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Old 8th February 2013, 10:17 PM   #71
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IslandPink, please report once you test the ZN's!
Thorsten Loesch recommend mundorf ZN's for best price/performance capacitor. :

'' Above the budget region I take Mundorf/Audyn/SCR Tinfoil types as
being "sane cost & high performance"

Last edited by murphythecat8; 8th February 2013 at 10:24 PM.
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:42 AM   #72
popilin is offline popilin  Argentina
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It is an established scientific fact that Gold Foil - Snake Oil capacitors reduce noise and distortion to almost immeasurable levels.

Using the multipole expansion, and the addition theorem of spherical harmonics, it can be demonstrated that the noise and distortion remain only on one plate of the capacitor, due to the unique Quantum properties of Gold-Snake Oil combination.

I'm poor, and I must settle for 0.03% of the MKTs, or 0.01% of the MKPs...
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Old 9th February 2013, 09:31 AM   #73
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Dear Popilin you know how caps are build ?
caps are resistor and induttance at the same time , and this with capacity vary with frequency
you know why there are condenser microphony?

russian teflon ft2-ft3 are cheaper

no 0.01 on caps at last 1% and you will need only for RIAA
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Old 9th February 2013, 04:48 PM   #74
popilin is offline popilin  Argentina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicoch58 View Post
Dear Popilin you know how caps are build ?
caps are resistor and induttance at the same time , and this with capacity vary with frequency
you know why there are condenser microphony?

russian teflon ft2-ft3 are cheaper

no 0.01 on caps at last 1% and you will need only for RIAA
Neglecting edge effects, we can obtain a reasonable approximation to the value of capacitance C.
For two parallel plane plates of area A separated by a distance d, filled with a dielectric medium of dielectric constant ε, from Maxwell's equations

∇.D = 4πρ

D = ε E

Integrating in a volume V

∇.D dV = ∮D.ds = D A = ε E A = ∫4πρ dV = 4πQ

Then

E = (4πQ) / (ε A)

Also

E = - φ = dφ/dx

Integrating

Δφ = ∫dφ = E ∫dx = E d

By definition

C = Q/Δφ

Then

C = (ε A) / (4πd)

In a real capacitor, influence both, dielectric and geometry.
However, R leakage depends strongly on dielectric, and ESL on geometry.
That is why a vulgar multifoil chip capacitor, MKT or MKP, can minimize ESL and ESR.

Microphony

Valve Amplifiers - Morgan Jones - Google Libros

That is why if you use an easily compressible dielectric as teflon, Russians, cleverly placed one second rigid shield.

THD

The values ​​given were measured in laboratories of elektor magazine in the 80s.

If your ears can differentiate between 0.01% and 0.03%, good for you !
But if you tell me the super duper gold foil snake oil may exceed these levels/sound better, I would say that the amplifier design is sub optimal.
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Last edited by popilin; 9th February 2013 at 05:15 PM.
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Old 9th February 2013, 05:02 PM   #75
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You can make your own film capacitors with kitchen aluminum foil and oil-soaked paper. It will sound better than some very expensive capacitors.
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Old 9th February 2013, 07:55 PM   #76
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And resistor from pencil HB
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Old 9th February 2013, 10:18 PM   #77
popilin is offline popilin  Argentina
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I think both extremes are bad, following this line of reasoning, we end by proposing an amplifier made from coconuts, as Gilligan's Island.

There is also the risk that someday they offer "Audio Grade HB Graphite Resistors" at astronomical prices.


Can not be denied that the quality of all the components used influences the final result.
If the difference is negligible, and even sometimes subjective, is well, and we can continue to feed the myth that money can buy everything.
If you put a super duper Gold Foil Snake Oil capacitor, and the sound improves to the point of exclaiming "wow ! that good capacitor !" check your design.
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Old 10th February 2013, 12:06 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by popilin View Post
There is also the risk that someday they offer "Audio Grade HB Graphite Resistors" at astronomical prices.
duelund resistor I thinks .....

Not for sissies diy GRAPHITE RESISTORS
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Old 10th February 2013, 12:19 AM   #79
popilin is offline popilin  Argentina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicoch58 View Post
duelund resistor I thinks .....


Quote:
Originally Posted by nicoch58 View Post
Not for sissies diy GRAPHITE RESISTORS
Amazing ! Definitely not for sissies.
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Old 20th February 2013, 06:19 PM   #80
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Apologies for breaking into the Duelund thread again to report on Mundorfs !
I can report the current Mundorf ZN's ( Tin/polyprop ) are proving to be excellent after about 15 -20 hrs running . This test is on the output of a phono amp at line-level signal.
They are significantly better than the old Audyn KP-SN to my ears . The tonal balance is better , sound a bit warmer than the slightly cold and bright character of the KP-SN. They have useful extra tone in the upper bass without losing anything elsewhere .
The top end is more refined without the slightly edgy character of the KP-SN .
They have excellent realism and 'immediacy' on well-recorded instruments and voices.
They seem to be overall a bit more classy and with more tonal colour in the mids, than the Audyn 'True copper' which I tested recently .
From my memory of the Mundorf silver/oils , I would say the ZN's would 'wipe the floor' with the silver/oils in bass and midrange tone, but the silver/oils might have just have a little more upper treble resolution .

Now someone needs to compare to the Duelunds !
( however whatever the result, the ZN's are an extraordinary bargain )
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