http://www.record-producer.com/learn.cfm?a=2838
see for yourself how they do it in the
Behringer MIC 2200 Ultragain Pro microphone preamp.
Now i wonder what other things they are up to?
see for yourself how they do it in the
Behringer MIC 2200 Ultragain Pro microphone preamp.
Now i wonder what other things they are up to?
It should be established whether the tube actually is connected.
If it isn't that would be downright fraud in my book. But it probably is in, since it is there it doesn't cost anything to use it. Where are those golden ears, can't they HEAR if it is in??
If the tube is in, what is the problem? We have LEDs shining on the innards of CD players, nice LEDs inside amps? It's those golden ears that say that tubes make the sound 'warm' - transferring the temp of a component to the sound of music which is nonsense anyway. Are we now saying that the more tubes glow the warmer the sound gets???
This is just plain marketing as is usual in audio. Same as nice cherry-wood knobs, pink cable jackets (remember the Pink Mamba?) etc.
Jan Didden
If it isn't that would be downright fraud in my book. But it probably is in, since it is there it doesn't cost anything to use it. Where are those golden ears, can't they HEAR if it is in??
If the tube is in, what is the problem? We have LEDs shining on the innards of CD players, nice LEDs inside amps? It's those golden ears that say that tubes make the sound 'warm' - transferring the temp of a component to the sound of music which is nonsense anyway. Are we now saying that the more tubes glow the warmer the sound gets???
This is just plain marketing as is usual in audio. Same as nice cherry-wood knobs, pink cable jackets (remember the Pink Mamba?) etc.
Jan Didden
I think the key words were when the reviewer said, "My feeling is however that probably the tube is connected..." Now I know that in recording circles, the term "engineer" is mis-used, but trying to complain about technicalities when you're not even capable of tracing a circuit on a PCB... So what if it has some LEDs to make it prettier? Studer did exactly the same thing on one of their pro ADCs about ten years ago.
The tube heater runs off the +17VDC rail with a series 39 ohm resistor, resulting in a bit over 11VDC across the series wired heaters in the tube. It is heated. The plates are running on only 48 volts, but the tube is definitely in the signal path as a cathode follower. Pull the tube, no signal will pass.
Any claims that the tube is not wired in or powered up are false and born of someone making assumptions based upon their preconceived notions without bothering to find out what was what.
They added the LEDs to make it look more appealing, so what? No different than backlighting your logo on the panel.
It is unfortunate that reviewers publish such things in their magazines rather than simply trying it out and reporting on its performance.
Any claims that the tube is not wired in or powered up are false and born of someone making assumptions based upon their preconceived notions without bothering to find out what was what.
They added the LEDs to make it look more appealing, so what? No different than backlighting your logo on the panel.
It is unfortunate that reviewers publish such things in their magazines rather than simply trying it out and reporting on its performance.
SY said:
I see this as another example of the trend of dumming down the consumer/population with incorrect information that leads to where we are today. We live amongst a mass of poorly educated people (by design) who have been programmed to solve any problem or need by peeling open their wallets and who don't know how to wipe their own mule. A lot of folks learn what they know about technology from what they read on the labels and panels of their consumer electronics and other devices, at least those who can read do, so yeah, I do see this as an issue.
I'm not about to lose any sleep over it though.
Are you using all those LEDs for bias dividers with the 'show glow' as a secondary function?
I have some of the Behringer 1950 series tube gear, the tubes peak through a little window and are obviously illuminated because no heater is that bright or that yellow! I think the gentlemen in question had never seen a real tube in operation.
I agree, a simple removal of the tube would have been sufficient to verify if it was in circuit or not, I guess they never thought of that. Since he bought 2 channels of mic preamp for under $100 I really can't see much to complain about. Started a huge flame war on their forum though. Regretably the "pro" arena is a full of mumbo-jumbo as the high end hifi stuff.
Manley, Summit & Tubetech will happlily sell him tube pre's with no visible workings to offend although $100 would be more like the monthly payment!
I agree, a simple removal of the tube would have been sufficient to verify if it was in circuit or not, I guess they never thought of that. Since he bought 2 channels of mic preamp for under $100 I really can't see much to complain about. Started a huge flame war on their forum though. Regretably the "pro" arena is a full of mumbo-jumbo as the high end hifi stuff.
Manley, Summit & Tubetech will happlily sell him tube pre's with no visible workings to offend although $100 would be more like the monthly payment!
rcavictim said:
The valve could be acting as an input or output buffer with the high gain stage being provided by some semiconductors elsewhere; a very common idea.
I've seen numerous such designs for the Gainclone amps the guys on the solid state forum are busy with. The solid state, valve hybrid Gainclones usually use the standard solid state high gain stage and a unity gain valve buffer on their input to 'warm up' the signal.
Click me!
Which is interesting, since the majority of people would agree that the most striking differences between the two occurs during distortion, that it's self occurs most inherently in high gain stages. But when you really need to see something glowing...
A lot of studio gear, guitar amps and guitar effects use the idea since there's always been a problem with long stretches of cable or effects pedals needing large amounts of drive current. In these, they'll use a semiconductor to do the gain work and then, since they need a buffer stage anyway, use a valve to drive the input / output and add warmth to the sound simultaneously.
It's quite likely they've done the same with this. In fact, I'd bet on that being what's happening.
There's been a surge in the idea's utilisation within guitar and studio amps, effects and processors. The idea of using a 'valve reactor' to quote Vox, to give the versatility of solid state with the warmth of valves. They also make use of the idea of making the single valve visible from the front. There's at least one PC sound card using a valve to give it 'that sound' as I am aware of things.
To the point of the review, I fully agree with the others. This guy should have at least tried removing the valves or just covering the LED's over and looking at the valve in the dark to see if it was glowing on it's own. The valve might not have been glowing enough to be impressive but it should still have been enough to be visible.
I believe such a severe review should really warrant a public apology if what I've suggested is the reality.
eeka chu said:
That's exactly what they are doing, on the higher series units the amount of tube "color" is adjustable on the front panel and added into the final stage of a conventional IC based equalizer, compressor or gain stage.
It's not really tube equipment as we would see it but an interesting approach none the less.
Modified CD player with tube cathode follower output buffer
Sounds like they did what I did in an old Magnavox CD player above?
Sounds like they did what I did in an old Magnavox CD player above?
Geek said:
Hi Rob,
Unfortunately they do not specify voltage or current. Somebody must have informed marketing that a cathode follower has current gain
Marketing folk and lawyers are much of a muchness. They will argue that a CF has a gain of less than 1 and negative though it may be, it is still gain.
I must admit, I'm baffled by the reviewer. I saw one of these things a good while back, and as soon as I turned it on the fact that the tube was lit by LEDs was obvious. You can physically see them glowing behind the tube!
How someone paid to check kit out for publication failed to notice this is beyond me, and gives me even less respect for the publishing trade in general.
How someone paid to check kit out for publication failed to notice this is beyond me, and gives me even less respect for the publishing trade in general.
These things are actually kind of cool when used in a not quite intended way. They make nice two channel bass preamps that sound pretty nice. You run channel one and two in series and then use the 'bypass' switch to switch out channel two. Pretty cool when they cost about $100. Their 1950 tube compressor is also kind of interesting in that they have another name for a compressor which now escapes me. Twenty years ago these would have been the greatest audio bargains of all time but now we snicker and make fun of them. The one I played with sounded quite OK as a microphone preamp. What I found most odd was that the sytle they're trying to copy is so obscure that I can't imagine any potential buyers would remember it.
John...........
John...........
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