What's Ra?

leadbelly · 13th January 2006, 05:28 PM

May be a stupid question, but in JB's Aikido calculations:

http://www.tubecad.com/2004/blog0013.htm

Rk=(Ra-rp)/(mu + 1)

what's Ra?

I can't find a definition of Ra in JB's pages or in RDH4, and even more confusing is that TDSL uses Ra synonymously with rp. Argh!

SY · 13th January 2006, 05:30 PM

It's the plate resistor.

leadbelly · 13th January 2006, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SY
It's the plate resistor.

Thanks. I guess that means that equation isn't true for the pentode version of Aikido then? For his 6AU6 schematic, he uses Ra=20K & Rk=150. The datasheet says mu=36 and rp=500K, so the equation doesn't balance (?).

SY · 13th January 2006, 05:47 PM

I haven't given the pentode one a thorough lookover, but the equations for the triode will definitely not be applicable.

jackinnj · 13th January 2006, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by leadbelly
May be a stupid question, but in JB's Aikido calculations:

what's Ra?

I thought Ra was the Sun God !

SY · 13th January 2006, 06:58 PM

Herman Blount.

bst · 3rd May 2006, 04:10 PM

I must be making a basic mistake with this equation, as well.

It occurred to me that a 6AV11 compactron is nothing more than one-and-a-half 12AU7 triode sections in one bottle. Using the three-triode-section circuit shown in Broskie's blog (http://www.tubecad.com/2004/blog0013.htm), I decided to put together a spud aikido preamp.

Plugging in the numbers, I get:

Ra = (17+1) 300+7700 = 144,000

Rk = (144,000-7700)/(17+1) = 7,572

This value is just about half the 15K specified in the schematic.

Where am I going wrong?

Joel · 3rd May 2006, 04:41 PM

Ra=(mu + 1)Rk+rp
15000=(17+1)300+rp
15000=5400+rp
rp=9600

which seems about right, considering that the triode has an unbypassed cathode resistor. It's also running at less plate current than the 10.5mA needed to get down to the 7.7k ohms that you quote.

I don't see a problem with the formula, or results - other than the sloppy use of "Ra" and "rp" in the same argument. All actual resistances use a capitolized R. Impedances use a lower case r, followed by an apostrophe . So, the plate resistance should be written ra', or rp', depending on your preference regarding the terms "plate" or "anode". But one should at least be consistant within the same formula!

Joel

bst · 3rd May 2006, 04:53 PM

Thanks for the clarification!

Note to self: have another cup of coffee and engage left brain before attempting simple 8th-grade math.

Now, to get that spud preamp assembled...

bst · 3rd May 2006, 09:40 PM

After reading the equation correctly { Ra= (mu+1) Rk+rp , NOT Ra= (mu+1)(Rk+rp) }, I came up with 13.1K for the plate resistor, and 300 ohms for the cathode.

A quick-and-dirty lash-up with a 250v power supply sounds pretty darn good! I now need to find another three-section compactron for the output stage, and turn this into a full-fledged amplifier.

Thanks again for getting me back on track.

13th January 2006, 05:28 PM	#1
leadbelly diyAudio Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Calgary, Alberta	What's Ra? May be a stupid question, but in JB's Aikido calculations: http://www.tubecad.com/2004/blog0013.htm Rk=(Ra-rp)/(mu + 1) what's Ra? I can't find a definition of Ra in JB's pages or in RDH4, and even more confusing is that TDSL uses Ra synonymously with rp. Argh! __________________ Aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines. Enzo Ferrari

13th January 2006, 05:30 PM	#2
SY diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX Blog Entries: 1	It's the plate resistor. __________________ “Listening to records is like ****ing a picture of Brigitte Bardot.” - Sergiu Celibidache

13th January 2006, 05:47 PM	#4
SY diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX Blog Entries: 1	I haven't given the pentode one a thorough lookover, but the equations for the triode will definitely not be applicable. __________________ “Listening to records is like ****ing a picture of Brigitte Bardot.” - Sergiu Celibidache

13th January 2006, 06:58 PM	#6
SY diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX Blog Entries: 1	Herman Blount. __________________ “Listening to records is like ****ing a picture of Brigitte Bardot.” - Sergiu Celibidache

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3rd May 2006, 04:41 PM	#8
Joel diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Brooklyn, NY	Ra=(mu + 1)Rk+rp 15000=(17+1)300+rp 15000=5400+rp rp=9600 which seems about right, considering that the triode has an unbypassed cathode resistor. It's also running at less plate current than the 10.5mA needed to get down to the 7.7k ohms that you quote. I don't see a problem with the formula, or results - other than the sloppy use of "Ra" and "rp" in the same argument. All actual resistances use a capitolized R. Impedances use a lower case r, followed by an apostrophe . So, the plate resistance should be written ra', or rp', depending on your preference regarding the terms "plate" or "anode". But one should at least be consistant within the same formula! Joel

3rd May 2006, 04:53 PM	#9
bst diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2005	Thanks for the clarification! Note to self: have another cup of coffee and engage left brain before attempting simple 8th-grade math. Now, to get that spud preamp assembled...

3rd May 2006, 09:40 PM	#10
bst diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2005	After reading the equation correctly { Ra= (mu+1) Rk+rp , NOT Ra= (mu+1)(Rk+rp) }, I came up with 13.1K for the plate resistor, and 300 ohms for the cathode. A quick-and-dirty lash-up with a 250v power supply sounds pretty darn good! I now need to find another three-section compactron for the output stage, and turn this into a full-fledged amplifier. Thanks again for getting me back on track.

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