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Old 22nd June 2012, 02:21 PM   #11
geraldfryjr is offline geraldfryjr  United States
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Jackson,michigan
Thank you ,Zenith !!
I figure that the 403 is the main chassis number and is what I do remember from the sams photophact that I did have.

I can make a new film as I have a scanner that can do films and I guess I better get on it soon!

Trying to compile all of the frequency's and call letters of the time is going to be quite a chore as I have already tried to do this.
All of the pieces were still there the last time I checked ,but it has been a long while since then.

The knobs I can recreate as I have seen pictures of them from time to time.

And some where I had seen a print of the film but I have no idea as to where it can be found now as many websites from the late very late 90's and up to 2006 are now defunct and gone.

Even though I will have to cut in some veneer in the real bad spot on the front panel it will only be a thin strip so it won't be that bad and should blend in so that it doesn't look like a hack job.
I have put much thought into this.

Yes, I very much agree that it will be well worth the effort.
And yes the speaker is a field coil type.
That is why it was so important the I had the right plate winding voltage.


Last edited by geraldfryjr; 22nd June 2012 at 02:37 PM.
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Old 22nd June 2012, 02:27 PM   #12
geraldfryjr is offline geraldfryjr  United States
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Originally Posted by Mr. Zenith View Post
Is it this one?

Depending on the manufacturer, the model number is usually more important than the chassis number when initially looking for a schematic in the Rider's manuals. The simple reason is that many manufacturers used the same chassis for multiple models. To make matters even more confusing, many of the models sold by the big catalog stores (Sears & Roebuck, Montgomery-Ward, etc) were actually made by some of the smaller radio companies who themselves sold their own product lines. Sparks-Noblitt and Stewart-Warner are two such makes that spring to mind.

Once the appropriate Riders schematic is found, there is usually a chassis number (or number(s) shown as a secondary identifier to help eliminate confusion.

Restoration of the movie dial celluloid is possible, but it's sort of a specialty procedure. Restoration of the electronics is more straightforward, even given the damage from your more youthful antics. It's definitely a set worth keeping! Once the schematic is found, you can suss out the voltages and buy a suitable power transformer. Just beware that the speaker magnet is actually the choke coil for the power supply...
OMG !!!!!

Yes,Yes it is that one, exactly !!!

Thank You So Very Much!!!!!!!!


P.S. The inside label used to be there but it has now disintegrated.

Last edited by geraldfryjr; 22nd June 2012 at 02:30 PM.
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Old 22nd June 2012, 03:09 PM   #13
Mr_Zenith is offline Mr_Zenith  United States
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Antique radio info
No prob, just glad I could help!

Now as for the "Movie Dial" celluloid, only you can make the call as to what shape it's in, or whether or not to scan and restore. I can tell you that if it's substantially intact, you may be better off leaving it alone. However if you're feeling a bit of that youthful exuberance beginning to resurface, I can offer you several points of advice.

  1. Determine which side of the film the emulsion is on (IIRC it's on the inside of the celluloid cylinder, but I may be wrong). This will help you avoid touching it as you remove it from the dial drum rings. In fact, it's a good idea to wear latex or nitrile gloves when performing any work on the movie dial drum.
  2. If the emulsion is indeed on the inside, gently place a small piece of masking tape over the outside of the celluloid overlap. This will keep the celluloid from "sproinging" out during the next step. The original celluloid is crimped in place by the upper and lower rings, and there's no good way to loosen or remove the crimps without destroying them. You'll need these rings to reconstruct the drum assembly later on.
  3. Using a single-edged razor blade, gently slice off the celluloid at the top ring, then the lower ring. Leave the tape in place for now.
  4. Obtain two new and unused sheets of acetate (the kind used for overhead projectors). Carefully remove the masking tape and gently place the original celluloid between the two acetate sheets.

You are now ready to scan them to your heart's content (with a flatbed scanner, of course!). Edit any flaws in the scan using Photoshop or the like, making sure to add a little extra to account for the film that was cut off when removing the original. Have the new image laser-printed on 4-mil single-sided mylar film. Remember to have the image printed backwards on the matte side of the film; in other words, you should be able to read the stations correctly when looking at the mylar's shiny side. Cut out the new dial, remount it inside the original rings (shiny-side out), and reinstall.

There's a nice restoration writeup of an old battery-powered (farm) set here. Pay particular attention to the pictures of the drum assembly, as it will give you a sneak preview of what you're dealing with!


Last edited by Mr_Zenith; 22nd June 2012 at 03:13 PM.
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Old 22nd June 2012, 05:33 PM   #14
geraldfryjr is offline geraldfryjr  United States
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Yes, Thank you for the tips.

I pretty much know what I am up against that is why I haven't messed with it yet until I can be totally dedicated to it until it is finished.

The problem with the Film drum is that that film is so brittle that a piece or a few piece's has broken off.
I am not sure if a mouse has caused this or not.
Or if it is from it getting knocked by something or even when I had put the chassis back in its case.
But it was like that the last time I had carefully taken the chassis out to examine its condition.

Since then I have not messed with it and I left the pieces in side of the drum.
My biggest fear is if whether or not a mouse has gotten in there and ate any of the pieces !!
I will be dragging it out some time this summer to evaluate the situation.

I have a Gemini D16 flat bed scanner that has a Negative scanning top on it so that wont be a problem.
Hopefully the film won't be so brittle that it will shatter to dust as I try to remove it from the drum and flatten it out to be scanned.

I will probably make a hand drawn hard copy before hand of the call signs and frequency's just in case.

I could power up the light and use one of my little video camera's to copy the screen with as I turn the drum in order to get what is left first.
At least I would have most of it, should a have to recreate one from scratch.

The print is quite small and can only be read with a magnifying glass.

Like I said it is going to be a long and grueling process !!!

I will start a thread on it when I do get to it as I'm sure that it is going to be a very interesting experience !!!!

Again, Thank you very much for that link of the picture of it, It is exactly how it looked only it was much better when I first got it.

I had almost refinished it when I had got it and I am glad that I didn't, now that I know more about antiques.
But at this point I am going to have to now as a lot of the curved pieces are lifted and peeled from the base wood.
But at least they are not broke off or anything as the whole frame is quite weak in its current state.
The shellac has darkened quite considerably as well since first I got it.
It used to be much lighter like that in the picture, in fact may be even a little lighter than that.

This has gotten me really excited now !!!!He,he,he,he
But, I will take my time and the utmost care when I am ready to dive into this project.

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Old 22nd June 2012, 05:40 PM   #15
geraldfryjr is offline geraldfryjr  United States
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I once saw I picture of it in an Antique radio guide in the mid 80's and it was listed around $200 to $400 back then.
I am not sure but I think I saw a website recently in the last few years that it could be worth something in the $1200 range.
To me the thing is Absolutely Priceless !!!!!

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