are many designs available.
If you look at recent threads in the tube forum, you''ll see one that is finshed, and one that still in progress.
Many of us are not biased against these, for they do have many virtues.
It is true that a small push-pull amplifier could be built for much less money. Such an amplifier would sound quite different.
If budget was not such a problem, and my speakers were efficient, personally I'd go for the 300B.
I hope this helps,
I have no idea of your needs or your budget.
Presumably, you put some thought and consideration into your idea of a 300B amplifier.
I see you have been posting in the speaker forum. What efficiency and type of speakers will you use?
I'm sure you have seen that there are many designs available.
If you look at recent threads in the tube forum, you''ll see one that is finshed, and one that still in progress.
Many of us are not biased against these, for they do have many virtues.
It is true that a small push-pull amplifier could be built for much less money. Such an amplifier would sound quite different.
If budget was not such a problem, and my speakers were efficient, personally I'd go for the 300B.
I hope this helps,
Hi dhaen,
I will use the proac response 2.5. They are not very sensible, but as impedance rareley go below 8ohm, they are not difficult to drive. I know that 20W about with 300B can drive them with very good results and as I have heared them with this.
Up to 1000usd is a reasonable budget. I guess this will cost me at least four times if I buy them finished from a well known manufacturer.
I know you can buy diy kits like "the Billy" from china for 700usd with 2x300B but then I only get 9W and I think my proac needs some more power http://www.diyhifisupply.com/diy_kits/the_billie.html
What is your favourite project?
regards,
Perka
I will use the proac response 2.5. They are not very sensible, but as impedance rareley go below 8ohm, they are not difficult to drive. I know that 20W about with 300B can drive them with very good results and as I have heared them with this.
Up to 1000usd is a reasonable budget. I guess this will cost me at least four times if I buy them finished from a well known manufacturer.
I know you can buy diy kits like "the Billy" from china for 700usd with 2x300B but then I only get 9W and I think my proac needs some more power http://www.diyhifisupply.com/diy_kits/the_billie.html
What is your favourite project?
regards,
Perka
Hi Perka,
Is it Push Pull or Single Ended, your thinking of?
An SE 300B will give less than 10 watts.
PP300B's can give 25 watts.
But the amplifiers will sound quite different.
Alternatively, there are some "Super" 300B types that can give 15 watts.
I'm sure you know that 10 watts is only 3dB less powerful than 20 watts.
Also, your choice depends on how much you want to do yourself:
Do you want to just assemble a kit? (Safest).
or,
Go for an existing design and source your own components. (This is not always the cheapest).
or,
try to design your own, using bits and ideas from other designs. (This can take a long time, and is risky if you are not experienced).
Whichever course you take, you can find help on this forum.
Even from those who disagree with your choice...
Cheers,
Is it Push Pull or Single Ended, your thinking of?
An SE 300B will give less than 10 watts.
PP300B's can give 25 watts.
But the amplifiers will sound quite different.
Alternatively, there are some "Super" 300B types that can give 15 watts.
I'm sure you know that 10 watts is only 3dB less powerful than 20 watts.
Also, your choice depends on how much you want to do yourself:
Do you want to just assemble a kit? (Safest).
or,
Go for an existing design and source your own components. (This is not always the cheapest).
or,
try to design your own, using bits and ideas from other designs. (This can take a long time, and is risky if you are not experienced).
Whichever course you take, you can find help on this forum.
Even from those who disagree with your choice...
Cheers,
Hi Perka,
I forgot. You could use PSE 300B's. (Parallel Single Ended).
Parallel topology is frowned upon by some, and approved by others.
Personaly I have an open mind at present.
Theroetically it should sound most like SE. But some people say that it sounds "blurred" by comparison. There are not convincing technical arguments either way.
Cheers,
I forgot. You could use PSE 300B's. (Parallel Single Ended).
Parallel topology is frowned upon by some, and approved by others.
Personaly I have an open mind at present.
Theroetically it should sound most like SE. But some people say that it sounds "blurred" by comparison. There are not convincing technical arguments either way.
Cheers,
John,
Everywhere I read people says the proac works best with SET,
although I'm not sure of the general sound differnce with PP.
I'm not sure what kind of 300B i listened to with the proacs (SET or PP), but the dealer said it was 30W of 300B (they use western electrics) and I just loved the sound. I then later on spoke to an tube amplifier constructor in Sweden (Erik Andersson that works for Audion) and he said "no way the tube amplifier you listened to can give 30W with 300B, maximum 18-20W" so I assume that is the correct figure.
