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Old 26th January 2013, 11:01 PM   #61
morinix is offline morinix  United States
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Originally Posted by M Gregg View Post
Its a culture "Lean"

Tied up with things like value added and non value added work..ie if you carry a part from one machine to another its non value added..if you drill a hole as part of the job it Adds value to the component..even down to how far you have to move your hand to drill the hole, if the down movement of the drill is traveling in the air for most of the stroke its non value added time. Only the cut time is value added...how long it takes to clamp the part or position the part..
How long it takes to etch a board is value added, however if the process is done faster at another company any time beyond that interval is non value added..(the company is wasting time with an outdated process).

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M. Gregg
Another company that starts with an "h" that I worked at used a bloated SAP program to track such nuances. It was a big international operation. The polar opposite of Hovland. Another story, maybe later.
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Old 27th January 2013, 12:41 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by DF96 View Post
Opening one's mind can be like opening a window: all sorts of noise and dirt floats in.
Or fresh air depending on the quality of the mind .
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Old 27th January 2013, 12:53 AM   #63
AVWERK is offline AVWERK  United States
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Originally Posted by Lynn Olson View Post
I love these stories! Keep them coming!

I paid my dues at Audionics back in the Seventies, but the industry was a little different back then. Once the cable-meisters came in, and prices skyrocketed ten to twenty-fold during the Eighties, the industry changed.
This is when dealers were telling folks if you don,t use these expensive cables then you won,t hear what your buying!

This was the beginning of the end of high end stores across the country IMHO

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David
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Old 27th January 2013, 01:11 PM   #64
Minx is offline Minx  United Kingdom
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As a total newbie and therefore not able to appreciate the full technical significance of the mythical techniques employed, i really enjoyed the story, laughing out loud.

I became interested in hi fi in the 70s and remember all the bullsh*t about types of wire, gold plated this and that (when everything else wasn't gold plated). When i used to ask the salesman why i should pay 100 for one interconnect and would i really be able to detect the difference in quality between the expensive one and the one that came with the equipment,he would resort to the dowsing type arguments and be scornful of my even asking such ridiculous questions.

I rather think some of the mystique surrounding electronic components is analogous to art collectors; they almost require to be fed bollocks to justify the crazy prices they pay and keep the market going.

In my opinionated world, there is no alternative to scientific method; empirically test, subject your tests to peer review, keep an open mind and treat the mumbo jumbo with the scepticism it deserves.

In the meantime, i keep learning from all of you who post your findings, enter into good debate and keep entertaining us.

Thanks
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Old 27th January 2013, 03:19 PM   #65
bcarso is offline bcarso  United States
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Originally Posted by morinix View Post
That is Fifty ONE to you sir The way I see it is, if I was old enough to be aware of what was happening when Nixon looked into the camera and said "I am not a crook", Then I can be classified as old.

Besides, that stern, belittling "young man", staring down the bridge of the nose whilst lifting up the reading glasses; Gee whiz! Save it for the dudes with the underwear hanging out of their pants.
And to feel still older, remember that you are "in your fifty-second year" now. But worse still, in your sixth decade!
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Old 27th January 2013, 03:26 PM   #66
bcarso is offline bcarso  United States
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Originally Posted by morinix View Post
Sidney Harman did the old make the coin disappear and pull it out of my daughters ear once.
Your daughter was fortunate. Sid was skilled at making other peoples' coins disappear, period.

Sorry, couldn't resist the temptation to join the badmouth-former-employers club. Please take my remark in the spirit of jesting. After all, compared to the latest CEO, Harman was a paragon of wisdom and staunch defender of audio quality. And he did make money for the stockholders: shortly after I joined one of the Harman International companies in 1990, the stock hit an all-time low of about four dollars. When I left, by then a consultant, at the end of 2004, after a few splits it was hovering around 130.

Shortly thereafter it collapsed, but don't blame me. Really.
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Old 27th January 2013, 06:40 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by morinix View Post
You are making Hovland out to be like the Magic Castle in order to bolster your dislike of my forthright composition.

Au contraire! Let me make this as clear and concise as possible: The dowsing was an integral part of the daily assembly process of the HP-100. It was not done as some distracting medicine show.
Sorry if I was rude. Didn't really mean to be. I loved your story. Back in the 1980's when I worked at Dolby Labs in SF I was the early bird young wippersnapper smartass, probably annoying to some, so I'm aiming my ridicule at myself as well. I guess I was a bit obsessed with trying to prove to myself that I was good, after my Engineer boss at Tektronix went gay on me, making me want to leave, and wondering if he just wanted to get rid of me... I wouldn't be surprised to find that we all have humorous stories to tell. Too much science might leave the mind a bit unbalanced.
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Old 27th January 2013, 09:04 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by Bob Richards View Post
Sorry if I was rude. Didn't really mean to be. I loved your story. Back in the 1980's when I worked at Dolby Labs in SF I was the early bird young wippersnapper smartass, probably annoying to some, so I'm aiming my ridicule at myself as well. I guess I was a bit obsessed with trying to prove to myself that I was good, after my Engineer boss at Tektronix went gay on me, making me want to leave, and wondering if he just wanted to get rid of me... I wouldn't be surprised to find that we all have humorous stories to tell. Too much science might leave the mind a bit unbalanced.
No it more a vitamin d shortage from a lack of sun light . Audiophiles are unbalanced science is good job.
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Old 30th January 2013, 11:32 PM   #69
morinix is offline morinix  United States
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Originally Posted by Bob Richards View Post
Sorry if I was rude. Didn't really mean to be. I loved your story. Back in the 1980's when I worked at Dolby Labs in SF I was the early bird young wippersnapper smartass, probably annoying to some, so I'm aiming my ridicule at myself as well. I guess I was a bit obsessed with trying to prove to myself that I was good, after my Engineer boss at Tektronix went gay on me, making me want to leave, and wondering if he just wanted to get rid of me... I wouldn't be surprised to find that we all have humorous stories to tell. Too much science might leave the mind a bit unbalanced.
Rude! Isn't that what 1/3rd of the internet is for? Oh, sorry about your Tektronix boss. I got most of my "early bird, young wippersnapper, smartass"-ness out of my system at the first half of my Alesis career. All who worked with me at that time can attest to this.

Science can do weird things to the mind after awhile as many of the real scientists that I have come across can demonstrate. And remember, Issac Newton is one of the most extreme examples of logic turned crazy. Yet what would our world be without his work.
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Old 31st January 2013, 12:09 AM   #70
morinix is offline morinix  United States
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This brings me around to my final (I think) closing remarks about Hovland.

The guys at Hovland were truly dedicated to audio. They started innocently enough rebuilding/modifying gear that Bob had knowledge of. Then they made the Musicap and used that money to fuel their epic preamp endeavor. The constant tweaking/audition cycle with Bob's circuit knowledge and Mike's magical skills lead them down a strange path that Mike's ego was quick to digest then regurgitate a dish of self genuflection that was just too irresistible for the others not to share in like gorging swines.

But hey, put yourself in their shoes. If you were getting accolades from the trade publications, and selling healthy numbers of capacitors and tonearm wire and whatever else; Would you be the one to stand up and say "Let me off this ship"? I don't think any of us would if our pockets kept getting filled with cash.
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Last edited by morinix; 31st January 2013 at 12:27 AM.
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