El34 PP Vs. El34 PSE - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Amplifiers > Tubes / Valves

Tubes / Valves All about our sweet vacuum tubes :) Threads about Musical Instrument Amps of all kinds should be in the Instruments & Amps forum

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 30th August 2006, 02:09 AM   #1
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Michigan
Default El34 PP Vs. El34 PSE

Hello, I am so hungry to build another power amp. I am trying to decied between an El34 PP triode design, or just a PSET design.

I am having trouble finding PSET designs for just 2 El34s Per Channel.

Will El34s running in PP in triode mode even go beyond Class A?

Would someone please direct me toward a good PSE design that uses 2 tubes per channel? I am dying to try this out.

Or as I am still a newbie, should I build a PP amp first before I try PSE?

I am lost! please help me!

-Moose
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2006, 03:00 AM   #2
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Monroe Township, NJ
Triode, UL, or pentode, how you bias the tube determines the class of operation. Only Class "A" is suitable for HIFI when SE topology is employed. You have options when PP "finals" are used. IMO, "shallow" Class "A" operation has a lot going for it. You squeeze out a little more when peak power O/P is needed, while avoiding cross over problems most of the time.
__________________
Eli D.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2006, 03:06 AM   #3
diyAudio Member
 
tubelab.com's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: South Florida
2 tube PSE, I will tell you what I do. If the power supply in your existing amp is capable of supplying twice the current, you can do this. Wire a second (same brand) EL34 directly in parallel with the existing tube. The best way to do this is to use seperate stopper resistors for each tube. The cathode resistor now needs to be half its original value. The output transformer must now be half its impedance also. This will double the output power, so to take advantage of this power, you need a larger transformrer

Running two tubes in P-P allows the tubes to operate in class A, B, AB1, or AB2. A SE amp must always run in class A
__________________
Too much power is almost enough! Turn it up till it explodes - then back up just a little.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2006, 03:08 AM   #4
diyAudio Moderator Emeritus
 
ray_moth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Jakarta
Exactly as Eli says. From class A in triode PP, you only get 12w output. In class AB1, you can get 16w. I doubt if anyone would be able to tell the difference, in terms of distortion.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2006, 06:38 AM   #5
diyAudio Member
 
Tubes4e4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Leverkusen
Default Re: El34 PP Vs. El34 PSE

Hi Alex,

Quote:
Would someone please direct me toward a good PSE design that uses 2 tubes per channel? I am dying to try this out.
Have a look at the Randall amp pages

Also, this extreme 4*PSET one comes to mind.

Tom
__________________
If in doubt, just measure.
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2006, 07:35 PM   #6
TJ is offline TJ
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: UK
Default Re: El34 PP Vs. El34 PSE

Quote:
Originally posted by alexmoose
Hello, I am so hungry to build another power amp. I am trying to decied between an El34 PP triode design, or just a PSET design.

I am having trouble finding PSET designs for just 2 El34s Per Channel.

Will El34s running in PP in triode mode even go beyond Class A?

Would someone please direct me toward a good PSE design that uses 2 tubes per channel? I am dying to try this out.

Or as I am still a newbie, should I build a PP amp first before I try PSE?

I am lost! please help me!

-Moose

What speaker did u use ? if not more than 90db ... please dont built it !! complete waste of $$$$ !! unless u built for ... hobby
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2006, 08:45 PM   #7
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Michigan
my speakers are 90 db, they get loud enough with one Triode-connected EL34 per channel, so I am just looking to add a little more *umph* in a new amplifier
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2006, 09:54 PM   #8
Klimon is offline Klimon  Belgium
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Leuven
I seriously doubt that, beyond a certain minimum threshold, more watts equal more oomph. My 94db/w backloaded horns sound more powerful when driven by a 1.5watt el84 set when compared to an el34pp, 30watts/channel. You could also try to connect the el34's screen with the Bill Perkins gizmo, this will give a lot more attack to the overall sound + tighter basses. A somewhat weak, smudged sound is inherent not in low-powered amps but a result of the conventional resistor triode-strapping method.

Simon
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2006, 10:36 PM   #9
Tweeker is offline Tweeker  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
More watts means more oomph right out to the limits of the speaker. Its just that the numbers get big in a hurry due to the exponential relationships.

It takes about 10x the power for something to be percieved as twice as loud, depending.
__________________
Be sure your foil hat has a good low impedance ground.
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2006, 10:24 AM   #10
Klimon is offline Klimon  Belgium
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Leuven
Quote:
More watts means more oomph right out to the limits of the speaker. Its just that the numbers get big in a hurry due to the exponential relationships.
I don't agree. I don't think the threadstarter want to play music at louder volumes, I think he wants the music to sound more powerfull (correct me if I'm misunderstanding). At the same spl, one amp can sound more powerful than another. A 30watt amp putting out 1watt will not necessarilly sound more powerfull than a 2watt amp putting out 1watt. This being said, I do think that 3.5 watts (or how much does el34 set yield?) is on the low side to drive a 90db/w speaker, depending on the impedance load.

There's that famous phrase: If the first watt doesn't sound good, etc... Quantity won't solve a quality problem

Simon
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My El34 SET alexmoose Tubes / Valves 10 9th May 2006 08:10 PM
EL34 CCS help navin Tubes / Valves 2 25th March 2006 02:59 AM
4 x PSE EL34 Hojvaelde Tubes / Valves 1 24th March 2006 01:26 PM
6L6 vs EL34 resident Tubes / Valves 20 13th October 2004 06:37 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:55 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2