So if 9W in SET is realistic (I think Audion uses 2x300B/channel SET to get 18W, but that design is maybe to difficult for DIY?),
I can go for that. Either buy a kit or assemble the components myself.
perka
Everywhere I read people says the proac works best with SET,
although I'm not sure of the general sound differnce with PP.
I'm not sure what kind of 300B i listened to with the proacs (SET or PP), but the dealer said it was 30W of 300B (they use western electrics) and I just loved the sound. I then later on spoke to an tube amplifier constructor in Sweden (Erik Andersson that works for Audion) and he said "no way the tube amplifier you listened to can give 30W with 300B, maximum 18-20W" so I assume that is the correct figure.
So if 9W in SET is realistic (I think Audion uses 2x300B/channel SET to get 18W, but that design is maybe to difficult for DIY?),
I can go for that. Either buy a kit or assemble the components myself.
perka
dhaen said:
Yes, I think Audion developed their new monoblocks with parallel 300B and they get 18W/channel. http://www.audion.co.uk/html/silver_night_.html
Hi perka,
Here are a few observations I have made on deciding what to do. on building an amp. It's not a perfect list.
1. Building From A Kit:
All parts are supplied by manufacturer. Usually the instructions are very thorough and thought out. There seems to always be a message board on the web dedicated to that design offering lots of help. You learn a lot and satisfaction is high. Initial cost can be expensive for some high end kits. Only dark side, a lot of people will have the same amp.
2. Building From Scratch:
First, the dark side,
There usually is only a schematic, you must choose one and then stick with it or design your own. You must source all your parts. You must determine your own layout for parts and build or buy a box to hold it all. Cut the box (metal working or wood working tools required or pay some one to do it). Ask a ton of question on a message board.
Second, the light side.
Buy things as you need them, can maintain a budget.
You build a one of a kind, You learn a lot more. The satisfaction is certainly as good, if not better, than building from a kit.
3. Repairing an old Amplifier:
Usually everything is there. Schematics are easy to obtain, A lot of web help available. Could be a lot of work and you are fixed to that design.
I just finished my first ever build, a set of monoblocks based on the design of the JE Labs 300b. The members here are very very helpfull.
Here is a link to my finished, (work in progress), amp/s.
http://www.diyvideo.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9442
Here are a few observations I have made on deciding what to do. on building an amp. It's not a perfect list.
1. Building From A Kit:
All parts are supplied by manufacturer. Usually the instructions are very thorough and thought out. There seems to always be a message board on the web dedicated to that design offering lots of help. You learn a lot and satisfaction is high. Initial cost can be expensive for some high end kits. Only dark side, a lot of people will have the same amp.
2. Building From Scratch:
First, the dark side,
There usually is only a schematic, you must choose one and then stick with it or design your own. You must source all your parts. You must determine your own layout for parts and build or buy a box to hold it all. Cut the box (metal working or wood working tools required or pay some one to do it). Ask a ton of question on a message board.
Second, the light side.
Buy things as you need them, can maintain a budget.
You build a one of a kind, You learn a lot more. The satisfaction is certainly as good, if not better, than building from a kit.
3. Repairing an old Amplifier:
Usually everything is there. Schematics are easy to obtain, A lot of web help available. Could be a lot of work and you are fixed to that design.
I just finished my first ever build, a set of monoblocks based on the design of the JE Labs 300b. The members here are very very helpfull.
Here is a link to my finished, (work in progress), amp/s.
http://www.diyvideo.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9442
Hi Perka,
I looked at the site. Yes they're claiming 18watts from PSE, or 25watts from PP. That sounds believable.
Do remember that some manufacturers quote prices without tubes.
The WE tubes you mentioned would use up all your budget. But you can buy other brands for the figures Frank mentioned.
IMO A PP amplifier sounds closer to a Solid State amp. An SET will sound "warmer".
Cheers,
I looked at the site. Yes they're claiming 18watts from PSE, or 25watts from PP. That sounds believable.
Do remember that some manufacturers quote prices without tubes.
The WE tubes you mentioned would use up all your budget. But you can buy other brands for the figures Frank mentioned.
IMO A PP amplifier sounds closer to a Solid State amp. An SET will sound "warmer".
Cheers,
Perka,
I am going to blow my own horn here:
First though, how much do you want to spend?
I have a 300B kit for $749 including all the tubes, putting out 9 watts per channel.
