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Old 3rd June 2013, 05:16 PM   #781
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Thanks Ale to share your work
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Old 3rd June 2013, 09:35 PM   #782
Abszero is offline Abszero  United States
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Ale,
I totally agree with your approach. As per my latest experience with the push pull quad 4P1L, I would go for a PP 4P1L. You can easily get 3-4W class A1 from a PP 4P1L at very low THD. My amp sounds amazingly clear, detailed and warm. Can be checked out at simpl epleasuretubeamp.com.
Best,
Radu
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Old 19th July 2013, 04:21 PM   #783
regal is offline regal  United States
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I agree that a p-p 4p1l is a great solution to the difficult to drive modern orthos, I have no issue expanding this thread to include sharing schematics, gain structure, and power output with such a design. Could prove a very nice option for HE-6 owners.

When it coms to p-p I personally prefer a hybrid with a p-p mosfet output since they are inexpensive and off the shelf (i.e. Lyr.) But never heard a real DHT p-p amp. Its just that going to all the trouble to DIY I want the SET sound.

I received a pair of finemt (sp.?) custom SE 5k:8+8+8+8 75mA Tribute transformers. I lucked into a pair of RCA 2A3's for cheap and got a decent deal on NOS guang 2A3's. First stage will be a simple E182CC with a gain of 24, just can't find a DHT with enough gain for the first stage of this 2-stage amp. Haven't decided between a Madia or a SSHV regulator or spec'd the power transformer. I have coleman regs ready, but haven't even started the complicated prefiltering.

I did hook up the tribute transformers to my 417A Spud amp, was able to turn up the bias and deliver considerably more power than the old smaller electraprints. The sound of the Tribute's are amazing, truly an opt designed for headphones with the special low loss core and low DCR's. Can't wait to hear them with the 2A3's, a commercial amp of this sort would cost a few thousand more, a rare case where DIY pays for itself if you have the time.
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Old 19th July 2013, 04:42 PM   #784
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It would be nice if you gave some more information about the dcr for primair and secondair windings. Did you also measured the frequency response?
8Ohm windings 4x? Who impedance ratio you need?

Quote:
Originally Posted by regal View Post
I agree that a p-p 4p1l is a great solution to the difficult to drive modern orthos, I have no issue expanding this thread to include sharing schematics, gain structure, and power output with such a design. Could prove a very nice option for HE-6 owners.

When it coms to p-p I personally prefer a hybrid with a p-p mosfet output since they are inexpensive and off the shelf (i.e. Lyr.) But never heard a real DHT p-p amp. Its just that going to all the trouble to DIY I want the SET sound.

I received a pair of finemt (sp.?) custom SE 5k:8+8+8+8 75mA Tribute transformers. I lucked into a pair of RCA 2A3's for cheap and got a decent deal on NOS guang 2A3's. First stage will be a simple E182CC with a gain of 24, just can't find a DHT with enough gain for the first stage of this 2-stage amp. Haven't decided between a Madia or a SSHV regulator or spec'd the power transformer. I have coleman regs ready, but haven't even started the complicated prefiltering.

I did hook up the tribute transformers to my 417A Spud amp, was able to turn up the bias and deliver considerably more power than the old smaller electraprints. The sound of the Tribute's are amazing, truly an opt designed for headphones with the special low loss core and low DCR's. Can't wait to hear them with the 2A3's, a commercial amp of this sort would cost a few thousand more, a rare case where DIY pays for itself if you have the time.
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Old 19th July 2013, 04:57 PM   #785
regal is offline regal  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esltransformer View Post
It would be nice if you gave some more information about the dcr for primair and secondair windings. Did you also measured the frequency response?
8Ohm windings 4x? Who impedance ratio you need?
impedence ratio with headphones is completely different than speakers so keep that in mind.

8+8+8+8 give 5k:8, 5k:32, 5k:64 and 5k:128 which pretty much covers any headphone. The 5k:128 is basically the well received Woo5 AKG 1k1 output which also reportedly works well with a 30B and HE-6's since they have a flat impedance curve. The 5k:64 is perfect for sennheisers, beyers and other high efficient headphones. Then the 5k:32 for the Grados and Denons that need a large stepdown to not pickup slightest noises. I researched this for months and this is an ideal configuration for headphones.

I will take some DCR measurements when I get a chance.
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Old 19th July 2013, 06:02 PM   #786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by regal View Post
impedence ratio with headphones is completely different than speakers so keep that in mind.

8+8+8+8 give 5k:8, 5k:32, 5k:64 and 5k:128 which pretty much covers any headphone. The 5k:128 is basically the well received Woo5 AKG 1k1 output which also reportedly works well with a 30B and HE-6's since they have a flat impedance curve. The 5k:64 is perfect for sennheisers, beyers and other high efficient headphones. Then the 5k:32 for the Grados and Denons that need a large stepdown to not pickup slightest noises. I researched this for months and this is an ideal configuration for headphones.

