testing a 13E1

[7N7]

Hi Petrotek and Paul L.

Indeed there was a problem with the pinout...as SY suggests in post 2: "I think the connections are right, but your numbering isn't." Eventually I could measure them and they were all measuring well, even though there was little left of their getters.

never got around to build something with them... plans are to make a copy of the Cristal Palace by MJ, but never got around to it, yet!

Erik

Hello Erik

Well building a "Crystal Palace" is a LOT of work!

I think that there are probably plenty of 13E1s available in England; I have often thought that anyone who wanted to build a really powerful amplifier for stage use could well look at 13E1.

There is someone who is building 1kW amplifiers using 813s, but I think that this is crazy - who would use thoriated tungsten types for a transportable amp? And the voltages he must be using?

On the other hand 13E1s as beam tetrodes running at say 700V on their anodes would be mighty I should say and they are probably rugged too - the internal structure certainly suggests it.

7N7

 

[Rjay]

13E1

Hi All

Good to see this thread resurrected.

Other than Billington and Michael's Emporium (both expensive), I'm not sure how many 13E1s are available for sale in the UK. Those for sale on eBay appear to be located in mainland Europe or the US.

Anyway, I've managed to accrue ten 13E1s at great expense - I think I started the 'credit crunch'!! - and was also thinking of building MJ's Crystal Palace design.

I'm interested in Erik's test jig (December 2007) and wonder how this has progressed? I would like to use a similar set up to plot the Ia/Va charactersitics. I tried to download 7N7's set posted in December 2007 but the link is broken. Any chance of reposting, 7N7?

Rjay

 

[7N7]

Re: 13E1

Hi All

Good to see this thread resurrected.

Other than Billington and Michael's Emporium (both expensive), I'm not sure how many 13E1s are available for sale in the UK. Those for sale on eBay appear to be located in mainland Europe or the US.

Anyway, I've managed to accrue ten 13E1s at great expense - I think I started the 'credit crunch'!! - and was also thinking of building MJ's Crystal Palace design.

I'm interested in Erik's test jig (December 2007) and wonder how this has progressed? I would like to use a similar set up to plot the Ia/Va charactersitics. I tried to download 7N7's set posted in December 2007 but the link is broken. Any chance of reposting, 7N7?

Rjay

Hello,

I still have the curves but I cannot remember how to post them here and anyway the useless "my network places" refuses to work today.

Email me on VAR1016@gmail.com and I'll send them to you. I hope.

try this: http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii11/Cambouis_photo/13E1.jpg

EDIT: I should add that when I was still active, I think that Langrex still had 13E1s
7N7

 

[Rjay]

Thanks 7N7, I've sent you an e-mail.

Yes, I had forgotten Langrex. Just checked and they have 715 in stock!! No pricing - need to request for a quote.

They're in the same part of the country as Billington and Michael's Emporium. I wonder if they sell from the same stock?

Rjay

 

[7N7]

Thanks 7N7, I've sent you an e-mail.

Yes, I had forgotten Langrex. Just checked and they have 715 in stock!! No pricing - need to request for a quote.

They're in the same part of the country as Billington and Michael's Emporium. I wonder if they sell from the same stock?

Rjay

I'm not sure about that but Langrex is very old-established; I can remember them back in the 1970s when they stocked all the Mullard range.

7N7

 

[barretter]

Langrex is no longer in South London but was sold to a chap who, I think, is a relative of the guy who owns Michael's Emporiium, which used to be Sussex Surplus. I think they both have the same Italian surname. I think they're father and son and the father used to have stalls at radio rally jumble sales,always with an interesting range of stuff.

 

[Rjay]

Thanks Barretter

It all fits together now. I remember Sussex Surplus, they've also attended audio jumble events that I've been to in the past - Rickmansworth and Tunbridge Wells, I think.

Yes, a good range of stuff but inevitably prices have risen substantially since those days.

Rjay

 

[7N7]

Langrex is no longer in South London but was sold to a chap who, I think, is a relative of the guy who owns Michael's Emporiium, which used to be Sussex Surplus. I think they both have the same Italian surname. I think they're father and son and the father used to have stalls at radio rally jumble sales,always with an interesting range of stuff.

You mean John Giacomelli of Colomor fame I think.

If you speak to him give him my regards

7N7
(Paul Leclercq)

 

[barretter]

Hi Paul, I'm a bit far from the Goldhawk Road these days and I always got the impression that that shop was run by people of East European origin, but Colomor along with Langrex and Billington are all based on industrial estates in Billingshurst, which seems to be the UK's "thermionic valley". Giacomelli is definitely the name I was groping for but I am not now sure who the owners of Langrex are, but certainly not the original ones in Steatham.
How are you doing in la belle France? I still remember my visit to your London flat with Morgan. All the best, Dave Mansell

 

[7N7]

Hi Paul, I'm a bit far from the Goldhawk Road these days and I always got the impression that that shop was run by people of East European origin, but Colomor along with Langrex and Billington are all based on industrial estates in Billingshurst, which seems to be the UK's "thermionic valley". Giacomelli is definitely the name I was groping for but I am not now sure who the owners of Langrex are, but certainly not the original ones in Steatham.
How are you doing in la belle France? I still remember my visit to your London flat with Morgan. All the best, Dave Mansell

Blimey! Hello Dave, how are you? I'm pretty far from Goldhawk Rd too!