It gets rave reviews from my customers, and a recent DIY tube tasting I went to in Pennsylvania. It blew away an all transformer coupled 300B amp (I thought sounded very good, so I felt mine wouldn't come close) among others.
Check it out here: http://gabevee.tripod.com/cgv300b.html
Ignore the first paragraph, as I will go ahead and order a half dozen One Electrons to keep in stock. Also, ignore the picture. I have a much nicer chassis and layout.
Looks more like the one in the center of this page:
http://gabevee.tripod.com/protopics.html
It can come in red or black. I use the Hammond steel chassis. Much sturdier than the aluminum. The pictures are my prototypes.
I use SS rectification because otherwise I would need another transfomer for the filament. This helps keep cost down. I also use DC on the filaments because there is virtually no hum.
Gabe
I am going to blow my own horn here:
First though, how much do you want to spend?
I have a 300B kit for $749 including all the tubes, putting out 9 watts per channel.
It gets rave reviews from my customers, and a recent DIY tube tasting I went to in Pennsylvania. It blew away an all transformer coupled 300B amp (I thought sounded very good, so I felt mine wouldn't come close) among others.
Check it out here: http://gabevee.tripod.com/cgv300b.html
Ignore the first paragraph, as I will go ahead and order a half dozen One Electrons to keep in stock. Also, ignore the picture. I have a much nicer chassis and layout.
Looks more like the one in the center of this page:
http://gabevee.tripod.com/protopics.html
It can come in red or black. I use the Hammond steel chassis. Much sturdier than the aluminum. The pictures are my prototypes.
I use SS rectification because otherwise I would need another transfomer for the filament. This helps keep cost down. I also use DC on the filaments because there is virtually no hum.
Gabe
Hi perka,
Thank you for the compliment.
The design is based on the JE Labs 300b schematic designed by Joseph Esmilla. His web page is located here:
http://users.starpower.net/je2a3/shoptalk.htm
There is also Derek Walton's web page, which gives a very descriptive construction article. His web page is what inspired my adventure into DIY audio.
http://indigo.ie/~walton/300b.html
Most of the help I received bulding the amps was provided here on diyAudio.com. Frank and John were always there to help and many others gave comments and suggestions.
I used "JE Labs 300b" in my posts related to the building of the amps. I started, as you are, with getting ideas. Although I had all ready picked a schematic for the build.
Many European builders have built there version of the monoblocks, so 50hz and 220v should not be a problem at all.
I am currently using 92db efficient speakers and there is plenty of bass and the mids and highs are magic. I do need to start working on some hum issues, but it does not distract from the music. It is a hobby, I have learned quite a lot and I do want to learn more.
Sourcing parts was fun and taught me much about quality and availability.
Digi-Key:
http://www.digikey.com/
Parts Connexion:
http://www.partsconnexion.com/
Angela Instrument:
http://www.angela.com/
ElectraPrint Audio:
http://www.electraprint.com/
Goldpoint:
http://www.goldpt.com/index.html
and many others.
Hope you decide to build your own project and what ever it is, you will have fun and the rewards are worth it!
Thank you for the compliment.
The design is based on the JE Labs 300b schematic designed by Joseph Esmilla. His web page is located here:
http://users.starpower.net/je2a3/shoptalk.htm
There is also Derek Walton's web page, which gives a very descriptive construction article. His web page is what inspired my adventure into DIY audio.
http://indigo.ie/~walton/300b.html
Most of the help I received bulding the amps was provided here on diyAudio.com. Frank and John were always there to help
and many others gave comments and suggestions. I used "JE Labs 300b" in my posts related to the building of the amps. I started, as you are, with getting ideas. Although I had all ready picked a schematic for the build.
Many European builders have built there version of the monoblocks, so 50hz and 220v should not be a problem at all.
I am currently using 92db efficient speakers and there is plenty of bass and the mids and highs are magic. I do need to start working on some hum issues, but it does not distract from the music. It is a hobby, I have learned quite a lot and I do want to learn more.
Sourcing parts was fun and taught me much about quality and availability.
Digi-Key:
http://www.digikey.com/
Parts Connexion:
http://www.partsconnexion.com/
Angela Instrument:
http://www.angela.com/
ElectraPrint Audio:
http://www.electraprint.com/
Goldpoint:
http://www.goldpt.com/index.html
and many others.
Hope you decide to build your own project and what ever it is, you will have fun and the rewards are worth it!
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