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Old 7th December 2012, 06:59 PM   #101
DF96 is offline DF96  England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john curl
Well said, bcm.
Interesting comment. I just assumed that Bob was just having a laugh, mentioning capacitor break-in in the same post as the 'little blue people' who visit him. Perhaps he should ask them how to make better capacitors?
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:06 PM   #102
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I'm sorry if I ruffled your feathers. But I happen to be one of these weird fact based individuals who believe in the scientific process.
How can I consider you sincere if you try, by comparison, to say that I don't trust the scientific process?

It's not what happened:

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Originally Posted by tomchr View Post
Usually the individuals who claim results are the same individuals who modified the circuit or they make money from selling what they claim caused the improvement in sound quality.
You generalize accusing subjectivists to have an economical interest....

Nothing to do with scientific process.

BTW I support too the scientific process.

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You can't possibly be serious. We are talking about circuit changes that may/may not result in a change in the subjective perception of the sound quality. How are we to test this fairly without applying a double-blind test?
I'm not refusing blind tests at all, I'm saying that almost all DBTs are designed and conducted by skepticals with the intention to prove there are no differences...

During the test design phase researcher's bias can lead to a test made to disprove differences... by design.
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:14 PM   #103
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I'm not refusing blind tests at all, I'm saying that almost all DBTs are designed and conducted by skepticals with the intention to prove there are no differences...
Could that be because the gullibles refuse to conduct (or even participate in) DBTs to demonstrate that there are differences? Note that some DBTs do show differences, or at least the ability to distinguish, but in some cases it turns out that this is due to incidental clues such as switching clicks or background noise level.
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:25 PM   #104
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Could that be because the gullibles refuse to conduct (or even participate in) DBTs to demonstrate that there are differences?
What a subtle and polite way to say that subjectivists are gullibles...
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:29 PM   #105
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Use of the name 'skepticals' is loaded with assumptions too.
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:30 PM   #106
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Use of the name 'skepticals' is loaded with assumptions too.
Maybe but skeptical it's not an insult
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:35 PM   #107
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It could be interpreted as such, subjectively.
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:36 PM   #108
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It could be interpreted as such, subjectively.
Are you serious?
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:37 PM   #109
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Why not stick to the usual labels of objectivists and subjectivists? People argue about them, but at least most of us know what they mean and they are fairly neutral and descriptive.
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Old 7th December 2012, 07:38 PM   #110
SY is offline SY  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaveFremen View Post
What a subtle and polite way to say that subjectivists are gullibles...
If you define "subjectivist" as someone who insists on doing controlled evaluations by ear, I would say that they're the opposite of gullible. They are hard-nosed realists. If "subjectivists" is defined as people who refuse to test their own perceptions and validate extraordinary claims, believing that they're somehow beyond the restrictions of the human brain, then "gullible" is apt.

I have ranted before about the false dichotomy of "subjective" versus "objective."

In any case, this is WAY off topic, so let's put that aside and stick to actual data regarding claims of capacitor break-in.
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