good day
as a newbie, i am investigating the web for two month,
looking for informations about tubes after listening a wonderful one of my friend's 300B se amp.
i m right now decided to build a amp
with some requirements:
- i want to listen mainly rock, reggae, soul, pop, a bit of classic and a bit of blues
- DHT (my first experience as a tube listener)
- 8 or 9 watt of power (i want also to build more efficients speakers (93-95 dB) than mine
a maximum budget of 1100 euros
- i would like to know your own experience about tube and their technology
my main choice is 300B SE but is it a viable choice (specially for bass)???
and you?
- i red some threads about converting mono psu to power psu, about the power supply, i thought that just doubling the current was enough (and improving the filtering)? i would appreciate every suggestion about that
Thank you
Julien
as a newbie, i am investigating the web for two month,
looking for informations about tubes after listening a wonderful one of my friend's 300B se amp.
i m right now decided to build a amp
with some requirements:
- i want to listen mainly rock, reggae, soul, pop, a bit of classic and a bit of blues
- DHT (my first experience as a tube listener)
- 8 or 9 watt of power (i want also to build more efficients speakers (93-95 dB) than mine
a maximum budget of 1100 euros
- i would like to know your own experience about tube and their technology
my main choice is 300B SE but is it a viable choice (specially for bass)???
and you?
- i red some threads about converting mono psu to power psu, about the power supply, i thought that just doubling the current was enough (and improving the filtering)? i would appreciate every suggestion about that
Thank you
Julien
Hi Julien,
maybe a 300b as first attempt is not an easy thing? (depends on your skills).
Have you listen some other topologies, tubes ? (thinking about bass...)
For me, more efficients speakers are allways better. (especially for little power tube amps)
Sinon, je comprends pas ta dernière question !? pour le prix ca devrait etre faisable, mais, as-tu les outils ?
maybe a 300b as first attempt is not an easy thing? (depends on your skills).
Have you listen some other topologies, tubes ? (thinking about bass...)
For me, more efficients speakers are allways better. (especially for little power tube amps)
Sinon, je comprends pas ta dernière question !? pour le prix ca devrait etre faisable, mais, as-tu les outils ?
PP has better bass. But I say build what you want, including the links posted here. It's the speakers you should bother about.
SET fans tend to be full-range fans. But there's nothing that says you have to use FR with a SET. For the 7-8W 300B you should go 96db or higher. 93db may very well be enough. But I wouldn't settle for less than 96.
SET fans tend to be full-range fans. But there's nothing that says you have to use FR with a SET. For the 7-8W 300B you should go 96db or higher. 93db may very well be enough. But I wouldn't settle for less than 96.
These are similar to my tastes although I sometimes get the urge to torture my neighbors with something like Depeche Mode. I have built dozens of tube amps in the past few years, most of them were single ended. Until recently my favorite rock amp was a push pull amp that used 300B tubes. I set out to design the SimpleSE with the goals of capturing the sound quality of a good 300B amp without the cost, and I wanted wall shaking bass like my push pull amp has.
I found that the bass capabilities of a SE amp depend mostly on the output transformers. To get big bass you need big transformers. I am using Hammond 1628SEA's for a 10 watt amp. You can get similar sized (12 pounds, 5.5 KG) in Europe.
Two people have recommended my SimpleSE amp. I have an obviously biased opinion, but this amp rocks! You are still going to need a pair of big SE output transformers.
Work and family commitments have slowed my progress somewhat (out of town again this weekend) but most of the assembly manual is done, and will be posted to the web site in a few weeks.
It is a reasonably foolproof design to build. I have already built 4 complete amplifiers, and a 5th is in the works. This is all being documented for the manual. I will have PC boards available for this amp in a few weeks. Some die hard DIY builders have already hand wired thier amps.
Put me on the list for 2 boards!
I thought about wiring one up by hand, But one look at the board and I was sold!
Very nice layout, Nice and compact, And parts that can be found easily and will actually fit right not to mention the flexibility in tube and transformer choices!!
Well done Indeed!
Trout
I will put an online ordering page on my web site as soon as the assembly manual is complete. With my current work schedule (10+ hour days) that should be a few weeks.
