breaking in audio capacitors - Page 20

john curl · 10th December 2012, 12:53 AM

Thanks for the link to tomchr's site. It led me to getting the complete manuals for my HP3563, which did not come with the unit.
I seriously doubt that you will be able to measure 'break-in' with any available test equipment. It is just too limited, even though the ear seems to detect it.

aardvarkash10 · 10th December 2012, 01:19 AM

or, just as a basic lets see test, how about an input to your sound card and record the "unbroken in" signal.

Wave whatever esoteric timeframe you want over the DUT, then repeat the above.

Subtract the second signal from the first and see if there is any significant (key word) difference...

Rinse and repeat.

Enter argument about the lack of resolution of sound cards and the horror of digitisation at this point.

SY · 10th December 2012, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by john curl

I seriously doubt that you will be able to measure 'break-in' with any available test equipment. It is just too limited, even though the ear seems to detect it.

"There's a dragon in my garage."

sofaspud · 10th December 2012, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by john curl

If you are going to break barriers, it is best to not be told what is impossible. '-)
and
I seriously doubt that you will be able to measure 'break-in' with any available test equipment. It is just too limited, even though the ear seems to detect it.

I had to point it out, but really can't think of anything to add. Or needs to be.

I only know him from this forum, but I like John C, even if some of his methodology make me tilt my head to the side and wrinkle my brow.

astouffer · 10th December 2012, 03:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by john curl

I seriously doubt that you will be able to measure 'break-in' with any available test equipment. It is just too limited, even though the ear seems to detect it.

We have equipment that can see and manipulate individual atoms to equipment that can see billions of light years into the universe. You're going to tell me nobody is capable of documenting this phenomenon that only a handful of people with golden ears can vouch for?

If you feel our equipment is too limited, then do you have any suggestions as to what would be required?

john curl · 10th December 2012, 03:58 AM

There is no 'money' in making these sorts of measurements, so they are not made, at least in the audio realm. The equipment cost is too much, AND even if we made these measurements, some have, we are told that the results are faked or poorly gotten. You can't win, except to listen for yourself.

aardvarkash10 · 10th December 2012, 07:27 AM

lolz.

There would be HUGE money in making these measurements. As long as they confirmed a positive effect. It would certainly be cheaper than the marketing ******** and spin that passes for customer enlightenment in the relevant magazines.

The equipment already exists, and there are labs enough to do it, if asked.

All it lacks is will.

And integrity.

radiotron · 10th December 2012, 07:47 AM

So does this mean we can measure capacitor break-in, that given suitable apparatus, it is possible? Logically, the next step is to define the apparatus required to duplicate audible results with scientific results, I'm interested to know how this could be done.

dewets · 10th December 2012, 08:16 AM

Can you buy snake-oil?
I'd like 5 liters please to submerse the audio caps in prior to soldering them in place...

freax · 10th December 2012, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dewets

Can you buy snake-oil?
I'd like 5 liters please to submerse the audio caps in prior to soldering them in place...

Oh no, you must pay for snake oil by the ounce or millilitre:

SNAKE OIL - WIN IN COURT PROTECTION HELP MONEY PROBLEMS SPELL Wicca Witch Goth | eBay

10th December 2012, 01:19 AM	#192
aardvarkash10 diyAudio Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Auckland, NZ	or, just as a basic lets see test, how about an input to your sound card and record the "unbroken in" signal. Wave whatever esoteric timeframe you want over the DUT, then repeat the above. Subtract the second signal from the first and see if there is any significant (key word) difference... Rinse and repeat. Enter argument about the lack of resolution of sound cards and the horror of digitisation at this point. __________________ "Folks, you can't prove truthiness with information. You prove truthiness with more truthiness. In a process known as truthinessiness." - Stephen Colbert, The Colbert Report

10th December 2012, 07:27 AM	#197
aardvarkash10 diyAudio Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Auckland, NZ	lolz. There would be HUGE money in making these measurements. As long as they confirmed a positive effect. It would certainly be cheaper than the marketing ******** and spin that passes for customer enlightenment in the relevant magazines. The equipment already exists, and there are labs enough to do it, if asked. All it lacks is will. And integrity. __________________ "Folks, you can't prove truthiness with information. You prove truthiness with more truthiness. In a process known as truthinessiness." - Stephen Colbert, The Colbert Report

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10th December 2012, 12:53 AM	#191
john curl diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: berkeley ca	Thanks for the link to tomchr's site. It led me to getting the complete manuals for my HP3563, which did not come with the unit. I seriously doubt that you will be able to measure 'break-in' with any available test equipment. It is just too limited, even though the ear seems to detect it.

10th December 2012, 03:58 AM	#196
john curl diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: berkeley ca	There is no 'money' in making these sorts of measurements, so they are not made, at least in the audio realm. The equipment cost is too much, AND even if we made these measurements, some have, we are told that the results are faked or poorly gotten. You can't win, except to listen for yourself.

10th December 2012, 07:47 AM	#198
radiotron diyAudio Member Join Date: May 2007	So does this mean we can measure capacitor break-in, that given suitable apparatus, it is possible? Logically, the next step is to define the apparatus required to duplicate audible results with scientific results, I'm interested to know how this could be done.

10th December 2012, 08:16 AM	#199
dewets diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Somerset West, South Africa	Can you buy snake-oil? I'd like 5 liters please to submerse the audio caps in prior to soldering them in place...