Re: Re: Beautiful work, Michael!
???
Kindly calm down somewhat there, Cycline 3. I risk a yellow card coming into the scrum from the side (rugby), but why this comment?
There are several reasons for custom-wound iron (I take it you meant wind instead of wide) even when something similar is available on a market somewhere. To begin with, here in RSA most of us custom-wind OPTs despite availability on the global market for the simple reason that customs, cost of transport etc. make them about twice the cost of the imports, however available "out there", apart from a time factor. I am not familiar with the situation in Hawaii; perhaps Tomsyl had a quite legitimate reason for the Electra-Print wound.
At this end your comment came over as somewhat harsh on a "nOOb" (sic); apologies if I somehow misread. We all started somewhere and believe me, quite a few "available" products can be improved upon. Without any knowledge of them (at least at this end), why not give Electra-Print benefit that they perhaps knew what they were doing instead of calling the operation "ridiculous custom wound" per se?
Cycline3 said:
???
Kindly calm down somewhat there, Cycline 3. I risk a yellow card coming into the scrum from the side (rugby), but why this comment?
There are several reasons for custom-wound iron (I take it you meant wind instead of wide) even when something similar is available on a market somewhere. To begin with, here in RSA most of us custom-wind OPTs despite availability on the global market for the simple reason that customs, cost of transport etc. make them about twice the cost of the imports, however available "out there", apart from a time factor. I am not familiar with the situation in Hawaii; perhaps Tomsyl had a quite legitimate reason for the Electra-Print wound.
At this end your comment came over as somewhat harsh on a "nOOb" (sic); apologies if I somehow misread. We all started somewhere and believe me, quite a few "available" products can be improved upon. Without any knowledge of them (at least at this end), why not give Electra-Print benefit that they perhaps knew what they were doing instead of calling the operation "ridiculous custom wound" per se?
Re: Re: Re: Beautiful work, Michael!
The poster didn't even know if the impedance ratio of the iron was correct - and the iron was already made - and you are asking me, what's my problem? Are you kidding me?
1. If you have no options, fine, have one wound.
2. If you do, you're silly to do it.
From another similar thread - and it applies here:
Looking to the past is unhealthy. That's not a hobby ... that's like chasing the Holy Grail of Audio or something. Like one even exists.
Again, every facet of the technology has progressed in the last 50 years except the manufacture of the actual tubes. Electrolytic or/vs polypropylene is a silly reference - as it means nothing in real terms - as BOTH are improved vastly over their old world counterparts. Saying you prefer Poly - doesn't mean OLD amps sound better. Which was what started this to begin with.
There's nothing special about those old amps... there were good ones and bad ones. I've had and have both. Yeah there were some GEMS, but living in the past is just bad form, no matter how you look at it. And you can make a NEW GEM if you do it right. You have to focus on what you have at hand.
Also, most of the questions on here come from people with no or little experience. Pointing them to costly, rare old parts on ebay is not helpful in my opinion. I've seen crappy organ amps that had more rust than most old cars sell for stupid amounts of money. Because everyone says the old stuff is better. Not. Again. NOT.
Everyone has a right to choose what they like or buy for themselves, but when you are dealing with a hobby that is both expensive and potentially dangerous/deadly, I feel that what is in the interest of the community at large comes before your own personal bias.
Recommending to people to custom wind transformers that don't even know what an impedance ratio is... is NOT helpful. Having someone try to replicate some obscure old transformer is NOT helpful.
Pointing to $25 edcors for a beginner is helpful as someone mentioned. That is good. $600 for a stereo 70 on ebay? Not good.
I've been reading this board for awhile now - and the 2 things that stand out the most about that time is: 1. People will regurgitate any myth they've read on the web like it's gospel and even argue with you about it, even though they lack any basic understanding of what's happening to proove it. and 2. People will point others in crazy directions in search of the Audio Grail, because they dreamed of doing it but never did.
Copying a classic amp is one thing. Telling someone to get custom transformers is another. I hope that the rest of the messages focus on helping this person achieve his goals, not point him in search of some lost Indy artifact.
Buy some good, affordable, modern iron and go from there. You will NOT be unhappy with it.
