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Old 8th June 2004, 10:15 PM   #11
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Originally posted by jlsem
Silver doesn't oxidize at room temperature; the tarnish you are seeing is a silver-sulphur compound that is nearly as conductive as silver and has little if any effect on the signal.
John, would you then recommend, from the vantage point of sonic purity, using uncoated silver wire, say, for speaker cables etc (assuming one tapes apart or otherwise reliably separates the cables)?

Tom
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Old 8th June 2004, 10:26 PM   #12
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Hi,

You could also try cotton sleeving as an insulator which has even better properties than PTFE (even extruded) from a DA pov and has good mechanical damping to boot.

Regarding silver: I have bare silver wire lying around at the office for about 10 years, unprotected from airborne contaminants.
It hardly shows any sign of tarnishing at all.

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Old 8th June 2004, 10:45 PM   #13
jlsem is offline jlsem  United States
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John, would you then recommend, from the vantage point of sonic purity, using uncoated silver wire, say, for speaker cables etc (assuming one tapes apart or otherwise reliably separates the cables)?
I think that using a coated wire would give you a little more flexibility in trying different configurations. I like braided ofc similar to Kimber myself - easy, elegant and effective.

Braided cotton or silk (like Frank suggests) over coated silver wire is a good way of making up your own interconnects.

John
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Old 9th June 2004, 12:15 AM   #14
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Thanks, Frank and John.

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Old 9th June 2004, 12:18 AM   #15
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ISTR the minute amounts (<100ppm) of oxygen in the common brew of copper (wire, water pipes, etc.) is there to improve both electrical and mechanical characteristics. *IMPROVE*.

This reminds me, I should go grab some of that stainless lockwire and make some cables and stuff. (some 10 times more resistive than copper!) Bet it'll make my speakers really sing.

Tim
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Old 9th June 2004, 12:29 AM   #16
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Hi,

Quote:
ISTR the minute amounts (<100ppm) of oxygen in the common brew of copper (wire, water pipes, etc.) is there to improve both electrical and mechanical characteristics. *IMPROVE*.
As said...*MECHANICAL* improvements, but not sonic improvements.

Quote:
This reminds me, I should go grab some of that stainless lockwire and make some cables and stuff.
Could also make yourself a nice swing with it...

In the meantime I'll go cleaning the waterpipes....

Cheers,
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Old 9th June 2004, 12:39 AM   #17
jlsem is offline jlsem  United States
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...improve electrical characteristics. *IMPROVE*.
I'd like to see this.

John
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Old 9th June 2004, 01:22 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by fdegrove
You could also try cotton sleeving as an insulator which has even better properties than PTFE (even extruded) from a DA pov...
That's still open to question.

The figure for cotton seems to come from the same big-*** list of dielectric constants that's floating around on dozens of websites out there.

I don't think the 1.3-1.4 figure holds except in its fluffy, cotton ball form and that in the textile form where the fibers are more closely packed, the figure would be higher.

The figures I've seen from textile industry sources put it in the 3+ range. This seems to make sense given that cotton is pretty much pure cellulose and in the same table the dielectric constant for cellulose is specified at 3.2-7.5.

Seems the only way for cotton to achieve 1.3-1.4 is if there's a hell of a lot more air than cotton fibers as would be the case in its cotton ball form.

Of course even if cotton's dielectric constant were significantly higher than 1.3-1.4 that doesn't necessarily mean it will sound bad, except perhaps to those so singularly obsessed with technical specs.

se
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Old 9th June 2004, 01:32 AM   #19
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Can't resist.... are you going to "burn" the cables in first before a serious listening session?
I find a decent fine copper strand "zip cord" type works as good as any. No reason for anything over 16GA unless you are pounding over 100W through them. Generally that type of wire is very flexible & easy to work with.
Everything else is audio jewlery.
-Chris
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Old 9th June 2004, 01:32 AM   #20
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Hi,

Quote:
The figure for cotton seems to come from the same big-*** list of dielectric constants that's floating around on dozens of websites out there.
Hmmm...It was looking way too good to be true anyway.

Quote:
This seems to make sense given that cotton is pretty much pure cellulose and in the same table the dielectric constant for cellulose is specified at 3.2-7.5.
Makes sense to me.

Quote:
Of course even if cotton's dielectric constant were significantly higher than 1.3-1.4 that doesn't necessarily mean it will sound bad, except perhaps to those so singularly obsessed with technical specs.
Occasionally I did find sticking cottonballs in my ears improved the sound markedly...

Thx for the update,
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