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Old 20th June 2004, 11:27 PM   #1
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Default Ecc89 / Ecc189

Hey guys,

Would an ECC89 / ECC189 be able to go as low as an ECC88? (I mean the voltage).

PS: Mr. Hugh from AKSA has a preamp kit, which utilises an ECC189.
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Old 20th June 2004, 11:43 PM   #2
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Hi,

Quote:
Would an ECC89 / ECC189 be able to go as low as an ECC88? (I mean the voltage).
First of all ECC89 and ECC189 are not one and the same type.

Secondly, neither one is suitable for audio at least not domestic applications.

These are variable mu tubes used for automatic gain control (AGC), studio gear uses them sometimes in compressor/expander circuits.

Quote:
PS: Mr. Hugh from AKSA has a preamp kit, which utilises an ECC189.
He does?

Cheers,
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Old 21st June 2004, 03:29 AM   #3
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Quote:
First of all ECC89 and ECC189 are not one and the same type.
I've seen thousands of sites saying that the tubes are the same.

Quote:
He does?
Yes and actually, there are two types.
check it out:

http://www.printedelectronics.com/pr...ducts_GK1.html

http://www.printedelectronics.com/pr...ducts_tlp.html

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Old 21st June 2004, 03:31 AM   #4
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Anyway, back to the topic,

Can it go as low as an ECC88?
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Old 21st June 2004, 08:13 AM   #5
Jax is offline Jax  Sweden
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Quote:
Originally posted by jamesjung21
I've seen thousands of sites saying that the tubes are the same.
Very odd since they are not even pin compatible. ECC89 is more like ECC84 than anything else.
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Old 21st June 2004, 12:34 PM   #6
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Hi,

[QUOTE]Anyway, back to the topic, Can it go as low as an ECC88?QUOTE]

Since the ECC189 is basically a ECC88 with variable mu (all that's been changed vis a vis the ECC88 is the grid), yes it can.

As for its use by Hugh Dean in the AKS range, I understand from reading the links you provide the ECC189 is being used as a cathode follower.
In that case the variable mu feature won't have any impact on the performance.

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Old 21st June 2004, 02:35 PM   #7
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Guys,

IIRC, only 1 section of the 6ES8/ECC189 is variable mu and the other is "identical" to those found in the 6DJ8/ECC88.
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Old 21st June 2004, 03:16 PM   #8
Jax is offline Jax  Sweden
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Are you sure, Eli? I have seen applications using ECC189 in balanced RF amplifiers with AGC.
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Old 21st June 2004, 04:15 PM   #9
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Quote:
Are you sure, Eli?
No, I'm not certain; that's why I said "IIRC". I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong again.

What I recall makes sense. The 6DJ8 and its relations were designed to be used as cascode VHF front ends. Having a fixed mu section "upstairs" and a variable mu section "downstairs" for AGC would work WELL.
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Old 21st June 2004, 11:24 PM   #10
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Hi,

Quote:
Having a fixed mu section "upstairs" and a variable mu section "downstairs" for AGC would work WELL.
Indeed it would but in the case of the ECC189/6ES8 they didn't pay any attention to that aspect other than recommending section 1 as the input (a-g-k) for the cascode.
Looking at the internal wiring diagram and at minor interelectrode capacitances shows why.

Other dual triodes designed for cascode use sometimes have slightly differing sections but nothing of the kind that would have any impact on a CF design anyway.

One of the finest developments of cascode triodes was the ECC200 (no idea if it has an American equivalent) which even had neutrodynizing shields. Truely impressive for such a small tube.

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