I am extremely passionate about the tube industry and seeing DIY do well. Im sorry if I upset some in that, but I won't hesitate to say BS if I think what you're saying is harmful. I want people to enter the hobby, enjoy it and be happy. Telling them the only way to what they want is to secure a transformer from some old amp they may NEVER IN THEIR LIFE FIND, is not helping anyone!
Think of it like this, just because you can tear down a car engine and rebuild it, would you start making one of your own from scratch? No? Then why make your own transformer? Most people don't even know basic tube theory - much less how to wind iron. And if you do know, you don't need to ask or have someone suggest it... Have I said it enough yet?
Johan Potgieter said:
The poster didn't even know if the impedance ratio of the iron was correct - and the iron was already made - and you are asking me, what's my problem? Are you kidding me?
1. If you have no options, fine, have one wound.
2. If you do, you're silly to do it.
From another similar thread - and it applies here:
Looking to the past is unhealthy. That's not a hobby ... that's like chasing the Holy Grail of Audio or something. Like one even exists.
Again, every facet of the technology has progressed in the last 50 years except the manufacture of the actual tubes. Electrolytic or/vs polypropylene is a silly reference - as it means nothing in real terms - as BOTH are improved vastly over their old world counterparts. Saying you prefer Poly - doesn't mean OLD amps sound better. Which was what started this to begin with.
There's nothing special about those old amps... there were good ones and bad ones. I've had and have both. Yeah there were some GEMS, but living in the past is just bad form, no matter how you look at it. And you can make a NEW GEM if you do it right. You have to focus on what you have at hand.
Also, most of the questions on here come from people with no or little experience. Pointing them to costly, rare old parts on ebay is not helpful in my opinion. I've seen crappy organ amps that had more rust than most old cars sell for stupid amounts of money. Because everyone says the old stuff is better. Not. Again. NOT.
Everyone has a right to choose what they like or buy for themselves, but when you are dealing with a hobby that is both expensive and potentially dangerous/deadly, I feel that what is in the interest of the community at large comes before your own personal bias.
Recommending to people to custom wind transformers that don't even know what an impedance ratio is... is NOT helpful. Having someone try to replicate some obscure old transformer is NOT helpful.
Pointing to $25 edcors for a beginner is helpful as someone mentioned. That is good. $600 for a stereo 70 on ebay? Not good.
I've been reading this board for awhile now - and the 2 things that stand out the most about that time is: 1. People will regurgitate any myth they've read on the web like it's gospel and even argue with you about it, even though they lack any basic understanding of what's happening to proove it. and 2. People will point others in crazy directions in search of the Audio Grail, because they dreamed of doing it but never did.
Copying a classic amp is one thing. Telling someone to get custom transformers is another. I hope that the rest of the messages focus on helping this person achieve his goals, not point him in search of some lost Indy artifact.
Buy some good, affordable, modern iron and go from there. You will NOT be unhappy with it.
I am extremely passionate about the tube industry and seeing DIY do well. Im sorry if I upset some in that, but I won't hesitate to say BS if I think what you're saying is harmful. I want people to enter the hobby, enjoy it and be happy. Telling them the only way to what they want is to secure a transformer from some old amp they may NEVER IN THEIR LIFE FIND, is not helping anyone!
Think of it like this, just because you can tear down a car engine and rebuild it, would you start making one of your own from scratch? No? Then why make your own transformer? Most people don't even know basic tube theory - much less how to wind iron. And if you do know, you don't need to ask or have someone suggest it... Have I said it enough yet?
Re: Beautiful work, Michael!
Sean, OK
You have explained yourself well, and I agree (at least in spirit) with all you have said (see later).
Not to belabour, but I reacted only, to your reaction, to the quotation you gave of Tomsyl.
He mentioned there that he had 6K transformers wound etc. - that did not give me the impression that he knew nothing about impedance ratios.
Your manner of writing nOObs came across (correctly or otherwise) to me as "talking down" to someone who was trying to learn. (Such a manner is to me again something that I feel passionate about, having taught at tertiary level.)
