5654 (6ak5) line stage in triode mode - diyAudio
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Old 25th November 2010, 10:29 PM   #1
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Default 5654 (6ak5) line stage in triode mode

Finally I decided to start projecting a new line stage with 5654, unfortunately Iíve got 35 of this tubes and in Naples the garbage collection is a main problem now soÖ Iíve to use them!!! Moreover this is the first time for me and Iím sure that 35 tubes are not enough before i get the goal. Therefore I need some help from you , this is the schema Iíve designed, please give it a look and give me any useful correction and/or suggestion.

Thanks
Francesco
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Old 26th November 2010, 10:09 AM   #2
euro21 is online now euro21  Hungary
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Try this operating point.
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Old 26th November 2010, 10:13 AM   #3
SY is offline SY  United States
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Do you actually need gain in your linestage? Most people don't.

A 0.1uF output cap will cause bass rolloff unless the load is really, really high impedance. I'd use a cap at least ten times larger.
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Old 26th November 2010, 11:19 AM   #4
euro21 is online now euro21  Hungary
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Default 6AK5 CF

No gain.
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Old 26th November 2010, 11:28 AM   #5
DF96 is offline DF96  England
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The 6AK5 was designed for low noise amplification of low-level VHF/UHF signals. Audio distortion was not a consideration. Triode connection will help, but I would not use it for a line stage without cathode degeneration. In fact, I would not use it for a line stage at all. However, you are likely to get lots of second-order distortion so it may sound "warm".
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Old 26th November 2010, 05:54 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by euro21 View Post
Try this operating point.
Hello,
Does your Spice program do FFT outputs to show distortion?
The 0.16% noted in the attachment is not lots of distortion.
Your selection of operating point looks like it should work well.
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Old 26th November 2010, 07:01 PM   #7
euro21 is online now euro21  Hungary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DualTriode View Post
Does your Spice program do FFT outputs to show distortion?
LTSpice.
Run this SPICE directive for THD logging:

.option plotwinsize=0
.param period=1m, ncycles=100
;tran 0 {ncycles*period} {(ncycles/2)*period} {period/1e4}
.four {1/period} 9 -1 V(Out)


View Fourier components /9 harmonics/ of V(Out) in SPICE Error Log.
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Old 26th November 2010, 07:27 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DF96 View Post
The 6AK5 was designed for low noise amplification of low-level VHF/UHF signals.
So?

Quote:
Audio distortion was not a consideration.
It wasn't a consideration for the design of the vast, vast, vast majority of VT types out there. Even those types that have the rep for sonic excellence, such as the 6SN7, were designed for other purposes. Just essssssss-loads of 6SN7s were used in early radar sets and the first electronic computers. 6SN7s also showed up as vertical deflection oscillators/amps in TV sets, eventually resulting in the 6SN7GTB, with hardened control grids to stand up to positive Vgk operation, and with the plate dissipation raised from 3.5W to 5W as TV screens grew larger.

The 6BQ7 was another type designed for use as a VHF small signal amp (good to 300MHz) with absolutely zero audio pretense, as this type of operation is never mentioned in the spec sheet for the type. Well, guess what? They sound great in the right applications.

That old reliable audio work horse, the 6AU6, was originally intended for use as an RF amp.

How any one specific type sounds has more to do with loadlines and application, rather than for what it was originally designed. Some RF types, large signal/small signal, can sound great; some will sound like Click the image to open in full size. no matter what you do.

Other specialized types that have no audio pretensions (e.g. horizontal deflection types -- 6BQ6GTA sound just as good as the famous 6V6, and put out twice the power: no audio operating points mentioned in the spec sheet) can work just fine. Finding these audio "sleepers" is well worth it since they aren't audiophool expensive (yet).

Worth a try.
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Old 27th November 2010, 12:44 PM   #9
DF96 is offline DF96  England
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A line stage can expect to see 100's of mV coming in, maybe up to 2V from CD. A 6AK5 will struggle with that amount of input signal, as the window between grid current and cutoff is quite narrow. As I said, triode connection will help. With other more robust valves you can just increase the anode volts to widen the input window, but as the 6AK5 is a UHF valve it has limited voltage capability. It has small clearances in order to reduce transit time. As far as I can see the only valid reason to use one in a line stage is that it is all you have available.

The 6AU6/EF94 has audio uses specifically mentioned in some data sheets e.g. Lorenz.

Most general-purpose valves can be used for audio. Valves developed for a specific RF application are sometimes less useful for audio, unless you like listening to the second-order distortion created by remote-cutoff (for example). RF valves, intended for small-signal inputs, can usefully be used for similar applications in audio (e.g. MM input). I might consider using the 6AK5 as a phono input, but not a line stage.
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Old 27th November 2010, 06:18 PM   #10
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Hello,
The 6AK5 triode connected plate curves look like it can be biased for 2 volt input to me.
http://www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/f...138/5/5654.pdf (see the last page)
The 6J4 also designed for mV RF input duty has quite a following as a driver tube in the Darling amplifier. Also remember the 6DJ8 began its career as a cascode RF amplifier as well, then the data sheets were changed to keep up.
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