Colomor was originally owned by Poles, and was bought by John Giacomelli. Yes, he moved to Billingshurst some years ago; I bought a fair bit of stuff from him when I was active. You have rung a bell; Langrex indeed used to be in Streatham, but they moved to Croydon many years ago. Of course Billington Export is in the Billingshurst area and Sussex Surplus used to be down the road at Horsham.

France is OK - no money (comme d'habitude) but picturesque here in La Haute-Savoie, about 30km south of Geneva.


Ah yes, my flat... Did I have half the valve stock in the loo at the time you visited?

And remind me - what does a barretter do?
Regards

Paul

 

[barretter]

Well it's not a Roman Catholic hat or a Mafia pistol! Its major role was as a current-limiter in series-connected heater strings, but it's very useful as a pseudonym that nobody else has heard of.
Yes, I remember getting CV versions of ECC83s and 3A/167Ms from Langrex when they were in Croydon ; very efficient and reasonably willing to accept returns. And there were valves in the loo!
I'm now lving in the foothills of the "Yorkshire Alps" but I doubt it compares with your environment, though the scenery on the "tops" is quite beguiling and the villages are picturesque in parts.
Hope your economic circumstances improve soon.

 

[7N7]

Well it's not a Roman Catholic hat or a Mafia pistol! Its major role was as a current-limiter in series-connected heater strings, but it's very useful as a pseudonym that nobody else has heard of.
Yes, I remember getting CV versions of ECC83s and 3A/167Ms from Langrex when they were in Croydon ; very efficient and reasonably willing to accept returns. And there were valves in the loo!
I'm now lving in the foothills of the "Yorkshire Alps" but I doubt it compares with your environment, though the scenery on the "tops" is quite beguiling and the villages are picturesque in parts.
Hope your economic circumstances improve soon.

3A/167Ms?? Crikey! How much were they in those days?

Paul

 

[barretter]

Not a huge amount but they were second-hand. I do have an unused pair which I got from a chap in Blackpool (does anybody else remember Chevet Supplies?) before the eBay madness set in. As I only have a CT160 tester I can't actually measure the gm of the new ones (they go off the scale) but I had to return some of the Langrex ones as they were well below par.

 

[ErikdeBest]

hi Rjay

Eventually I ended up making a very simple rig. I triode wired the 13E1, grounded the grid and put a 100R resistor in series with the cathode (other end grounded as well). Then I made an 'adjustable' supply with a Variac + insulation transformer + rectification and smoothing.

Regards, Erik

 

[vega65]

13E1 is 119,- GBP at Billington. But as orders over 400 ,- results in 41 % discount, each 13E1 is about 70.

I started to look into 13E1 last autumn. and because ia/ua is hard to find( I told myself it is never rude to ask) I mailled 7N7
asking for his curves.He was glad to share them (I think)
and very patient and willing to answer as several questions came from Norway.
Thank you Paul. Best wishes.
I did choose a different approach and is looking into 13E1 tetrode wired, but with plate to grid feedback .The attached schematic is tentative. Do not blame 7N7 for any faults or stupid choices seen here. But feel free to comment it . I intend to run the amplifier in class a, final values will differ from schematics I guess.As driver I have chosen 12GN7, but intend to have a look at E55L as well.

Doing meassurements on 13E1 is not that easy.In tetrode mode g2 has to be rock steady as small g2 deviations have great influence on ia.I had to up the gridstopper from 3,3 k to 11k to stop oscillations when ia passed 200ma and ua was over 400v. There is also capacitors from g1,g2, and anode to cathode in my testrig.I have not arrived at exact op point for 13E1 yet, but intend to go through some more meassurements in the next weeks.It seems to be a good idea to look at several g2 values.

 

[7N7]

Thanks Vega, for the kind words

I should think that enormous power could be had in beam tetrode mode, but as you have noted, with 13E1's gm you will have to take great care with the g2 supply. I may have mentioned before that a number of the 13E1s I had were a bit gassy and required a bit of a burn-in. best to keep any grid-leaks on the small side - or DC-couple.

I found E55L very attractive with its 10W Pa and enormous gm. In the past I have taken either by accident (mostly) or design, considerable liberties with valves - I have on occasion rather got away with murder - but one cannot do this with E55L. In fact I had one new example that went phut whilst running inside the official limits. The sad truth is that one cannot really swing a lot of volts with an E55L; pity!

Best of luck,

7N7