Trout:
It sounds really cool when fed with my ADA guitar preamp. I am working on a guitar amp that uses this board (both channels in parallel) as well as a few other applications.
I will put everything on the web site when it is done. I have been spending all of my free time finishing the SimpleSE manual (and the TubelabSE manual). When this is done, I want to get away from my computer for a long time. I sit at a computer all day at work, and now most every evening too. All of the fun stuff, like amp building and extreme testing is done. This means that I should have time for all of the cool tube projects that have been on hold for the last 2 months (long list).
I think push-pull is best for rock. I`d suggest a P-P ultralinear KT88 amp with 60+ watts per channel. Then you can `rock` with many different inneficient speakers. Look for a pair of Dynaco Mark -III monoblocs on ebay and get a taste of tube power inexpensively. It will cost you just as much to build a decent SET amp. You can always sell them later when your tastes evolve.
SET are as mentioned above more for the full range single driver crowd. IMO it takes a herculean speaker design to `rock` with 3-6 watts per channel. Physically large and high efficiency near 100dB. Even then you don`t get house shaking bass that a 20 watt or higher P-P will give you.
This from a previous high SPL rocker that now explores the flea power challenge on 3 SET watts per and herculean large, efficient FR speakers (custom built arrays).
If you are determined to get a SET amp first time in, stay away from 300B. Poor value for the money. Newly manufactured offerings of these tubes are often terribly unreliable and are WAY OVERPRICED because they are TRENDY.
SET are as mentioned above more for the full range single driver crowd. IMO it takes a herculean speaker design to `rock` with 3-6 watts per channel. Physically large and high efficiency near 100dB. Even then you don`t get house shaking bass that a 20 watt or higher P-P will give you.
This from a previous high SPL rocker that now explores the flea power challenge on 3 SET watts per and herculean large, efficient FR speakers (custom built arrays).
If you are determined to get a SET amp first time in, stay away from 300B. Poor value for the money. Newly manufactured offerings of these tubes are often terribly unreliable and are WAY OVERPRICED because they are TRENDY.
I hoping to use SE KT77 setup with these boards. I want to put one unit in my music room for computer/studio for playback, And 1 unit in my family room for the entertainment system.
As far as Geetar amps go, I amp very happy with my PP KT77 setup. I have this thing tweaked to give me about any flavor I need.
Right now its biased for 6L6's just for grins. Even those el-cheapo gold pin realistic 6L6's floor eveyone that hears them. I have it in a Tweed 2 X12 Combo Cab packed with 98.8 db100W Jensen Neo's.
The Beast
Trout
Ps
Im dumping the MC240 and building these instead, I just love building things, And that SE board is a huge leap forward IMHO.
As far as Geetar amps go, I amp very happy with my PP KT77 setup. I have this thing tweaked to give me about any flavor I need.
Right now its biased for 6L6's just for grins. Even those el-cheapo gold pin realistic 6L6's floor eveyone that hears them. I have it in a Tweed 2 X12 Combo Cab packed with 98.8 db100W Jensen Neo's.
The Beast
Trout
Ps
Im dumping the MC240 and building these instead, I just love building things, And that SE board is a huge leap forward IMHO.
I'd consider this over SE if you like rock... Class A PP is more likely to get the
bass sounds working "just right". SE DHT requires some careful selection of
transformers and speakers.
Seth PP 2A3
The key part for this amp is the EXO-173 centre-tapped choke. As far as I know, there are no other off-the-shelf equivalents of this specialized part. The spread of
Euro/USDollar might make this purchase quite affordable.
If you get tightening
of budget, you can use Hammond chokes in the PSU and output transformer.
In such a case, a good Hammond PP output transformer for this application will be
$50USD/ea. In Euro's, its probably less than a tank of petrol for you car. Of
course, if budget permits, get the MQ Nickel cored outputs.
-- Jim
bass sounds working "just right". SE DHT requires some careful selection of
transformers and speakers.
Seth PP 2A3
The key part for this amp is the EXO-173 centre-tapped choke. As far as I know, there are no other off-the-shelf equivalents of this specialized part. The spread of
Euro/USDollar might make this purchase quite affordable.
