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Old 19th December 2002, 12:27 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by phase_accurate
... because most horn-driver datasheets recommend 2nd oder or higher (i.e. I didn't even bother to listen to the differences though I have used quite some horn-drivers already)
A Pro driver has recommended crossover settings given based on it's primary application, PA systems. Here it will be subjected to sometimes hundreds of watt's continuously, usually at a lower peak/average ratio than what comes off an LP or CD. In a domestic situation, most would be lucky to see 2W on occaision, and often only tens of milliwatts in practice.

Hors are by nature bandpass devices. Properly specified and used in the correct horn they often don't need <i>ANY</i> crossover. A 6dB is best for most applications domestically, as it provides some out of band reduction, but doesn't add to the already complex phase behaviour some horns exhibit out of band.
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Old 19th December 2002, 01:01 PM   #12
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Again, not being a tech, in my reading I seem to understand just what Brett says, that a horn like this hardly needs a crossover.

Altec crossed them over with a 800 Hz unit which seems to me much lower than I've typically seen with other types of tweeters.

Every time I've reduced the amount of circuitry in my system over the years, I've seen an improvement, so this experiment definitely seemed worthwhile.

The biggest problem, as the website mentioned is the signal loss, but it still plays fairly loud and it sounds fantastic.

If I reduced the value of the resistors to say 5K, would that yield a significant increase in signal level? That would entail changing the value of the capacitor as well. Is one way likely to be better sonically than the other??

And I may be out in left field on this, but could the major benefit of reducing the circuitry be a reduction in phase shifting?

Thanks for the replies and dhaen, no offense taken.

Lee
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Old 19th December 2002, 01:39 PM   #13
Joel is offline Joel  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by RADIOLEE
Every time I've reduced the amount of circuitry in my system over the years, I've seen an improvement
You are on the right track with that idea radiolee. And you will see more improvement if you go further.

a thought: does one hear phase shift?
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Old 19th December 2002, 01:41 PM   #14
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Default SHIFTING GEAR

Hi Joel,

Quote:
a thought: does one hear phase shift?
Do you?

Cheers,
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Old 19th December 2002, 02:04 PM   #15
Philo is offline Philo  United States
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I do... whenever I reverse wire one of my speakers
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"If you didn't make it with your own two hands, its not really yours".
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Old 19th December 2002, 02:05 PM   #16
Joel is offline Joel  United States
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No, I don't - since I don't listen to the CD directly and the output of my amp simultaneously.
Do you, Frank?
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Old 19th December 2002, 02:05 PM   #17
dhaen is offline dhaen  Europe
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Quote:
a thought: does one hear phase shift?
According to the degree....
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Old 19th December 2002, 02:10 PM   #18
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One issue with first order crossover and horns (= large driver = large distances between acoustic centres) might be lobing, with a first order crosover.

OTOH the improvement in transient behaviour may be one reason for Lee's improvement in sound apart from IMD, better amplifier/driver coupling, improved dynamics .....

Regards

Charles
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Old 19th December 2002, 02:14 PM   #19
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Default SHIFTY PHASE

Hi Joel,

Quote:
a thought: does one hear phase shift?
Up to a point,yes I do.

But what kind of phase shifts do you have in mind?

Cheers,
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Old 19th December 2002, 02:21 PM   #20
Joel is offline Joel  United States
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Due to coupling capacitors and active devices.

I think Lee's reaction is a common one, and it's why I have a simple system - less is more, including damping factor...

(waiting for the poop to start raining)
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