I will take some DCR measurements when I get a chance.
Thanks for the info.

Can you share the cost of the Tribute tranny's.

I have started working on my version of a DHT headphone amp.
Basing it on a Tubelab SE amp, but using Coleman regs for the DHT heaters.

Need to figure out where to get my output tranny's from.

And how much do they weigh?

I am starting to worry my amp will weigh a ton if I put it in one box.
For the Coleman regs, you need two of everything, starting with the power transformers. I want to use LC filters for the HV and coleman regs, but that's a lot of iron and weight.

Thanks
Randy
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Old 19th July 2013, 11:59 PM   #787
jpak is offline jpak  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by regal View Post
I agree that a p-p 4p1l is a great solution to the difficult to drive modern orthos, I have no issue expanding this thread to include sharing schematics, gain structure, and power output with such a design. Could prove a very nice option for HE-6 owners.

When it coms to p-p I personally prefer a hybrid with a p-p mosfet output since they are inexpensive and off the shelf (i.e. Lyr.) But never heard a real DHT p-p amp. Its just that going to all the trouble to DIY I want the SET sound.

I received a pair of finemt (sp.?) custom SE 5k:8+8+8+8 75mA Tribute transformers. I lucked into a pair of RCA 2A3's for cheap and got a decent deal on NOS guang 2A3's. First stage will be a simple E182CC with a gain of 24, just can't find a DHT with enough gain for the first stage of this 2-stage amp. Haven't decided between a Madia or a SSHV regulator or spec'd the power transformer. I have coleman regs ready, but haven't even started the complicated prefiltering.

I did hook up the tribute transformers to my 417A Spud amp, was able to turn up the bias and deliver considerably more power than the old smaller electraprints. The sound of the Tribute's are amazing, truly an opt designed for headphones with the special low loss core and low DCR's. Can't wait to hear them with the 2A3's, a commercial amp of this sort would cost a few thousand more, a rare case where DIY pays for itself if you have the time.
Are these Tributes potted, if not could you say roughly how big they are?
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Old 20th July 2013, 07:21 AM   #788
45 is offline 45  Italy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by regal View Post

When it coms to p-p I personally prefer a hybrid with a p-p mosfet output since they are inexpensive and off the shelf (i.e. Lyr.) But never heard a real DHT p-p amp. Its just that going to all the trouble to DIY I want the SET sound.
SE is not better by default. It's a myth! It always depends on so many things......
In practice almost every time PP is better...
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Old 20th July 2013, 08:16 AM   #789
regal is offline regal  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 45 View Post
SE is not better by default. It's a myth! It always depends on so many things......
In practice almost every time PP is better...
I understand what you are saying but if we are letting numbers make our decisions a hybrid with a P-P mosfet output is just very effective for headphones if you want p-p. And one can say the some thing that Mosfet P-P is better than tube P-P "almost every time" (going off numbers/measurements.)

There is something special about SET sound, I don't claim to know what it is but I like it. Since I already have a 5W hybrid P-P headphone amp that I paid $300 bucks for it makes little sense for me to invest time and $'s trying to beat it with all tubes. Now a 300B or 2A3 SET headphone amp costs $3k to $5k. Plenty incentive to DIY if I want that sound.

BTW, The DCR of the Tribute secondary is only 1 ohm, vs the Electraprint which was 12 ohms. That's a significant gain in power transfer with 32 ohm headphones.
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Old 20th July 2013, 09:10 AM   #790
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Did you also measured the primairy dcr? With dcr pr+sec and the windingratio (=25) its possible to calculate the copper losses. And with frequency response we can compare it with other transformers. (Ok, not all can be compared because the core is very special in your case)

Btw, 1 Ohm isn't high or low if you don't know what the total copper loss is. You have to calculate this to know if the power transfer is low or high.

Quote:
Originally Posted by regal View Post
I understand what you are saying but if we are letting numbers make our decisions a hybrid with a P-P mosfet output is just very effective for headphones if you want p-p. And one can say the some thing that Mosfet P-P is better than tube P-P "almost every time" (going off numbers/measurements.)

There is something special about SET sound, I don't claim to know what it is but I like it. Since I already have a 5W hybrid P-P headphone amp that I paid $300 bucks for it makes little sense for me to invest time and $'s trying to beat it with all tubes. Now a 300B or 2A3 SET headphone amp costs $3k to $5k. Plenty incentive to DIY if I want that sound.

BTW, The DCR of the Tribute secondary is only 1 ohm, vs the Electraprint which was 12 ohms. That's a significant gain in power transfer with 32 ohm headphones.

Last edited by esltransformer; 20th July 2013 at 09:13 AM.
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