If you get tighteningof budget, you can use Hammond chokes in the PSU and output transformer.
In such a case, a good Hammond PP output transformer for this application will be
$50USD/ea. In Euro's, its probably less than a tank of petrol for you car. Of
course, if budget permits, get the MQ Nickel cored outputs.
-- Jim
IMO the more important question is what kind of speakers you use, then tailor the amp to the speakers.
Klipsch Cornwall is an obvious choice for your tastes IMO. The bass-reflex cabinet gives that slight emphasis/"bloom" that works great for rock and reggae. And the high efficiency means you have a lot of choices w.r.t. amplification.
Klipsch Cornwall is an obvious choice for your tastes IMO. The bass-reflex cabinet gives that slight emphasis/"bloom" that works great for rock and reggae. And the high efficiency means you have a lot of choices w.r.t. amplification.
I totally disagree.rcavictim said:
Somehow "single-ended" and "single-driver" have been conflated, but only the most efficient single-driver design (Lowther in humongous back-loaded horn, for example) is really well-suited for SET. Most other single-driver designs need more oomph to really sing. That is why a lot of people are under the misconception that single-driver systems necessarily lack balls.
On the other hand, efficient multi-way systems work great with SET.
It seems people are misunderstanding my point about SET and FR.
You have people with SET and Lowther-type speakers who insist this is the best of all possible set-ups. And they are right if all you listen to is chamber music. It also rules out 99-pct of all music. My point being that the SET/FR crowd has nothing to say that's of interest to most people.
It's indeed a myth that a SET can't have good bass. But if everything else is equal, a PP amp will have better bass and damping.
Ideally, you should get the speakers you want and then a suitable amp. It's the speakers, not the amp, that will set the limits for your sound system.
You have people with SET and Lowther-type speakers who insist this is the best of all possible set-ups. And they are right if all you listen to is chamber music. It also rules out 99-pct of all music. My point being that the SET/FR crowd has nothing to say that's of interest to most people.
It's indeed a myth that a SET can't have good bass. But if everything else is equal, a PP amp will have better bass and damping.
Ideally, you should get the speakers you want and then a suitable amp. It's the speakers, not the amp, that will set the limits for your sound system.
A well implemented FR driver can rock and roll with the best of them. They do tend to require big cabs, but if you want deep natural bass then big cabs is what you need anyway. 6 watts will shake the roof off my house with some vintage Isophon drivers. They can cope admirably with Techno and grunge. They don't need to be timid or expensive. The whole Lowther thing has queered the pitch for fullrange, which is a real shame.
I would say that very few SETs will deliver the satisying bass that a rocker is looking for. You might spend a lifetime (and your life savings) searching for that magic SET amp - but have you got a lifetime! A well implemented PP amp will give you the bass slam you will want, but with treble a SET would sell their granny for, and a midrange to match the SET. I'am talking CLASS A triode PP, with interstage transformers for perfect phase splitting. Not cheap (but can be) and not to powerful - but the best. Just like the suggested 2A3 SETH amp
Shoog
I would say that very few SETs will deliver the satisying bass that a rocker is looking for. You might spend a lifetime (and your life savings) searching for that magic SET amp - but have you got a lifetime! A well implemented PP amp will give you the bass slam you will want, but with treble a SET would sell their granny for, and a midrange to match the SET. I'am talking CLASS A triode PP, with interstage transformers for perfect phase splitting. Not cheap (but can be) and not to powerful - but the best. Just like the suggested 2A3 SETH amp
Shoog
From classical to heavy metal...
This is what's giving me pleasure. For as little as 1 watt, it can play party level with a slam. Erasure, Glass Tiger, PowerStation, Joy Division, and yes Depeche Mode too I have a small 4m x 4m room, so yes sometimes my neighbors get annoyed when I play Stravinsky and not Rammstein
This is what's giving me pleasure. For as little as 1 watt, it can play party level with a slam. Erasure, Glass Tiger, PowerStation, Joy Division, and yes Depeche Mode too
I have a small 4m x 4m room, so yes sometimes my neighbors get annoyed when I play Stravinsky and not Rammstein Attachments
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.