You referred to (the practice of) "ridiculous custom wound transformers". That statement appeared rather generally disparaging, and I tried to outline why such a practice might very well be the best option in certain circumstances (as e.g. for us down here), despite commercial availability.
As for the rest, I particularly agree with you re the following:
Exactly.
In my own way I have also been "A lonely little petunia in an onion patch" (who sang that song years ago?) in my modest contributions to a local audio magazine and elsewhere. And we must not start with the clap-trap enthused over in promotion, thereafter to be perpetuated as if it was gospel. At least I get the impression that we agree on that.
Thanks for your explanation.
Sean, OK
You have explained yourself well, and I agree (at least in spirit) with all you have said (see later).
Not to belabour, but I reacted only, to your reaction, to the quotation you gave of Tomsyl.
He mentioned there that he had 6K transformers wound etc. - that did not give me the impression that he knew nothing about impedance ratios.
Your manner of writing nOObs came across (correctly or otherwise) to me as "talking down" to someone who was trying to learn. (Such a manner is to me again something that I feel passionate about, having taught at tertiary level.)
You referred to (the practice of) "ridiculous custom wound transformers". That statement appeared rather generally disparaging, and I tried to outline why such a practice might very well be the best option in certain circumstances (as e.g. for us down here), despite commercial availability.
As for the rest, I particularly agree with you re the following:
Cycline3 said:
Exactly.
In my own way I have also been "A lonely little petunia in an onion patch" (who sang that song years ago?) in my modest contributions to a local audio magazine and elsewhere. And we must not start with the clap-trap enthused over in promotion, thereafter to be perpetuated as if it was gospel. At least I get the impression that we agree on that.
Thanks for your explanation.
3-500Z's in push pull AB2
Rectifiers removed to allow the tubes to be seen. These run at 3000V.
It is a modulator for an AM transmitter, pls. don't be prejudiced by that, because the goal is to achieve 700 watts RMS from 50Hz to 15KHZ with no more than 1% THD+N. The output (modulation) transformer weighs about 120 LBs.
Alot of people (ham radio operators especially) call 3-500Z's running zero bias "class B" but 100mA of quiescent current per tube at 3KV is hardly class B.
Rectifiers removed to allow the tubes to be seen. These run at 3000V.
It is a modulator for an AM transmitter, pls. don't be prejudiced by that, because the goal is to achieve 700 watts RMS from 50Hz to 15KHZ with no more than 1% THD+N. The output (modulation) transformer weighs about 120 LBs.
Alot of people (ham radio operators especially) call 3-500Z's running zero bias "class B" but 100mA of quiescent current per tube at 3KV is hardly class B.
Attachments
Sorry, just can't stand Hammerfall 
The amp itself is nice,,,
here you can find some clips off of my latest build [Bogner XTC Replica], see posts #31 and #32
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=1535411#post1535411
The amp itself is nice,,,
here you can find some clips off of my latest build [Bogner XTC Replica], see posts #31 and #32
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=1535411#post1535411
The Latest from Rodango Labs
Here's my latest amp! It's my custom 225W all tube Bass Guitar Head! And does it ever bring the house down! Literally! It uses a 6SN7 preamp, a 6L6 phase inversion transformer driver and KT88 outputs. I have KT90s in there now.
Designed and built by yours truly! I'm having a case custom made for it too. I'll post a photo of the completed unit in a few days...
Here's my latest amp! It's my custom 225W all tube Bass Guitar Head! And does it ever bring the house down! Literally! It uses a 6SN7 preamp, a 6L6 phase inversion transformer driver and KT88 outputs. I have KT90s in there now.
Designed and built by yours truly! I'm having a case custom made for it too. I'll post a photo of the completed unit in a few days...
basstard said:Jeez! 225w all tube! Not bad at all I'd say!
[but still I need way MUCH MORE POWER for my bass
How comes so few controls on the front? what's that, gain and volume? no eq at all?
Do you have some clips out of it?
VERY nice!
Yes, just gain and volume. And for now the gain is disconnected until I figure out the best way to do it. The way I had it introduced way too much hum into the circuit so for now it's disconnected while I figure it out.
Coupled with my 1x18 EV cab, it's about ready for anything!
